Cleaning Dark Milsurp Bores

[dale2242]

I know this subject has been hashed over before here, but I would like to start a new thread on the subject.
Most of my milsurps have dark but strong bores and I have spent a reasonable amount of time trying to get them bright.
Is it likely that the effort to get them bright worthwhile? Are they going to be more accurate?
Let`s hear your methods and materials you have used to clean dark bores.
I know there is no magic cure and it will probably take a lot of work....dale

[John Boy]

I have spent a reasonable amount of time trying to get them bright.

Would help the discussion to post what your cleaning method is to get the bores bright. Usually using proven cleaning product and letting it soak in the bore - good brushing and more soaking helps

[bouncer50]

If they shoot good why really worry how bright they are. You can clean for month with solvents and the patchs will still come out dark because of the pores of the steel inside the barrel will sweat out the fouling. Just a lot of years shooting old military rifle and old ammo what i have learn.

[nagantguy]

Had good luck on a few with never dull, and a lot of elbow grease. Fire lapping put a shine on some of the darkest. Some of them.shot better afterwards some the same, never had one get worse after the effort. Never dull is a cheap proven place to.start.

[EMC45]

I wrapped a cleaning patch around a worn out old cleaning brush and loaded it up with J-B Bore Lap and did some in and out cycles on each rifle. Everyone of my rifles showed a marked visible improvement in regard to "shine" and light reflection.

[flounderman]

shoot some paper patch lead thru them
.

[pworley1]

One of the most accurate milsurps I have is a M39 Mosin that has a 1894 receiver and a bore that looked like a sewer pipe when I got it. It still is very dark but get a little better every time I clean it.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I've had some that actually improved in appearance after a good shooting session and subsequent cleaning. Won't get any pits out, but became brighter and the rifling more defined.

[303Guy]

Ah, the dark milsurp bore! Yup. I might have one or two of those.

I fire lapped it. It now feels much smoother and seems to get tighter towards the muzzle.

Fire-lapping can do wonders. So can paper patching. What about electro-cleaning? I haven't tried it yet (everything is in slow motion for me) but I do have the method that a member sent me somewhere.

One fire-lapping method I have used which did clean the bore and smooth those sharp edges is to fill the case with whatever (I used wheat bran topped with grits) with a wad on top. then in went grinding paste capped with a boolit (paper patched). The idea was that the abrasive paste would be sandwiched between the wad of filler and the boolit, forcing it into all the crevices and corners (and rust pits). This method won't remove constrictions in the bore though.

Another method I have used was to load throat fitting boolits without lube. Before chambering I would smear the exposed boolit shanks with AutoSol metal polish, chamber and fire. It took several shots to produce a visible improvement. The cases came out shiny! The stuff does get into the chamber. I think the charge was 10grs H4227. I'd have to check and update. I do have one or two bores waiting for the treatment. Just as soon as I get a round tuit!

[opos]

Some time back I bought a couple of Mosins (doesn't everybody?) and the bores were dark but decent and shot fine...but that old nagging OCD kept saying we need the bore to shine.

I read on the local Mosin forum that Smith and Wesson Bore gel was the hot ticket...there are 2 kinds...one in an aerosol can and one in a 4 oz bottle...I didn't try the aerosol foam as everyone complained it ran out of gas early and wasted lots of product.

I took a patch well soaked in the bore gel and really soaked the inside of the barrel. I left it for about 2 hours and then took a stainless "tornado" brush, soaked it with gel and put the end of the bore in a bucket to catch the gunk and began to scrub with the brush..the stuff that ran out the end of the barrel looked like the sealer they put on asphalt streets..black, gunk and thick...Then I ran a few tight patches through and looked it over...progress!!

Next I took the bore gel...saturated the bore and left it sit overnight...next morning the tornado brush and patch routine again...it was amazing. I cleaned things up and shot it with some commercial ammo (non corrosive) and it got better and better..I give it a shot of bore gel and the stainless tornado brush about every 3rd session and cleaning and it keeps on getting better...never will be perfect but the difference is amazing.

I've always used Kroil for tough cases but this stuff beats it hands down..I think they have it on Amazon and it's S&W bore gel in the squeeze bottle...some folks would have a fit at a stainless tornado brush (will only use this style) but the bore on a $100 rifle isn't the end all...I do get really nice groups with these now and they were both just junk when I got them.

[N4AUD]

Boiling hot water with Dawn detergent first. Homemade electronic cleaner second, using a very mild ammonia solution. Those usually take care of any major problems than just normal cleaning methods. I don't polish except by a whole lot of shooting. I don't use anything on a drill either. Too much potential for me to damage the barrel that way.

[1Shirt]

I am noticing that when I put an over coat of Ben'sLL over my regular sized and lubed blts, that the bore seems to get a little brighter after each shooting session in my Mosin M-38.
1Shirt!

[Calamity Jake]

Electro chem. bore cleaner works every time, it's all I use.

[GhostHawk]

I have a pair of Mosin's that came with dark bores. Started after the cosmo was gone with Hoppes #9. And started shooting it.
And discovered my bullets were not big enough, and cleaned it.

After a couple of months of range trips, followed by cleanings I started getting green copper fouling on my patch's.

Then I discovered the joys of Dextron III ATF mixed about 3-4 parts to 1 part of Goo Gone.

I would run patch's of Hoppes #9 till they came back clean. Run a patch with the Red and it would come back black.

Partially a matter of time, partially a matter of shooting, partially a matter of cleaning after. Partially just a matter of persistence.
Just stick with it.

Now both bores are mirror bright, groups are continuing to improve. Spring is here so it is time to take the Mosin to the range and start pushing more distance, see if we can get on paper at 100y. And then see if we can figure out how to get 1-2" groups at that range. I'm not sure my eye's are up to it with iron sights.

But hey, its been a fun journey, one that I have enjoyed every step of the way.

[1johnlb]

I've had two just imported Swedish mausers that had a thick crud layered all the way through in both. The first one I started cleaning and shooting and used a lot of cleaners and brushes and a lot of elbow grease. After a few sessions with the first one and still less than half cleaned, I started with the second rifle the same way and it was the same situation.
So I had a bottle of marvel mystery oil on the shelf and remembered that the detergents worked best hot. So about to give up, I decided to try it.
I shot the rifle until the barrel was untouchable, soaked a mop with marvel and could hear the sizzle when the MMO hit the bore. After the second session it was clean all except the now visible pits. Went back to the first one and the same effect. The bonus for me is it works the same way on lead.

[303Guy]

Dish washing liquid is amazing stuff for getting at rust. It will free up rust seized parts. A strong and hot solution as in boiling is best but in the bore cold with time works just fine. A good place to start.

[reivertom]

I like Tetra gel type bore cleaner that smells like ammonia and Sweets 762. They both work about the same. You just don't let it set in the bore more than 20-30 minutes. I thought my guns were clean until I used these gels. They cut lead, copper, and powder fouling. I had to sight my deer rifle in after I cleaned the bore because it took off so much fouling it changed the POI.

[Budzilla 19]

I had a 1917 Enfield in '06, bad bore, shot shotgun groups at first, but after numerous cleanings, still no good groups! Finally got aggravated, and wrapped a bore brush with 0000 steel wool soaked in Sweets 762, scrubbed the fire out of that thing! Voila' ! Settled it right down! I don't recommend this at all except for the most fouled up barrels! Bright and shiny after that!!! Lol just my .02 cents.(yes it did take a while but results were spectacular)

[Multigunner]

One method I've used on very heavily metal fouled bores was to make a chamber plug by using a .45-70 or .45 ACP case as a tube cutter and pressing it into a tan rubber eraser. The tan rubber erasers don't have the gritty stuff thats in red rubber erasers.

Plug the chamber to a point just short of the shoulder.

Insert a cleaning rod from the muzzle with a loosely fitted patch with a bit of 0000 steel wool wrapped around it. It should not be a tight fit in the bore. Just enough that the steel wool makes light contact when pushed into the bore.
To avoid and damage to the crown you might want to insert the rod without the patch before you plug the chamber, put the patch on then pull the patch into the neck then plug the chamber.

I would then pour enough Sweets 7.62 down the muzzle to fill the bore about half way.

After giving the Sweets time to work pull the rod up the bore slowly till its near the muzzle , push it back down the bore slowly being careful not to dislodge the chamber plug.
Repeat this several times , then give the Sweets time to work awhile and do it again.

The light scrubbing of the steel wool clears away the loosened or partly dissolved fouling to expose more fouling to the solvent.

After following these steps several times pull the rod out , pour the expended solvent out by way of the muzzle, unplug the chamber and run a few cloth patches through the bore and inspect.
If the metal fouling is thick it can take several sessions.
I usually plug the chamber again and fill the bore with solvent and leave the rifle propped upright over night then give it another go.

When filling a bore with a high ammonia content solvent its recommended to stretch a short length of rubber tubing over the muzzle and fill past the end of the barrel.
You don't want the solvent level to drop below the muzzle because the ammonia in the solvent might react to air causing a "tideline" of corrosion to form at the interface.

When lands are clean and the bottom of the grooves look reasonably clean then just clean normally and after every shooting session.

After cleaning with strong solvents I protect the bore with Ballistol. So long as theres ballistol in a bore it continues to work at dissolving fouling while also preventing any oxidation of the steel.

Running a patch soaked with ballistol through the bore a few times every week or so will usually reveal and clear away more dissolved fouling each time.

I prefer to use thick felt patches on an under sized jag (7mm jag for a .30 etc) for normal cleaning after shooting.

[Gunor]

I have used a foam bore cleaner. Also Evapo-Rust - If there is just rust - it just dissolves the rust. My current project, CZ 1934-08 7mm - had a sewer pipe. Combination of Hoppes, foaming stuff and Evapo-rust - the muzzle lands are amazingly sharp and defined. No worn out muzzle from a cleaning rod - just corrosion from the ammo (and etc.) - looks like heavily frosted metal. I am really impressed with the rust dissolving - Evapo-rust.