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Thread: Pulling Bullets

  1. #41
    Boolit Buddy
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    I am certainly open to other theories of the cause of this incident ... but I was using it correctly as described in the instructions and had a detonation on the third blow after pulling about 100 rounds.

    The only change to the device was the use of an RCBS Shellholder and not the collet provided with the tool.

    It looks like the puller was hammered upside down onto a pile of scrap metal parts!

    The photo and explaination shows a situation in which 2 + 2 has been made to equal 5, or more, and that's not possible.
    This is a classic example of how myths are started. "A bad thing happened to me when I was using a shellholder, therefore the shellholder caused it".
    I am only trying to help others here. Please keep your rude remarks to yourself.

  2. #42
    Boolit Buddy Andy_P's Avatar
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    I'm didn't intend to offend, and don't think that that my responses have been any more provocative than what started this:

    Quote Originally Posted by MtJerry View Post
    NO!!!

    Please do not do that! Using a shellholder in an inertial puller can cause the round to go off while pulling it.

    I had that very thing happen to me almost two years ago.

    Here is a link to a thread I posted on another site after it happened. Please read the whole thread as it took some detective work.

    You make a claim that you back up with "detective work" and I dispute it as faulty. When I said:

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy_P View Post
    This is a classic example of how myths are started. "A bad thing happened to me when I was using a shellholder, therefore the shellholder caused it".
    I described exactly your logic . It seems certain that the round went off because the primer was deeply indented and that cannot be caused by a (clean) shellholder. No-one else has experienced the same thing, but based on your single claim, the masses will sheepishly accept as fact what you say and into reloading folklore it goes.

    I thought I should try to prevent that - I was only trying to help as well.

  3. #43
    Boolit Buddy
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    Thank you for that Andy.

    I apologise if my original response was started so dramatically that it sounded offensive. That incident had a dramatic effect on me as I almost injured myself and my children.

    I would LOVE to know what happened and how to prevent it in the future.

    There are a lot of details I have thought about that I have never had a chance to put into writing.

    1. As I stated above, loose primer pockets can give opportunity for primers to move ... up or down. If up, then there is a very real chance they are triggered by the shell holder as they can and do have room to move inside them. If down (think about using too much pressure to seat a primer) then the anvil of the primer is forced (quickly I'd think give the blows of the puller) against the primer compound and detonation occurs.

    I'd more likely suspect that the primer moved up rather than down. With a shellholder, the round has room to move up and down in the shellholder and the repeated blows could give enough force for inertia to move the primer out. With the supplied collet the round is squeezed against the sides of the case and cannot move up or down.

    2. Dented primer ... when the round went off, it was unsupported (no chamber) and the primer "backed out." Imagine a low pressure round such as a snake load that does not have the flash hole drilled out.

    3. Movement of the round in the shellholder. Take a round, set into a shellholder, seat it as you do in the puller. Snug up the cap and give it a shake. You will hear the shell rattle. There is room for it to move in the shellholder and if a high primer situation occurs, then there is a real possiblity for detonation of the round.

    Which of these happened?? I dunno ... I do know that if this were to happen to someone else and I had a chance to warn them and didn't, well .... that would bug me.

    I mean no ill will towards you or anyone with the post. I just don't want anyone to get hurt.

    Sorry for the drift of this thread.

  4. #44
    Boolit Buddy Andy_P's Avatar
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    It's cool Jerry. I'll take my medicine and own up to most of the ill tone. A very peculiar event - thanks for sharing it.

  5. #45
    Boolit Buddy MightyThor's Avatar
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    You know, if using the shell holder was such a good Idea, how come no one at RCBS or any of the other manufactures thought of it? From a marketing standpoint it would seem to be brilliant cause you can sell more shell holders that way. Just me, but I don't see why anyone would want to put something on, near, over or close to the primer of a loaded round and then bang stuff repeatedly. I note that with the proper collet in place it would be impossible for that collet to have caused a round to go off. With a shell holder substituted you have introduced a foreign body into the design, allowed movement where none existed before and provided a solid platform for something to rest against which might in turn contact the primer.

    I am sure that everyone in this forum is right, you can probably beat on one of these things 100,000 times without an incident. You can also be the most carefull person in the world, and that is great, but none of us should ever take the position that "it can't happen to me" cause that kind of thinking can result in what many of us refer to as "a negligent discharge".
    In the words of Phil Esterhouse "lets be careful out there!"
    "let's go. He ain't hittin' nothin'.".... "You IDIOT, he's hit everything he's aimed at!"

  6. #46
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    Before I got bullet pullers I made do occasionally with a thread tap wrench. Push the bullet through the top of the press and clamp the bullet in the three jaws of the wrench and tighten. Then lower the ram, pulling the bullet. It does leave marks on the bullet, but some are slight, and the brass, primer, and powder are salvaged. DALE

  7. #47
    Boolit Master Morgan Astorbilt's Avatar
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    Just bumping this up. There is another thread started that asks questions answered here.
    Morgan

  8. #48
    Boolit Buddy
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    Morgan,

    I have a slew of 45 ACP and 40 SW to pull. Where would I get an extended shell holder you mentioned in your instructions?

    Thanks,

    Marc

  9. #49
    Boolit Master Scrounger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc2 View Post
    Morgan,

    I have a slew of 45 ACP and 40 SW to pull. Where would I get an extended shell holder you mentioned in your instructions?

    Thanks,

    Marc

    RCBS makes them.

  10. #50
    Boolit Buddy
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    Scrounger,

    Thanks.

    Marc

  11. #51
    Boolit Master jlchucker's Avatar
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    The plier/nipper technique described by others works on cast bullets. I find visegrips even better than pliers. My experience trying to use the collet type pullers on cast bullets is that the collets do not grip the bullet tight enough in the process. They work fine with jacketed rounds, but the plier/nipper/visegrip technique is the only method that I have found successful with cast bullets--especially jacketed ones. You'll save the case but the bullet needs to go back into the lead pot.

  12. #52
    Boolit Mold
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    Here is what i have found out to work. Use a socket that will fit over the ram in your press. Put the bullet in the shell holder and put the socket over it and run the bullet up through the socket and grab it with side cutters and lower the ram. This keeps from damaging the threads in you press by running the bullet through the the threads . Works for me.

  13. #53
    Boolit Master

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    I still and for the near future use one of those kinetic bullet pullers. I do have the type that a Rock Chucker is good for, but when a non reloader friend comes over I like to pull a bullet in front of him. You would think I was playing with a kilo of Nitro, when they watch me use the hammer pull method.

    But I generally don't have one or two these days that I have to take a part.

    Jerry
    Honor is a Way of Life

    NRA Benefactor Life Member

  14. #54
    Boolit Buddy spurrit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Astorbilt View Post
    This subject came up once before, and I'll offer the same advice I did before.

    I've got both inertia and collet type pullers, which I use for jacketed bullets. For cast bullets, I prefer to pull them with end nippers, as this is the fastest.
    I do this by installing the proper shell holder in a press with no die, and raising the cartridge so the bullet protrudes above the press frame, grasp it with the nippers right at the case mouth, and lower the ram. The bullet pulls out with almost no damage, and the powder charge isn't spilled. I've had to throw away very few bullets, the slight marks are almost completely hidden when they're crimped back in.
    The only cartridges that will not work, are ones too short to protrude above the frame, and they can be done with extended shell holders.

    The type of end nipper is important, it has to be the old farrier-style, not the shoemaker-type mostly seen. I've shown three in the photo below, the short red one in the center is the old one I've been using for many years to pull bullets. The one on the left is a new Diamond brand available in hardware and farm supply stores. The one on the right, is a modern Craftsman of the type that is not able to grasp the bullet, save it for pulling nails and cotter pins.
    Morgan

    Morgan,

    The ones you're calling hoof nippers are actually for pulling shoes. Nippers have a knife blade thin edge, and a lot longer bevel. The hoof nippers are considerably more expensive. They START at about $85! A lot of farm stores sell a design that's about halfway inbetween nippers and pullers, and would be perfect for what we're discussing here, but are useless for anything to do with shoeing horses. They can generally be had for about $20-30. Hardware stores carry what's called a "tile" nipper, which, I suppose, would work, too.

  15. #55
    Boolit Buddy spurrit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmb721 View Post
    I use the hammer type. I put a couple cotton balls in the bottom so the bullet doesn't get damaged. The gas check usually comes off a cast boolit.

    I hammer on concrete floor. Doesn't work on wood bench.

    Next time, I will try with a shellholder.
    I was using my anvil, but one cold night, decided I wanted to work in the house. Grabbed a 35 lb. bumbell, and it worked great. Hold it between your knees.

    Quote Originally Posted by floridaboy View Post
    Here is what i have found out to work. Use a socket that will fit over the ram in your press. Put the bullet in the shell holder and put the socket over it and run the bullet up through the socket and grab it with side cutters and lower the ram. This keeps from damaging the threads in you press by running the bullet through the the threads . Works for me.
    A large flat washer works, too.

  16. #56
    Boolit Master Morgan Astorbilt's Avatar
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    Spurrit,
    Read my post, you quoted it. I never called them "hoof nippers". I called them "farrier-style", because as you said, they're used for pulling shoes. I'm sure you meant horse shoes, not brake shoes, which would make them "automotive style" Been around horses most of my life, pulled a loose shoe or two myself, and know how to use these tools.
    Morgan

  17. #57
    Boolit Buddy spurrit's Avatar
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    Morgan,

    I wasn't meaning to be snide, I was mostly 'splainin' for the folks from town. I know a lot of horse owners that have tried to trim their own horses, using pullers. Makes them feel better about giving me $70 a head for shoeing.

  18. #58
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    Spurrit: the only dumbell I have found around here is my BIL and he won't hold still for me clamping him between my knees. I do have a small anvil fashioned from a piece of railroad iron that serves well. DALE

  19. #59
    Boolit Master
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    Another Idea

    I made a 7/8 by 14 bushing to protect the threads in my Rock Chucker, with a 1/2+ hole through the center. Run the round up through the bushing, clamp on with a set of VISEGRIPS and then lower the ram. Boolit goes in the reject can under the lubri-sizers, but brass and primer are saved...powder could be too, I guess.

    I had to buy an impact puller to pull 44 wadcutters. I had a powder dump malfunction and pulled about 50 rounds to be sure...found two cartridges without powder...better safe than sorry.


  20. #60
    Boolit Master Morgan Astorbilt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spurrit View Post
    Morgan,

    I wasn't meaning to be snide, I was mostly 'splainin' for the folks from town. I know a lot of horse owners that have tried to trim their own horses, using pullers. Makes them feel better about giving me $70 a head for shoeing.
    Hey, can't you see by the smilies I was just pulling your leg?
    Morgan

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check