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Thread: Realistic Expectations for Cast Boolits

  1. #41
    Boolit Master
    Bullshop's Avatar
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    What do you mean by expectations? You mean like cash back, or bonus flying miles, or free long distance minutes or sumthin like that?
    Dang !!! I didnt know I was sposed ta have expectations, I thought I was just havin fun! Now ya went and ruined it for me
    I started huntin and shootin cuz thats the way I was brought up. I wanted to shoot more cuz its fun. I started loading so I could have more fun for the $ then started casting for the same reason. I started sellin boolits to get the money for the stuff I couldnt make, primers, brass, and powder.
    What I expect is the same level of fun no matter what collor the booilt/bullet is. There is no reason to accept or expect a lower level of accuracy from any gun because it its shooting a boolit and not a bullet.
    The loads will likely be different but the material the projectile is made from is not what determans how accurate a fire arm will be.
    If I were to have an expectation it would be that I can expect to have to PUT IN MY TIME with any gun in load development, and tuning of the arm and ammo to include casting perfection to achieve an acceptable level of performance to satisfy my needs with that particular arm.
    BIC/BS

  2. #42
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    I waited to see what would shake out when this finally died. I was surprised to see that everyone thought I was talking about bullets and shooting. Nobody even mentioned their expectations for this board or the catagories.

    There is definately a long term trend for casting to be cheap. Cheap to shoot more or just cheap all together. That was the nature of things 50, 40, 30 years ago and it remains so today. So I doubt that will ever change.

    What is encouraging is to read and see the willingness of folks to consider and use cast for hunting. Especially amongst those that are quiet for other posting. I wonder how much credit for that can go to the board / site?

    While not a lot of people mentioned long range or competitions, I never really exected them too. Competition is something that is not really advanced by this group. And the people that do tend to be secretive about what they find that works for them. Nature of the beast. And .... there are other places for that too.

    But I see people continuously helping people. Why even professional casters helping the competition. Not sure that would happen too many other places.

    I want to use this opportunity to thank those that dedicate their time and put forth an effort here every day so that what ever floats your boat, can. Whether that be moderators or anything else that we take for granted. Thanks guys for an opportunity to advance what I find interesting in this world. Much appreciated.

  3. #43
    On Heaven's Range

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    These last two posts from Bullshop and Bass have nailed it down for me.

    Further words from me would be a waste of space.

    VERY well said, gentlemen!!
    Regards from BruceB in Nevada

    "The .30'06 is never a mistake." - Colonel Townsend Whelen

  4. #44
    Boolit Grand Master



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    Quote Originally Posted by Bass Ackward View Post
    While not a lot of people mentioned long range or competitions, I never really exected them too. Competition is something that is not really advanced by this group. And the people that do tend to be secretive about what they find that works for them. Nature of the beast. And .... there are other places for that too.
    Bass Ackward, I agree with most of what you said except this paragraph. 200 meter handgun silhouette is the majority of my shooting and I "only" shoot cast and have done so with championship winning master class scores at times. I pass on any and all casting info that I can to anyone that will listen. NO secrets here, better competition will only serve to make me work harder at it and learn more.

    Oh, one more thing. Saving money? I have yet to cast a bullet to save money. I could shoot condom bullets for the next few years for what I have invested in casting equipment. I cast to make it with my own two hands and make it work.

    My expectations? No wussy cast bullet loads in my long range handguns and some of my rifles. If it won't shoot condom load data or better I did something wrong and its time to start over from scratch and make it shoot. I expect the accuracy, momentum and velocity that I loaded the round to do.


    Rick
    "The people never give up their freedom . . . Except under some delusion." Edmund Burke

    "Let us remember that if we suffer tamely a lawless attack on our liberty, we encourage it." Samuel Adams

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  5. #45
    Boolit Master



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    Cool

    I fell into casting some years ago to "save money and shoot more".

    I found that I am spending more money and shooting less! I cannot believe all the tools, dies, molds and other shooting stuff I have accumulated over the last 15 years. It represents thousands of dollars.

    I have fallen into the trap. I love casting boolits. I have bought molds and made boolits for which I have no weapon. I found myself saving brass for calibers for which I have no guns. Then I go out and get the guns to match the boolits for which I have molds and cases. It goes around and around.

    I recently backed into a deal for .303 SMLE. The gun was cheap. Then I had to have reloading dies, boolits molds and cases to go with it. That costs bucks.

    I load .32's for my buddy's 327 Magnum
    Cast and load to feed my .30 Carbine Ruger
    Cast and load for .303 SMLE
    Cast and load .223 for my CZ 527
    Cast and load .266 for my Sweede Mauser
    I have one .38 Revolter, two 357 Mag revolters, a 45 Colt revolter, two .45 ACP pistols and two 9 MM Pistols.

    I just went out and spent over $2,000 for a good quality gun safe to keep these toys in. It never stops.

    I blame it on this forum. That's right 45 Nut, Buckshot and all the rest of you guys...you have me addicted....I have the fever.....If I am not casting or reloading then I am on the computer learning more about it and getting further addicted.

    I don't even have time to go the range and shoot this stuff off. When I get there all I want to do is to empty the casings so I can fill them again.....IT IS A SICKNESS
    AND I DO NOT WANT IT TO STOP.....I AM INCURABLE.......
    Pax Nobiscum Dan (Crash) Corrigan

    Currently casting, reloading and shooting: 223 Rem, 6.5x55 Sweede, 30 Carbine, 30-06 Springfield, 30-30 WCF, 303 Brit., 7.62x39, 7.92x57 Mauser, .32 Long, 32 H&R Mag, 327 Fed Mag, 380 ACP. 9x19, 38 Spcl, 357 Mag, 38-55 Win, 41 Mag, 44 Spcl., 44 Mag, 45 Colt, 45 ACP, 454 Casull, 457 RB for ROA and 50-90 Sharps. Shooting .22 LR & 12 Gauge seldom and buying ammo for same.

  6. #46
    Boolit Grand Master


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    Well I started casting with the purchase of my.45 muzzle loader in 1974. My dad told me that was the only way to have round boolits to launch. I did not know any better. Then there came a .357 Dan Wesson that shot cast so well I bought a mold for that. As a weapon was added .. whatever caliber... it was just natural to get another mold... another sizer die...
    As time went along reading Reloader Magazine I realised I was just beginning into the wonderful world of investigating the Real World of Accurate Lead Boolits.
    To me there just is not any reason to get into shooting without lead. If a .243 wont do the job then I move up through the power sceptrum... .30.. .375... 45... 50 and finally "ol Thumper" .685 ! I have not seen anything anyone of those lead Boolits cannot permanently discombluberate ! ( I have not seen a Blue Whale yet )

  7. #47
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    To be honest, I had no expectations when I first started reading here. Now I think the expectations I have for myself and cast boolits is for fun and enjoyment. As for the website/forum, I feel this is the best shooting/reloading/boolit casting site on the web. The primary reason, the members. I have learned a lot both online and off from members. The main vein of all of the conversations and threads are of congeniality and helpfulness. If that changed, I'd likely not come back to this site on an almost daily basis as I do now. You guys have put a lot of fun back into shooting for me and I thank one and all for that. You also caused me to spend money (a lot less with cast boolits) that I wouldn't have spent otherwise. I think I thank you for that too. Doubt that SWMBO agrees, but that's my cross to bear.

    My expectations for the use of cast boolits? Well I have already found that a 2" group from most rifles is definitely do-able. I have found better accuracy with cast in a few of my handguns. Accuracy in my rifles has been mixed but always fun. I have learned that casting, size, hardness and velocity are all factors that must be considered. I Definitely have achieved hunting accuracy in all of the rifles I have tried cast boolits in so far. I still shoot my high velocity varmit jword varmit rounds, but even that is being affected by this cast fever. NOW I have plans for a 300 yard target to clang metal with several of my cast loads

    In essense, I'd have to say I have gained far more from than I have given to the forum, and it has exceeded all of my expectations. A fine site made that way by its members. I'm proud to have the company of you all.

    Edd
    Charter member Michigan liars club!

    "The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in Government." -- Thomas Jefferson

    "Consider the clown(s) just one of God's little nettles in the woods, don't let it detract from the beauty. Sooner or latter you are going to run into the nettles regardless of how careful you are."

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  8. #48
    Moderator Emeritus/Boolit Master in Heavens Range
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    Great Expectations eh? Might make a good book title. But you aren't alone! I got into casting to save money and shoot more too. And in addition to the same woes you recite, I am hidden on three sides by floor to ceiling bookcases, and they aren't empty either! I have over two and ahlaf feet of Handloader magazines alone. Not to mention all the Gun digests except for a couple of the very first. Not to mention ...

    Molly
    Regards,

    Molly

    "The remedy for evil men is not the abrogation of the rights of law abiding citizens. The remedy for evil men is the gallows." Thomas Jefferson

  9. #49
    In Remembrance - Super Moderator & Official Cast Boolits Sketch Artist

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    Well after reading these post I see that nobody said anything about if you have a 357 pistol it only makes sense to have a 357 rifle so then your 44 has to have its big brother. I got that now iam looking for the matchs to the other firearms. I do make a effort not to go to gunshows and gunshops because i always seem to find something I got to have. Like the other day I stopped at the gunstore to check to see if they needed more shot which is my partners job and picked up a 45acp after it was paid for the clerk showed me a 45LC rifle I somehow got that one too now i got to have a pistol or two to go with it.
    Reloading to save money I am sure the saving is going to start soon

  10. #50
    Boolit Buddy
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    Economics and fun are right up there, but seldom do I come to this board ( and that's EVERY DAY multiple times) and not LEARNED something!!! So I guess I have to put education up there with the rest. Although I have cast boolits in the past for a number of years, I was just melting down swaged boolits and recasting them in a H&G 68. The swaged ones were so dirty and not as accurate at the H&G 68 boolits. Now I'm using ww's and any lead I can get my hands on so the education I have gotten here is beyond measure. I never before worried about casting temp ( now I do), I never worried about lube, used what ever I could get ( now I do), never worrried about what my barrel slugged at...( now I really do). So I thank all of you for the knowledge you have so generously shared with me as well as the rest of the people on this great board...
    Here's to ya'll......

    Jack
    When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.
    “The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.

    Thomas Jefferson was one Smart guy. Now we need to find another one!!!
    NRA Life member since 1971, SASS
    Ret. IAFF Local 2928

  11. #51
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    This year is my 40th as a bullet caster. Dang how time flies! I originally started when a college student, and cast so I could afford to shoot. I was getting WW's for free, and powder and primers were cheap enough even I could afford them. When I wasn't working, in class or studying, I was casting and loading. I shot about 35,000 rds. my last year in college, and that was just in .45 ACP and .44 mag.

    In the beginning, it was a cost/cheapness thing.

    Since then, I've slowly increased my expectations from my cast bullets, but I never really expected too terrible much from them until I found this forum. Now, I'm going to be trying some real accuracy/power stuff and see how far I can go with it with several of my guns.

    I can also forsee the possibility that we MAY, just possibly, be limited ONLY to what we can produce for ourselves in the future, so ... I guess you could say that it's also a factor against some real possibilities that none of us want to consider or talk about, but which cannot be rationally discounted out of hand.

    Casting is a lot like shooting, or at least being a really top quality rifleman: it's a pursuit that can last a lifetime, keep me out'a too much trouble (hopefully), and keep me puzzled just enough to keep it interesting for the rest of my days. That ain't no small thang, boys!

  12. #52
    Cast Boolits Owner



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    WOW!

    Where do I start? In the beginning I had no expectations. Being young I never thought a cast boolit could ever equal much less exceed the performance of a jacketed. One day while on vacation with my dad he ask me what I thought of casting boolits? I shot a strange look as I ask him how could they be better than jacketed? His response pretty much was "up until about 100 years ago, everything was cast". Then preceeded to tell me of the great buffalo slaughters and how they were accomplished with cast boolits. This got me thinking. A few years later he gave me my first sizer and let me use his moulds. That is when I joined the first board. I bought a lee pot (still have it), collected ww's then went to work making bullets. In the beginning it was handgun stuff. I was shooting about 500 rounds of 45 ACP per week. Next thing you know here we are 15 or so years later. I have about 200 boolit moulds (160 cataloged moulds & about 40 more that are yet to be cataloged), 4 presses, 3 lube sizers, about 100 size dies, a large bag of top punches, a few tons of lead, some type metal, about 40 lbs of bullet lube (thanks Dad, Lar and Woody44) and about a gazillion gator checks. I am addicted to this hobby to put it lightly. I have tons of books that I constantly read over and over. I have finally figured out that guns are machinery. They work OK from the factory for the average user but for those that are willing to "tune" them (bedding, triggers, sights) they will shoot better. The secret to getting the best accuracy out of them is getting a boolit that fits the chamber. You can find jacketed bullets that are ok but to get the "perfect" boolit you have to cast it. Now I expect nothing but the best from my guns. I have learned a lot on the our boards (the 2 previous and this one). I am sure I will continue to learn.

    Thanks Dad for getting me into this and giving me gear, thanks Ken for giving me a home on our board and thanks to the members for sharing their knowlegde.

    R.
    "The only way to deal with an unfree world is to become so absolutely free that your very existence is an act of rebellion."
    - Albert Camus -

  13. #53
    Boolit Man dukenukum's Avatar
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    I poured my first boolit when I was twelve and got into center fire rifles , my late father had more molds for any ten people . just keeping alive the family tradition .
    http://adventuresinopencarr.blogspot.com/
    even my cat has a gun
    Trust in GOD and the Mauser.

  14. #54
    Boolit Master on Heaven's Range
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    I started to cast for economic reasons but have found it to be a hobby itself. Now I'm reloading and casting as much for the fun as for the ammo (well, almost!)....Bill
    "HMMMM.........It wasn't spos'ta do THAT!"

  15. #55
    Boolit Buddy AzShooter's Avatar
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    Casting is definately not cheap. Consider the cost of a decent pot or two, a good sizer and sizing dies, a variety of molds, the cost of reloading equipment etc.

    But casting is very relaxing. No one is allowed to bother me when I cast or reload. I can also cast enough in one session to last a match or two which is all I do each month now.

    For my rifles, I cast to find out what will work best in them. Shooting Mosin Nagants, each one is different, as are all rifles, but each Mosin has a different barrel size ranging from my Finn 39 with a nice .3085 to my largest MN with .315. I now have four different moulds for these five rifles and four sizers for my Star Sizer.

    I cast for accuracy first. I may not get the tightest groups but I'm always looking for them. I considre under 2 inches at 100 yards to be my goal.

    I weight each bullet I cast and segregat them into 1 grain increments so that everything in the lot is + or - .5 grains. I separate the boxes and shoot them from lightest to heaviest box, then cast more.

    For pistol shooting I only have a .38 at this time. Go rid of all my other revolvers so I could by more Mosins. LOL. Again, my goal is accuracy and I expect under 2 inches at 25 yards with the propper bullet/ powder combination.

    I use a great majority of wheel weights that I buy from E-bay. Can't seem to find a friendly tire dealer here that will sell me old wheel weights. I add either pure lead to soften the alloy or Lino type to make it harder depending on which weapon I'm using it in. I have three pots to keep my mixes separate.

    I still don't know if I shoot to reload or reload to shoot. It's all fun.
    Go ahead and run. You will only die tired

  16. #56
    Boolit Master


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    I can't believe that I some how missed this thread in the past. I guess it is because there is so much information here, and it takes a lot of effort to glean it all, probably years of effort to be honest.

    Thirty-one years ago when I started casting as a kid in the basement shop of a friend of my father's, I had no expectations, other than the fact that Dad told me he wasn't going to do all the work anymore just so I could shoot. So I would sit at the loading bench and either load or cast while Dad and Don worked on building their newest rifle. As a 7 year old boy, I didn't know nor care about one ragged hole accuracy. I just wanted something that would go bang and kill a coyote inside of 50 yards, as it was my Job to run the fence line after storms and make a mental note of where and what repairs it needed for Granddad while he was actually doing most of the work. I walked these hills ridges and valleys of the old farm packing around a little Marlin 357 rifle that Dad's friend had given me. By the time I hit my early teens, dad had started letting me use and shoot his old Flat Top Black Hawk 357 as it was a perfect companion gun for my little Marlin rifle. Now I needed twice as many boolits, because I had another gun.

    It wasn't until college that I really ramped up my shooting and started to care a bit more about accuracy, but even then it was still just minute of paper plate. It was during this time that I realized that I could shoot cast boolits with a good deal of accuracy if I worked at it. In my college years I wore out a couple of hand guns and a rifle. I hadn't started shooting cast in a rifle yet, because the Seirra plant was near by and the J words were to easy to come by. I had also convinced myself that cast would never be in the same league as the J words for accuracy, so hence I never give it much thought as to shooting cast out of my rifles. I didn't know or understand what I was missing out on. I muddled through the next 13 years only seating cast on handgun ammo.

    It wasn't until after I got back and half way healed up from my excursion to Afghanistan, that I discovered the need to figure out how to shoot cast boolits out of my rifles. I was no longer able to work a real job, and couldn't afford to buy J words any more for my rifles. I could buy a Lee mould for the price of a box of 100 bullets. That was also when I found this site. I lurked here for a long time reading all I could and realized that with a little effort I could do better than Minute of paper plate. I started trying some of the things I had read about others here doing, and my groups started getting smaller, and I was able to push the boolits faster.

    In a couple of my rifles I am pushing J word velocities with my cast boolits and shooting better than minute of paper plate at 100 yards. I owe the good groups that I have shot and posted on other threads to Ken and to all of you. If it hadn't been for this site and the people who make it what it is, I would most likely still be shooting minute of paper plate and not even trying to do the things that are required to shoot better. I thank each and every one of you who have posted here and I especially thank Ken for creating a place where all of this vast wealth of information can be collected and stored.

    Best Wishes from the Boer Ranch,

    Joe
    WWG1WGA


    Tyrants use the force of the people to chain and subjugate-that is, enyoke the people. They then plough with them as men do with oxen yoked. Thus the spirit of liberty and innovation is reduced by bayonets, and principles are struck dumb by cannon shot: Albert Pike, Morals and Dogma

  17. #57
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    You know I have been over 90% of the threads in this place and I still have one nagging question I cannot answer.


    Do I cast/handload to shoot, or do I shoot to cast/handload? Do you ever go out back with an iron and make brass?


    My expectations of cast has always been to effectively do what I can with a jacket on, but without the jacket on.

    I did not know until I landed here that I could actually be MORE effective with cast than j-words....thanks to you all, especially that stocky redneck gent with glasses that originally sent me down the path of extreme enlightenment.

    Michael

  18. #58
    Boolit Grand Master


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    I am a bow hunter. Been doing it since my dad got my first when I was 14.. a 45 # fiberglass Bear. I soon learned the absolute importance of precision accuracy. Sometimes all ya get is a 3 inch hole between limbs to stick a rabbit. Anyway I figure if my revolver or rifle cannot give me precision to do the same ... then I will just keep searching for a better combination. If I cannot yet find that precision then I will just lay that tool aside and use another. I care not to loose any target for any reason. That may happen but it will not be because I launched an unproven pill haphazardly.
    I tend to use the softest possible mix. I am not to concered about a little lead in a barrel. Hunting I generally fire one shot... Launch one shaft. High Velocity is not an issue as I use large enough calibers with heavy enough boolits that I know it will take care of needs. where I hunt is river bottom thick stuff. I like being real close.

  19. #59
    Banned 45 2.1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 357maximum View Post
    My expectations of cast has always been to effectively do what I can with a jacket on, but without the jacket on.
    I did not know until I landed here that I could actually be MORE effective with cast than j-words....thanks to you all, especially that stocky redneck gent with glasses that originally sent me down the path of extreme enlightenment.Michael
    Hahahahahaha........Thats the first time i've been described that way..............Thanks Neener.......

  20. #60
    Boolit Master


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    I read Keith in 1969 or 70.

    Is there another answer to your question?


    Cat
    Cogito, ergo armatum sum.

    (I think, therefore I'm armed.)

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check