Think it up, figure it out

[Tar Heel]

Twist rate on the T/C .32-20 barrel (308 bore) is 1:10

[Digital Dan]

Thanks for that. 10 twist for both .30 and .32 will work, thought maybe that was what you had.

D

[Tar Heel]

Watch your case volume whatever you do. Large cases with real light propellent charges......bad.

[Harter66]

There is a 358 on the 6.8 also . It is geared around 225-275gr bullets for sub work. A 30 AR might get you better case choices.

[Digital Dan]

Watch your case volume whatever you do. Large cases with real light propellent charges......bad.

Therein is found my interest in small cap cases. In the data for the .30 carbine the load density hovers around 80% even with the light loads. Reason for that is the 180 grain bullet referenced, seated to SAAMI max COAL fills most of the case. Compared the data with bullet, case and powder hands on a few days back finding without compression there is little room for more than about 6 grains regardless of type. Some variability but not much.

[Tar Heel]

Somewhere on this forum is a bunch of load data for the 32-20 with heavy bullets. It was generated by the silhouette folks. I found it once with a search. It may be worth taking a look at.

[Blackwater]

Dan, your situation reminds me of a friend and shooting buddy who grew up poor and in a local turpentine town. He grew up largely with his grandpa, and spent nearly every weekend with him. The grandpa lived almost literally on the banks of the local river, and hunted, fished and trapped for a living, and did seasonal farm work for some local farmers. Their garden and the river and woods were their main source of sustenance, and they sold pelts and fish to get $ for flour, sugar and salt. He absolutely worshiped "pa," and the first time dark caught him in the Ogeechee River swamps, he was 8 yrs. old. He's the finest shot I know, has eyes like an eagle, and "woods eyes" to see even the smallest movement or feature. He learned very early that every shot counts, and he wound up helping "pa" fill the larder very regularly, and often it was with wild hogs from the swamp. He usually used his .22, a single shoot mostly, and occasionally "pa" would let him take out the "big rifle," a M-84 in .25/35 that was legendarily accurate. He loved to shoot big fish with it with the old 117 gr. FPFMJ's. In those days, you either got what you were shooting at, or you didn't, and with the .22 (LR's usually, but not always) he killed some pretty sizable hogs. However, as noted, he knew just where to put the bullet, and was fully capable of doing so, almost without exception. He was also good at getting close enough to ensure a good shot, too, which is a big part of hunting that many don't seem to appreciate any more. Getting close is the most exciting part. Personally, I won't be concerned about you whatever you use, because you obviously know where to put the bullets and CAN do just that. That's all it takes, really. I've known a fair number of guys who've used .22 LR's to kill their deer with, and I don't recall any escaping them, but they knew where to put the bullets and did so very exactingly. I once gave my buddy some 230 gr. Lee .45 TC's for his .45 Colt pistol. Called him a week later and asked if he'd gotten any deer with them. He said, "Got two." I said, "You did! Great! How did they react to the shot?" figuring he'd shot them in the heart/lung area. "Went straight down," he said. "They did!" said I. "Yep, but they usually do that when you shoot 'em in th' head." I'd forgotten he was bad to do that. Again, my only concern would be overpenetration, but you know enough, obvioiusly, to have that covered, so .... all I can say is "Good luck and good hunting." Those things can be an awful pestilence in the wrong place, no matter how good their bellies are for breakfast.

[shooter93]

Sounds a lot like the rounds the stand up shooters use and moa is not a problem for them. Even moa at 200. The 32 Miller or 32 Miller short. They shoot in your velocity range and are extremely accurate even if not breech seated.

[Aunegl]

Somewhere on this forum is a bunch of load data for the 32-20 with heavy bullets. It was generated by the silhouette folks. I found it once with a search. It may be worth taking a look at.

I've been shooting a TC 32/20 - 10" with heavy cast bullets since the late 80s. In IHSMA field pistol, I used an RCBS 7.62-135 grain spire point. In big bore production and standing classes, it was an RCBS 30-165 SIL for the chickens, pigs and turkeys. For the rams, RCBS 30-200 SIL. The powder was AA1680.

[Tar Heel]

I've been shooting a TC 32/20 - 10" with heavy cast bullets since the late 80s. In IHSMA field pistol, I used an RCBS 7.62-135 grain spire point. In big bore production and standing classes, it was an RCBS 30-165 SIL for the chickens, pigs and turkeys. For the rams, RCBS 30-200 SIL. The powder was AA1680.

Aunegl, Tom at Accurate makes a smoking bullet for the 32-20 #313120B. The picture is the last cavity on the right. I put that bullet atop of 7g of AA7 for 1250fps and she will go one MOA at 100 yards with my 4x EER scope. I size them to .313 and use NRA Alox Lube (50/50) on them. It's a fantastic bullet. Now you have a spring project!

Attachment 128634 Attachment 128635

[Digital Dan]

That be some pretty pics right there. Mould is hypnotizing.

Blackwater, my dad was raised in the same way you relate about your buddy's grandpa. His dad, my grandfather, used to ration .22 ammo in the course of the depression and tell them how many squirrel he wanted. Only head shots were permitted. Gramps was awarded a DSC at Beaurevoir in 1918 by Gen John Pershing. Apparently he had some angles covered as well.

HILLIARD, GROVER C.
Sergeant, U.S. Army
Company K, 117th Infantry Regiment, 30th Division, A.E.F.
Date of Action: October 6, 1918
Citation:
The Distinguished Service Cross is presented to Grover C. Hilliard, Sergeant, U.S. Army, for extraordinary heroism in action near Beaurevoir, France, October 6, 1918. Sergeant Hilliard volunteered and crossed an open space swept by fire from enemy machine-guns and snipers to rescue wounded comrades.
General Orders No. 37, W.D., 1919
Home Town: Dover, TN

[Aunegl]

Somewhere on this forum is a bunch of load data for the 32-20 with heavy bullets. It was generated by the silhouette folks. I found it once with a search. It may be worth taking a look at.

32-20 loads: http://forum1.aimoo.com/ihmsa/Big-Bo...s-1-32605.html

[Digital Dan]

Thank you sir!

[WALLNUTT]

There were some articles years ago in the Fouling Shot published by the CBA concerning just what you ask. If you can find those it should give you plenty of info on 30carbine and 32-20. In a factory TC barrel it is actually a 30-20 which I think would suit you better.

[Tar Heel]

Here is the heavy load data I referenced. Data starts on post #4
Also included for your use is a Google Custom Search Engine Link for this forum. It's better to use than a forum "search" within the forum. Try it out with the search engine looking for { 32-20 heavy bullet }.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...vy-bullet-load

https://www.google.com/cse/publicurl...63:ewiaanz5yoq

[Digital Dan]

Tar Heel, thank you...will keep me busy for a few!

[rockrat]

I would vote for the 32-20 (30-20 actually .308" groove). I used to shoot one out of a 14" barrel in a single shot MOA pistol in IHMSA. Used the RCBS 30-165 Sil. to good effect. You could neck the 357max down to 30 cal and use a long neck (30-30) length. Body length is 357mag length. Used to shoot that one in IHMSA too. Just used a 357mag size die for the body and a cut off 30-30 die for the shoulder/neck.

I would think about the 327 Fed. I would love to try that caliber in a rifle and see what it does. Can use carbide dies then. 32 H&R mag. would probably do all you want, but if not, then you could easily rechamber to 327Federal.

[Digital Dan]

Thanks to you all for the feedback on this project! Much to ponder as a result and not a small bit of calculation to follow up on.

I don't have any doubt this will end up as a successful adventure, but the path requires some analysis...that's the way I roll most days. The .30-20 is quite interesting, as is the .30 Reese or a possible variant. Probably I spend too much time in examination and wind up asking imponderable questions, or at least those requiring in depth examination before making a decision. Safe to say the .32 WSL is on the back burner if for no other reason than it isn't necessary as a parent cartridge.

One of the issues I consider goes to interior ballistics/MAP. There were several suggestions made for use of the .300 BO and while I'm not unmindful of its potential it is a road I'll not travel. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the cartridge, but I've a bit of indigestion as a result of matching that with the T/C Contender frame.

Reasons are fairly straightforward: SAAMI MAP is 55 KPSI for the cartridge and on assumption the barrel was so chambered it will eventually be passed on to heirs and assigns. I know full well how to load down, but having been in the reloading game, to include wildcats, for over 40 years I've learned enough to recognize the hazards associated with those not fully conversant with the processes and limits associated with the activity. READ: Kids... Additionally, I recognize what is possible with cast bullets, but rather prefer the sedate and easier path. I'm not willing to spend the time required to develop bullet alloys, dimensional compatibility etc. that might be required for success at such high pressures. Put another way, it will be my toy, built expressly for my use and purposes. I do not concern myself with whether or not it will be equally functional at later dates with more conventional bullets and load theory, but at the same time, I decline the opportunity to create a headache or hazard down the road.

I've been shooting the Contender for more than a few years and there be some very good reasons for keeping pressures mild to moderate for that platform.

Thanks again, the responses were quite helpful!

D

[Digital Dan]

In the FWIW Dept. I have to thank you all for your comments and suggestions. They have led to a modest change in course which will have me using the .357 case modified in form very similar to the .30 Reese I think. 180 gr. .308 cast, 1:12" twist. As indicated previously I have no interest in supersonic velocity with this project and will almost certainly move the shoulder lower than the Reese case. Just because....

In the course of investigating internal ballistics parameters yesterday I discovered something that was a mild surprise. Given the internal capacity of the proposed case with bullet seat depth a constant, the weight of 7 different powders varied over the range of 46%. I did not anticipate such a large spread.

The powders used in the survey:
Li'l Gun - 9.5 gr
WW231 - 6.7 gr
Bullseye - 8.2 gr
2400 - 8.2 gr
SR4759 - 6.1 gr
WW540 - 9.3 gr
700X -5.1 gr

Everything at this point is preliminary and subject to change. As the project develops I will provide updates.

Thanks again!