Another reason to powder coat

[usmc0811]

I was loading up some .40cal rounds the other day, and had to use my kinetic puller to take a bullet out of the case. When the bullet came out all the powder was sticking to the liquid alox lube on the bullet so I was not able to reuse the powder and it was a mess to clean off the bullet of the powder. I guess that's another excuse I'll use to start powder coating one day.

[Yodogsandman]

No excuses are needed to start powder coating your boolits, they're fun to shoot. There's a lot more time involved to make PC'd boolits than just tumble lubing with Liquid Lube though and with much the same results at the range.

[Beagle333]

Powdercoating is fun and it works well and makes a very clean boolit. But also try Ben's Liquid Lube instead of alox. You can just tumble it the same way and it isn't sticky after it dries.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-L-Liquid-Lube

[dragonrider]

I'd say that is a reason to stop using alox, but not powder coating. Do you see powder coating as your only alternative? I am one who sees no need for PC.

[dondiego]

Sounds like someone was using too much alox.

[MtGun44]

Not a reason to PC, but #23 on reasons I despise Lee tumble lube mulesnot.
Sticking with my Stars.

[bangerjim]

U will luv PC! Ignore the nay Sayers and tri it 4 yourself.

[bhn22]

Too much effort for too little return. Now we're talking about saving perhaps two cents worth of powder?

[mongoose33]

I'd say that is a reason to stop using alox, but not powder coating. Do you see powder coating as your only alternative? I am one who sees no need for PC.

I've experienced a lot of smoke w/ lubed boolits; the smoke drops significantly when I PC the boolits.

Do you just live with the smoke or is there a secret to reducing that smoke to tolerable levels? I'm PC'ing 9mm boolits.

[popper]

I use the HiTek for pistol. Solved leading problem in a couple. I understand BLL is good but I tossed all my LLA.

[Moonie]

alox should be a very thin coating, almost so thin you can't see it. And it should be dry before you load, if powder is sticking to it you are not using it correctly. Personally I prefered the 45/45/10 alox/JPW/MS to straight mule snot. I have moved on to PC at this point though, much less smoke.

[MBTcustom]

PC pros and cons

pros:
1. They look freakin awesome.
2. They store well.
3. They are protected against the elements.
4. They are easy to load
5. Greatly reduces your exposure to lead in the course of shooting.
6. Use the right color and you can fly under the radar at ranges that don't like cast.
7. Low smoke.
8. Increased diameter on undersized bullets.
9. Use in suppressors is an option with PC.
10. Did I mention they look cool?

cons:
1. Very hard to get anywhere close to the plug and play accuracy of traditional grease lubed bullets.
2. It's time consuming and tedious.
3. It's messy. Powder gets everywhere.
4. Bullets that were the correct size are now oversize, and a pretty harsh sizing operation is required.
5. Hardness may be compromised by the baking operation.
6. Some of us like the look of traditional cast lead.
7. HV shooting is not working out very well.
8. It's pretty much impossible to coat them evenly in a balanced fashion and have them come out looking cool.
9. You find the fact that pulling the bullets and reclaiming the powder is an advantage over actually shooting them. (zing to the OP, all in good fun!)
10. Did I mention that accuracy is horribly lackluster in comparison with a good greased cast bullet?

Thats the way I see it.
Theres actually a lot better reason to PC than not to, untill it comes to actually putting groups on paper. Therefore I think PC is great in situations where you need lots of trigger time at close range and low speed and the pretty looking bullets are worth passing up the known performance of greased bullets.
Unfortuantely, I am a rifle shooter, and I admire the holes in the target much more than I do the ammo in the magazine, so it rarely makes sense for me.
I've had fun with PC, and occasionally I'll make a few just to wow the newbes, but that's about it.
When it's time to get down to business and shoot groups, the PC stays on the shelf.
Just my opinion, and more power to anyone who thinks differently.

I think everybody should try it at least once, but don't be too disapointed when you can't hit like you used to. It's a fun facet to the sport. I just don't put much stock in appearances.

[jwber]

I only cast for pistol mind you...and 95%+ of my shooting is action shooting (USPSA/IDPA).

If I was just shooting staticly I could get away with regular lube....however I've been whited out way to many times in matches with regular lubed bullets. On top of that I could never get rid of leading completely and would have to clean my bore more than I liked.

I could only imagine the smoke screen if I had shot the 10 rounds in well under 5 secs with lubed bullets like I did yesterday with PC ones.

Having said that...standing up all those bullets is a PITA doing ESPC and I wasn't happy double coating shake and bakes, or using the air soft bb's. Most likely going to try out a jar of Hi-Tek and see how that goes.

[mongoose33]

I only cast for pistol mind you...and 95%+ of my shooting is action shooting (USPSA/IDPA).

If I was just shooting staticly I could get away with regular lube....however I've been whited out way to many times in matches with regular lubed bullets. On top of that I could never get rid of leading completely and would have to clean my bore more than I liked.

I could only imagine the smoke screen if I had shot the 10 rounds in well under 5 secs with lubed bullets like I did yesterday with PC ones.

Having said that...standing up all those bullets is a PITA doing ESPC and I wasn't happy double coating shake and bakes, or using the air soft bb's. Most likely going to try out a jar of Hi-Tek and see how that goes.

This is exactly the reason I turned to PC. I was shooting about six weeks ago, literally lost sight of the target in the cloud of smoke. I can tell you from experience: it's harder to hit a target you can't see!

As far as accuracy goes, at least with pistols, I don't see any difference. I'm not shooting from a Ransom Rest at distances where differences might become apparent (25 yards, say), but at 8-10 yard ranges, I can't tell.

If greased cast boolits didn't smoke, I wouldn't be doing this.

[Maximumbob54]

Good enough for some .357 magnum range blasting fun:



Accuracy master? Course not. Cheap, easy, no leading, smokes only from the powder and not the lube, and the gun cleans up like you were shooting over priced jacketed. Good enough for me.

[Dragonheart]

PC pros and cons

pros:
1. They look freakin awesome.
2. They store well.
3. They are protected against the elements.
4. They are easy to load
5. Greatly reduces your exposure to lead in the course of shooting.
6. Use the right color and you can fly under the radar at ranges that don't like cast.
7. Low smoke.
8. Increased diameter on undersized bullets.
9. Use in suppressors is an option with PC.
10. Did I mention they look cool?

cons:
1. Very hard to get anywhere close to the plug and play accuracy of traditional grease lubed bullets.
2. It's time consuming and tedious.
3. It's messy. Powder gets everywhere.
4. Bullets that were the correct size are now oversize, and a pretty harsh sizing operation is required.
5. Hardness may be compromised by the baking operation.
6. Some of us like the look of traditional cast lead.
7. HV shooting is not working out very well.
8. It's pretty much impossible to coat them evenly in a balanced fashion and have them come out looking cool.
9. You find the fact that pulling the bullets and reclaiming the powder is an advantage over actually shooting them. (zing to the OP, all in good fun!)
10. Did I mention that accuracy is horribly lackluster in comparison with a good greased cast bullet?

Thats the way I see it.
Theres actually a lot better reason to PC than not to, untill it comes to actually putting groups on paper. Therefore I think PC is great in situations where you need lots of trigger time at close range and low speed and the pretty looking bullets are worth passing up the known performance of greased bullets.
Unfortuantely, I am a rifle shooter, and I admire the holes in the target much more than I do the ammo in the magazine, so it rarely makes sense for me.
I've had fun with PC, and occasionally I'll make a few just to wow the newbes, but that's about it.
When it's time to get down to business and shoot groups, the PC stays on the shelf.
Just my opinion, and more power to anyone who thinks differently.

I think everybody should try it at least once, but don't be too disapointed when you can't hit like you used to. It's a fun facet to the sport. I just don't put much stock in appearances.

Hi Tim,
Did you really mean to say item #10? (Did I mention that accuracy is horribly lackluster in comparison with a good greased cast bullet?)

If so, apparently you haven’t actually tested any powder coated bullets for accuracy or there is something wrong with your coating? Attached is a photo of a recent group fired from my Ransom Rest. This is just one example I have using HP-38 powder and I have a number of tests using alternate powders delivering consistent groups under 2”. The bullet in this test is a powder coated 230 grain round nose from a Saeco #357 mold. This is my standard bullet of choice as it feeds 100%. When I start testing powder coated semi wad cutter designs I expect the groups to improve. As you can see from the photo this is a 1.6”, 5 shot group at 25 yards”. A 2”, 45 ACP group at 25 yards is considered by most to be outstanding and a 1-1/2” group is target quality from a high dollar custom gun.

I do plan to do a PC vs Lube test in the future just for comparison, but for me with this kind of accuracy, I will never go back to the sticky, smoking mess that gums up your dies and will not feed in a bullet feeder.

Additionally, you should mention that a powder coated bullet leaves a clean barrel after every shot so accuracy does not diminish like a lubed bullet, which deposits small amounts of lead with each shot.

Did you mention powder coated bullets are the coolest looking bullets on the range? (LOL)
Attachment 139773

[gloob]

If greased cast boolits didn't smoke, I wouldn't be doing this.

They don't always smoke. I think smoke is secondary to gas blowby. I wish I could figure it out for sure. But most of my locked breech handgun loads don't smoke, and all of my cast revolver loads have smoked.

Additionally, you should mention that a powder coated bullet leaves a clean barrel after every shot so accuracy does not diminish like a lubed bullet, which deposits small amounts of lead with each shot.

This is also not universally true. I can shoot cast lead in most of my handguns without buildup. A little seasoning for the first few shots, maybe. But that is it. I haven't cleaned a handgun or rifle bore for lead fouling in over two years and many thousands of cast rounds in most all my guns, except for my 40's, which I only sorted out the expander more recently. They're also good to go now.

There is a lot of merit to powder coat. Sometimes you can run into an issue with a gun that is difficult to sort, and powder coat fixes it. But some people seem to be able to set up at least some of their guns to shoot lubed cast just fine, rather than fix the problem on every single bullet. For these guys and their guns and loading process, powder coat is a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

[bangerjim]

I think we've beat this PC vs. grease thing to death!

Bottom line is there are those that will absolutely NOT admit PC is any good. Fine. Load the way you have for the past decades.

But there are many of us out here that are extremely happy with PC. I have excellent accuracy with ESPC'd boolits, I guess due to the precise coating thickness and weight distribution.

I know, for me, PC allows me to shoot a ton more boolits with hardly any cleaning of barrels after hundreds of rounds. Rounds are not sticky in the summer here in the desert, and there is no grease smoke, especially obnoxious in indoor ranges. And they turn heads at the range!

We can all agree to disagree. Use whatever works best for you needs.

banger

[blikseme300]

I have yet to see pictures of targets showing good accuracy from rifles at long range. PC seems to work fine in pistols and power to those who like doing this. I can still lube & size pistol boolits faster through my Star's than anybody can PC and as I shoot outdoors there is no smoke problem. Barrels stay shiny and won't rust as the thin coat of wax protects them.

[shoot-n-lead]

I have yet to see pictures of targets showing good accuracy from rifles at long range. PC seems to work fine in pistols and power to those who like doing this. I can still lube & size pistol boolits faster through my Star's than anybody can PC and as I shoot outdoors there is no smoke problem. Barrels stay shiny and won't rust as the thin coat of wax protects them.

You are not the only here that had success with conventional lube.

However, I will challenge you to lube/size bullets with less time than I have in actual bullet handling of PC. And, your barrels WILL have soot in them...I have shot a few conventionally lubed bullets...you, nor anyone else can make them shoot as clean as PC bullets.