300 Black Out Deer Rifle?

[DonMountain]

I have been reading a lot on all of these internet gun lists and have come to the conclusion that this new 300 Black Out cartridge is the cats meow for deer hunting. I've learned that I can buy a barrel for that Colt Delta Match HBAR AR rifle I bought 25 years ago and never fired because those 22 rifle bullets are too small to kill anything. And with that new 300 Black Out deer cartridge I've heard that it kills deer way better than the old 30-30, and the boolets are subsonic (whatever that means) so they are completely silent in the deer woods. Meaning if a whole group of deer come past my deer stand, I can just keep shooting them and not scaring the others off. That way I can fill my three deer tags, plus my mother's 3 deer tags, and my grandmother's three deer tags since they don't hunt much anymore. So, what's your opinion of this new 300 Black Out deer cartridge? Is it worth spending the money to get a barrel for it to deer hunt with?

[blikseme300]

The 300blk is not too new as it has been around for about 5 years already. (Actually if the 300 Whisper is considered it has been around much longer.) I like the cartridge and have used it for hunting using both supersonic and subsonic ammunition. It is by no means better than the 30-30 for hunting but can get the job done on small game within reason and range. I don't care much for the subsonic as the range is limited and the drop is terrible compared to the 30-30.

[NavyVet1959]

Hopefully, your post is tongue-in-cheek... The .300 AAC is a good cartridge, but a bit less than a .30-30. It's enough for the deer that I see around here, but mostly all I see around here are small whitetail does and it is at pretty short range, so that's not saying much. As I get older, the idea of tracking an animal through thick brush until it bleeds out seems to have lost its enchantment for me. As such, I would rather have something that I know is large enough to get the job done regardless of what I might encounter. Thus, I choose a .45-70 because I want to know that if I encounter a large hog, I have brought enough gun. Besides, I'm getting too old to be climbing trees in case he gets pissed off at me having shot him.

[DonMountain]

The 300blk is not too new as it has been around for about 5 years already. (Actually if the 300 Whisper is considered it has been around much longer.) I like the cartridge and have used it for hunting using both supersonic and subsonic ammunition. It is by no means better than the 30-30 for hunting but can get the job done on small game within reason and range. I don't care much for the subsonic as the range is limited and the drop is terrible compared to the 30-30.

Well, it must be pretty new since it doesn't appear in any of the reloading manuals that I have and use regularly. Hornady Third Edition, Nosler No. 4, Hodgdon No. 25, Speer No. 11, Lyman 46th Edition? None of these have that "new" cartridge in it. So where do you get reloading data for the 300 Black Out? And whose new reloading manuals have loads for it?

[NavyVet1959]

So where do you get reloading data for the 300 Black Out? And whose new reloading manuals have loads for it?

The .300 Whisper data should be good for it.

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=141

[BK7saum]

And no you cannot shoot the whole herd one at a time, even suppressed. The impact is loud and will startle them. You may get a second shot, but I doubt a third.

Doesn't work on pigs either.

[Bzcraig]

The 300Blk was approved by saami 1/2011 but you're right, not much printed data available. Most of the powder manufacturers do have data online.

[johnnyastro22]

The 300Blk was approved by saami 1/2011 but you're right, not much printed data available. Most of the powder manufacturers do have data online.

Just a word of caution. The maximum cartridge case length listed in my 9th Edition Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading was incorrect at 1.40". This caused me problems with my first two load work ups. Check online and good luck. 300 AAC is a great 30 cal option for the AR and is the most versatile cartridge I know of period!

[blikseme300]

Hopefully, your post is tongue-in-cheek... The .300 AAC is a good cartridge, but a bit less than a .30-30. It's enough for the deer that I see around here, but mostly all I see around here are small whitetail does and it is at pretty short range, so that's not saying much. As I get older, the idea of tracking an animal through thick brush until it bleeds out seems to have lost its enchantment for me. As such, I would rather have something that I know is large enough to get the job done regardless of what I might encounter. Thus, I choose a .45-70 because I want to know that if I encounter a large hog, I have brought enough gun. Besides, I'm getting too old to be climbing trees in case he gets pissed off at me having shot him.

Somewhat tongue-in-cheek but yes I like the 300blk. Currently I have 3 AR-15 rifles and a SBR that get a good work-out regularly. The white tails are small here in deep south Texas and hunting distances are typically short so the caliber does work well enough. Where I have had pause for concern is when I come across large hogs or Nilgai. I have taken both with supersonic CB's but the killing was not as quick as with a Marlin 30-30 using 165gn RD boolits. Often I actually carry a Marlin 444 when the conditions for coming across larger game is better. No substitute for a larger hammer, IMHO.

Loading data is out there but not so much in printed material as I found once I started loading for the 300blk. Case conversion was another interesting experience as I quickly found that not all brass can be used because of different case wall thicknesses. The preferred powders listed on threads were not available in my area so much research and experimentation was done before I found what worked for me. RL7 at 100% case capacity is my go-to powder under 155gn boolits while LilGun is gathering dust due to temperature sensitivity and blown primers. (Use any internet load data at own risk.)

[Mumblypeg]

You might find it hard to convince that truckload of deer that I have killed with an AR in .223 that it won't get the job done.....

[kens]

if you going to load your own, then anything you load is a 'blackout'.
300 blackout is a heavyweight .30 based on a .223 case, loaded to subsonic velocity.
You can load any caliber to subsonic velocity. voila!! you got a 'blackout' or such cartridge.
.45acp is a near subsonic round, will that flatten a deer?
45colt is a near subsonic, will it flatten a deer?
.45-70 with a 400grainer launched at near sonic? You betcha.
.35 Remington?
444 Marlin?

[MaryB]

I thought about 300bo... going 6.5 Grendel instead.

[bhn22]

The Blackout is only "silent" if you use a suppressor with subsonic loads. Loads over the speed of sound are a bit louder, plus you have the sonic "crack" to deal with. Honestly, the subsonic loads are only about as powerful as a 45 ACP, 240 gr bullets at just under 1000 fps. It is closer in performance to the Soviet 7.62X39. Some rifles won't function reliably with subsonic loads without a suppressor. That said, I will be building a 300BO upper for use in the gun games.

And your manuals are all ancient.
And 223 is adequate for deer with proper bullets at moderate ranges.
And MaryB is wise. 6.5 Grendel is probably the best all around cartridge for AR15s. Remingtons 30 AR could be great, but you can't get them, or components reliably.

[NavyVet1959]

If you treat the AR like a single-shot and don't mind cycling the action manually after each shot, your options on powder increase quite a bit. My first attempt with a .300 AAC AR was with Red Dot powder and a 240 gr cast bullet. It fires, but would not cycle the action, even after increasing the powder to the point where the pistol primers were starting to get flattened. After I got to that point, I didn't pursue that powder any further.

[NavyVet1959]

The Blackout is only "silent" if you use a suppressor with subsonic loads. Loads over the speed of sound are a bit louder, plus you have the sonic "crack" to deal with. Honestly, the subsonic loads are only about as powerful as a 45 ACP, 240 gr bullets at just under 1000 fps.

Even with the 240 gr cast bullet, you don't *have* to keep it subsonic and if you don't have a suppressor, there's probably not much reason to do so. The .300 AAC 240 gr bullet will penetrate further than the .45 ACP bullet of similar weight due to it have better sectional density. But, then you have a slightly small hole than the .45, so you have to ask yourself whether a larger diameter but shallower hole does more damage than a smaller diameter but deeper hole. That's going to depend upon the circumstances of the shot.

[Butchman205]

The Lyman AR Loading Manual has a good bit of information about loading for Blackouts...a lot of other AR calibers as well. Definitely a good printed resource to add to your personal library...and definitely a reputable source.

[MT Chambers]

For deer i would go with the 30/30 before the Whisper, a light handy Marlin in 30/30 would have it all over the other.

[blikseme300]

Wanting more than what the 300blk offers and having a number of 30cal molds I have been looking into building an AR-15 in 30HRT. I already have the dies as well as 6.8SPC rifles, magazines and lots of brass so only need a barrel. Do I really need this for hunting as I have other rifles that will get the job done? No, I just like to experiment and the 30HRT has interested me.

[DR Owl Creek]

Wanting more than what the 300blk offers and having a number of 30cal molds I have been looking into building an AR-15 in 30HRT. I already have the dies as well as 6.8SPC rifles, magazines and lots of brass so only need a barrel. Do I really need this for hunting as I have other rifles that will get the job done? No, I just like to experiment and the 30HRT has interested me.

That looks like it might have some real potential. Please post an update when you can.

Dave