Received some Vectan powders, first impressions

[jonp]

Keep the data and testing coming on the Vectan, Klaus. It's very much appreciated.

[texassako]

Today I found out that A0 and Ba9 are excellent rifle powders for the slow end in 7.62x54r, and it looks like I finally found a replacement for my Unique accuracy load in my M28-76. Even on a breezy, rain soaked day. A word on the odd round counts. My Magnetospeed bayonet was slipping at the beginning and missed a few rounds, plus I use odd 36 count SmartReloader boxes(9x4) for this cartridge. Other pertinent details of the load: NOE 311331 sized .313", COWW w/ a bit of tin alloy, TAC1 lube with and over coat of tumble lube, 3.04" COAL. First 2 A0 chronograph data(post to long otherwise):

Series	1	Shots:	6
Min	1234	Max	1276
Avg	1252	S-D	14
ES	42
Powder	A0	Charge	11.5
Series	Shot	Speed
1	1	1276	ft/sec
1	2	1254	ft/sec
1	3	1234	ft/sec
1	4	1256	ft/sec
1	5	1252	ft/sec
1	6	1241	ft/sec
----	----	----	----
Series	2	Shots:	8
Min	1276	Max	1295
Avg	1285	S-D	6
ES	19
Powder	A0	Charge	12
Series	Shot	Speed
2	1	1295	ft/sec
2	2	1287	ft/sec
2	3	1285	ft/sec
2	4	1279	ft/sec
2	5	1276	ft/sec
2	6	1295	ft/sec
2	7	1288	ft/sec
2	8	1282	ft/sec

[texassako]

Next 2 A0 chronograph data:

Series	3	Shots:	9
Min	1314	Max	1331
Avg	1322	S-D	6
ES	17
Powder	A0	Charge	12.5
Series	Shot	Speed
3	1	1326	ft/sec
3	2	1324	ft/sec
3	3	1329	ft/sec
3	4	1328	ft/sec
3	5	1318	ft/sec
3	6	1318	ft/sec
3	7	1314	ft/sec
3	8	1315	ft/sec
3	9	1331	ft/sec
----	----	----	----
Series	4	Shots:	9
Min	1343	Max	1356
Avg	1351	S-D	4
ES	13
Powder	A0	Charge	13
Series	Shot	Speed
4	1	1355	ft/sec
4	2	1355	ft/sec
4	3	1355	ft/sec
4	4	1353	ft/sec
4	5	1347	ft/sec
4	6	1343	ft/sec
4	7	1353	ft/sec
4	8	1349	ft/sec
4	9	1356	ft/sec

[texassako]

First 2 Ba9 chronograph data and a photo of these did at 100 yards:

Series	5	Shots:	9
Min	1159	Max	1174
Avg	1167	S-D	5
ES	15
Powder	Ba9	Charge	10.5
Series	Shot	Speed
5	1	1159	ft/sec
5	2	1167	ft/sec
5	3	1171	ft/sec
5	4	1159	ft/sec
5	5	1173	ft/sec
5	6	1166	ft/sec
5	7	1166	ft/sec
5	8	1168	ft/sec
5	9	1174	ft/sec
----	----	----	----
Series	6	Shots:	9
Min	1197	Max	1221
Avg	1208	S-D	7
ES	24
Powder	Ba9	Charge	11
Series	Shot	Speed
6	1	1214	ft/sec
6	2	1221	ft/sec
6	3	1197	ft/sec
6	4	1210	ft/sec
6	5	1200	ft/sec
6	6	1215	ft/sec
6	7	1206	ft/sec
6	8	1203	ft/sec
6	9	1212	ft/sec

[texassako]

Final 2 Ba9 chronograph data:

Series	7	Shots:	9
Min	1226	Max	1247
Avg	1238	S-D	7
ES	21
Powder	Ba9	Charge	11.5
Series	Shot	Speed
7	1	1237	ft/sec
7	2	1247	ft/sec
7	3	1242	ft/sec
7	4	1226	ft/sec
7	5	1245	ft/sec
7	6	1242	ft/sec
7	7	1231	ft/sec
7	8	1236	ft/sec
7	9	1244	ft/sec
----	----	----	----
Series	8	Shots:	9
Min	1266	Max	1287
Avg	1277	S-D	7
ES	21
Powder	Ba9	Charge	12
Series	Shot	Speed
8	1	1281	ft/sec
8	2	1279	ft/sec
8	3	1266	ft/sec
8	4	1285	ft/sec
8	5	1285	ft/sec
8	6	1275	ft/sec
8	7	1270	ft/sec
8	8	1269	ft/sec
8	9	1287	ft/sec

[Klaus]

Hi Texassako,

thx for your report.
i was surprised about the relative uniformity of the ft/speed

First trial with 8,5 grs BA 9 in my 44-40 was failed because the speed was much to fast and the bullet impact are all over the paper
my old load 8,2 grs HS 6 is a tack driver
it looks like BA 9 is much faster as HS 6 so i reduce to 7,5 grs for the next run
report will follow

Klaus

[Schrag4]

Ok, so I FINALLY got a chance to test out the Ba9 with 125gr LRN projectiles that I powder coated. The test gun was a Ruger SR9c, which has a 3.4" barrel. I loaded up 5 rnds each at 4.3gr, 4.5gr, 4.7gr, and 4.9gr. OAL was 1.128", primers were CCI #500, and all brass was once (probably more like many times) fired FC. Averages came out to 854fps, 895fps, 919fps, and 946fps from that short barrel. I wonder how this would perform out of a full-length barrel.

I couldn't see any signs of excess pressure in any of the brass, although it's my understanding that if you see signs then you're already WAY over pressure. I'm content to call this a good powder for medium target loads. I don't think there's quite enough oomph there to safely say it would make 125 PF for IDPA (measured from a max-length barrel, as the rules state). Slide locked back after all 4 strings, although I was resting the gun on a table so I'd want to test function with strong and weak hand only before cranking out a bunch of anything. I'd most likely load at the highest end of the load data, so I don't anticipate I'd have any issues anyway with function.

[texassako]

Thanks for the extra test info on this powder Schrag4.

I used the above 7.62x54r, 311331, Ba9 10.5 gr load today to shoot some military postal match targets. First 5 shot target went into about 1/2", wish the rest did but the rest were all about 1".

[9w1911]

You shootin an M39?

[texassako]

You shootin an M39?

M28-76 with a Kollmorgen 6x in the original military scope mount.

[9w1911]

very nice

[runfiverun]

this is a great thread.

I remember when we used to have threads like this dealing with mil-surp powders of all kinds of speeds.

[Klaus]

short update from my side......
soo fine the Vectan BA9 Powder works in my 8mm Mauser and 6,5x55 SE sooo bad it works in the 44-40 Win.
i load some Rounds from 7,2 grs up to 8,5 grs BA 9 with 200 grs RCBS Cast Bullet and Ben`s Red Lube.
8,5 grs are much to fast and the Bullet impacs are all over the Papertarget but also the loads with less powder are not accurate.
My Shooting Buddy run another trial with his `73 Uberti and the results are bad as mine.

For an evidence we both shoot a further trial with the approved Hodgdon HS6 Load 8,5 grs with exellent results.
i could not explain why the BA 9 failed ??
due to my feeling the BA9 is much faster as the HS6 fast nearly as Unique i think, althought it was shown on the same level as HS 6 in the powder comparing table.
I know that it was a "just about" info

any info about your experiences..

regards Klaus

[jonp]

Great stuff. I just got a chrony and am loading up some 38sp with gm3 for testing. I'll post the results. I have not had time to try out the A0 i bought yet in the 38sp

[Maximumbob54]

This is kind of a jumble of copy and paste from some previous posts I've made:

Bought a 1# bottle of some Nobel Vectan Ba10:



Looks like tiny little kitty litter. I assume it will flow well enough. I've found more available online and it costs a heck of a lot less than I paid local. As in about ten bucks a pound less. I wish they wouldn't do that because now I will buy online instead of with them. Mark it up too much and you can keep it because it chases me away.

Obtained some more "Poudre"...

A0:


This stuff looks like green and gray/brown squares. It's rather thick cut too so it doesn't stick together or clump at all. It has some mass to it like it's heavier than it seems like it should be. Take note of the "safety seal" on the lid. Yeah, it's completely intact. It's pretty much pointless. There isn't an actual peal away seal on the opening once the lid is removed. Even better, all and I mean ALL the lids on them were loose. There is a thin foam seal in the lid so I tightened them all down (including the ones I didn't buy) but who know's how much humidity may have gotten to them. <growls>

A1:


These are all green square but not quite all the same shade of green. They look to be the same size and thickness as the other one.

The last thing I'm noticing is that they don't go out of their way to label these very well. Now that I have three different flavors I'm going to store them all apart from each other. Especially the A0 and A1 since it would be all too easy to open the wrong bottle and not notice the difference.

Edit:

In retrospect, I don't think nitro cellulose powders absorb moisture. Alliant is supposed to have old powder kept in a jar of water. They occasionally remove some and it burns just fine. I dunno.

[Schrag4]

Maximumbob54, I noticed the same thing with the lid on my container of Ba9. It wasn't on all that tight when I got it, and that portion of the lid that looks like it's supposed to indicate whether or not the container has ever been opened, like you'd see on a gallon of milk, well it just stays on the lid when you remove the lid. Dunno - maybe they buy their lids from another company and their containers don't really work with those lids in that regard. It's probably not worth getting all that worried about, but at the very least it makes me feel that their packaging was an afterthought.

[Klaus]

some times ago

have had found some time for another Test with Vectan BA 10

.45 ACP
Lee 200grs BB SWC
Murom LP Primer
3,7 - 4,0 grs BA 10

25 m 6 o`Clock Hold

Hits at the 9 Circle are with 4.0 grs BA 10





the flyers outside the 9 Circle on Picture 2 depending on me

next test with .38 Specoal will follow next Saturday

Klaus

[GBertolet]

I just received some BA10, and I am quite impressed with it. I got it for use in the 45 ACP, as a replacement for Clays. With a 230 gr cast LRN, 3.6 gr gave me 751 fps in one gun tested, and 737 fps in another. Both make IPSC major power factor.

Shot to shot variation in the several 5 round groups I tested was close to 5 fps. Very consistent. Clean burning as Clays, and measures very well in my Lee adjustable disk powder measure. Accuracy is comparable with Clays in the 1911's tested. I do think Nobel Spot could do a better job of tamper proof sealing of the cans though. Anyone along the way could add to, or remove from these containers and the end purchaser would never know.

[suncoastarmory]

I just received some BA10, and I am quite impressed with it. I got it for use in the 45 ACP, as a replacement for Clays. With a 230 gr cast LRN, 3.6 gr gave me 751 fps in one gun tested, and 737 fps in another. Both make IPSC major power factor.

Shot to shot variation in the several 5 round groups I tested was close to 5 fps. Very consistent. Clean burning as Clays, and measures very well in my Lee adjustable disk powder measure. Accuracy is comparable with Clays in the 1911's tested. I do think Nobel Spot could do a better job of tamper proof sealing of the cans though. Anyone along the way could add to, or remove from these containers and the end purchaser would never know.

Thanks for the report. I am using Clays for 9mm and 45 too. I may just pick up some Nobel Sport. I need to go back and look at the chart but seemed like the had one powder that would work for 9, 40 and 45. Or maybe it was rifle??

[jonp]

Suncoast: they have several including some shotgun powders which im experimenting with. A1, AS, BA 7.5/9/9.5/10. So far GM3 has fit the bill for pistol target loads