Are there really so few of us? (Or, why do gun companies keep missing the boat?)

[44 Special]

A 5 shot 3" bbl GP100 in .44 Special is one of my dream revolvers.

Yep, that's my dream revolver too.

[Petrol & Powder]

"...........Basically, zero corporate pride; everything's about the weekly profit/loss sheet........"

I hear you but reality must intrude. General Motors doesn't exist to make cars and S&W doesn't exist to make guns. Businesses exist to make MONEY. If your company goes bankrupt you will not be building/selling ANYTHING!
Now, some companies are able to turn a profit at different price points. Rolls Royce produces far fewer cars per year than GM but their profit margin on each car is far greater. I would also dare say that GM makes more total profit than Rolls. However Rolls Royce and GM are hardly in competition with each other. The same is true with Holland & Holland vs. Remington. Quality costs money and if there's a big enough demand for that quality you can make a profit but if there isn't...... you can't lose money on each unit and stay in business for long.
A big part of engineering is finding ways to produce an acceptable product while keeping the cost down. Sometimes those cost cutting measures are met with less than enthusiastic consumers. [MIM parts come to mind, as do post 1964 Winchesters] Sometimes cost cutting is embraced by the consumers (The Remington 870 shotgun for example)
The entire endeavor is one big compromise. How big is the market, at what price point, at what level of quality and how much money do we need to make to stay in business?
S&W could build revolvers that cost as much as a Korth but they wouldn't be able to sell very many.
I completely agree with your statement about lack of pride but the ultimate question is, "what is good enough and how much are you willing to pay for it?"

[Thumbcocker]

The companies are making a boat load of money selling Tupperware pocket pistols to soccer moms.

[John Allen]

44 happens to be my favorite caliber too. My guns are mainly magnums but I have quite a few and almost always take one with me to the range.

[Petrol & Powder]

The companies are making a boat load of money selling Tupperware pocket pistols to soccer moms.

Good! Which firearm company stocks should I buy?

[MakeMineA10mm]

44 happens to be my favorite caliber too. My guns are mainly magnums but I have quite a few and almost always take one with me to the range.

I caught the bug badly. Have 44 Russian, 44 Colt, 44WCF, 44 Spl., 44 Magnum, and 444 Marlin. Thought hard about getting a 404 Jeffrey, but it's .006" too small. . Still thinking about how to get a 44 American.

[oger]

Is there a real problem with the forcing cone on the 696? Sure it's thin but I have had no problems using real special loads not Elmer Keiths version of a special load. If you want a mag. load use a mag pistol. My Mountain gun really isn't that much heavier than the 696 although it is wider.

[MakeMineA10mm]

A few of them split. Not clear on why and how, but the 696 does have one of the thinnest barrels at the forcing cone I've ever seen...

[bedbugbilly]

I don't own a 44 spec. but it's on my "to do" list. I'm in the "old fart" class and like revolvers over anything else but primarily SA revolvers. If and when I get one, it will probably be a Uberti Colt clone.

Right now, I primarily am in love with the 38 spl. - enough that I have way too many of them ad really should weed out a half dozen or so. Anyway . . . as far as revolvers go, I really think there could possibly be far more that prefer the 38/357 and probably because they have never had the opportunity to shoot a 44? May be wrong on that.

As someone mentioned though - just take a look when you are at a range - revolvers seem to be in the minority but there is sure an over abundance of anything from .380 up through 45 in semis. I was discussing the revolver versus semi "thing" with a friend who owns a very busy gun shop - they sell many firearms in a year. He said that all I had to do was stand back and watch the customers come in and see what they looked at. The majority, especially younger folks, all want the semi-autos. Who knows what causes it - my generation grew up with cowboys, white hats and six shooters in our books, movies and the fairly new invention of TV. Today . . take a look at what the movies portray as well as TV . . and I won't even bring up the "Zombie" thing which I don't have a clue about.

Basically, I think it all comes down to what the market demands - and the demand evidently isn't enough to get more 44s made. It's too bad though. I'd like to see Ruger do more in regards to a good "carry" 44 that would sell at an affordable price. I'd like it even more it they would come up with a better choice as I would certainly purchase a "kit gun" or "general purpose" revolver in 44 spl. with a 3" barrel just to have the heavier punch of the 44 over the 38 once in a while. And let's face it - for those of us that reload - it certainly isn't going to break anyone to add the 44 to their list of reloading possibilities - a set of Lee dies (or whatever), a Lee DC mold and some brass will put you into another caliber at a reasonable price without breaking the bank.

But, until the demand is there, I just don't see a big expansion in the 44 offerings happening. But, I've been wrong before.

[captaint]

A GP100 in 44 Spec would be just the ticket. Only, mine would have to be in 6". Don't care if it's big and heavy. It won't be my carry gun. It WOULD be a fun gun,though... And a 5 shot cylinder would be OK, too.. My only 44Spec is a single action army, and I do love shooting that gun. Mike

[shoot-n-lead]

If one thousand of us could get together and commission a special edition of an existing gun, it could happen, but the task of selling them through normal distribution,makes it daunting. I don't happen to have the 3-5 million it would take to fund such an endeavor. Especially in these times of shortages--when was the last time you saw a box of 44 Specials on the shelf of your local gun store--odd ball calibers just don't have mass appeal. Now don't get me wrong, my guns are not for sale, but I realize that my taste for the exotic is not shared by the multitude, and I have my brass already, and I cast. GOLDEN!

Attachment 127066

Look, we all have 44 special guns and the means to cast and reload for them. And, it would not be daunting at all for Ruger to get rid of 1000 44 special DA carry guns...just let it be known that they had produced them. I am not talking about making them a catalog item...just a limited run.

To say that a company that is selling a million guns a year cannot get rid of a limited run of 1000 guns...is a bit ridiculous. One ad in each of the 4 top handgun rags would have them gone in no time and they advertise in all of them anyway. This is just case of they do not want to go to the trouble of doing it...and that is their prerogative and I already have fine carry 44 special's ...so, it is really doesn't matter, anyway.

And, to call the 44 special "exotic" is a bit of stretch, also.

[MakeMineA10mm]

Look, we all have 44 special guns and the means to cast and reload for them. And, it would not be daunting at all for Ruger to get rid of 1000 44 special DA carry guns...just let it be known that they had produced them. I am not talking about making them a catalog item...just a limited run.

To say that a company that is selling a million guns a year cannot get rid of a limited run of 1000 guns...is a bit ridiculous. One ad in each of the 4 top handgun rags would have them gone in no time and they advertise in all of them anyway. This is just case of they do not want to go to the trouble of doing it...and that is their prerogative and I already have fine carry 44 special's ...so, it is really doesn't matter, anyway.

And, to call the 44 special "exotic" is a bit of stretch, also.

Well, If you believe the magazine articles, Lipsey's had to order 2000 of the 357-size flattop framed 44 Specials to get Ruger to produce it. They ordered 1000 in 4-5/8" and 1000 in 5-1/2".

I'll call Lipsey's tomorrow and see if they could do 1000 4" GP-100s in blue and another 1000 in stainless...

[rintinglen]

The reason the gun companies keep missing the boat is because it is such a small one and hard to hit.

The way that Ruger sells a million guns a year is not through making limited runs of specialty items. It is through making and selling commonly desired items at an affordable price. If you don't think the 44 special is off the beaten track, go to a busy range and wait until you see somebody come in with one to shoot. Do not hold your breath. It is a cartridge for the aficionado, not the hoi polloi.

I'd spring for a 4 inch GP 100 stainless, though.

[robertbank]

What Ruger should do is build a HP-100 as in a gun larger than the GP-100 but smaller than the Redhawk and make it in three calibers, 44 Special, 44Mag, and 45Colt with a barrel length of 4.2" or 105.1MM. Just use the same design as the GP-100 only one size bigger...a tweener if you need a name for it. The Redhawk is just to bg for the purpose at hand.

To the OP change out the mainspring and trigger return spring on your GP-100 and you will fall in love with the DA trigger pull. I shoot the GP-100 4.2" in IDPA with a 686 4" as back-up. My GP-100 has a better DA pull than the Smith albeit not by much, and weighs one ounce less. I have done nothing to the GP-100 but shoot it. My 686 is a No Dash,

Take Care

Bob

[GLL]

I have been a big fan of the .44 Special for many years and have accumulated a variety of S&W models. Although I love the old pre-war N-frames I find the newer 4” 624 to be the most practical.
Some years ago my local dealer could not give these guns away so made up sets in the factory wooden case and even included the tools. He had trouble selling them at $395 so I made a deal for several. I have found the 4” to be the perfect carry gun for me when working the mountains of the desert southwest ! 240 gr. 432423HP from MP over 6.5 grains of Unique works for me !



A person who does not reload should not consider buying a .44 Special !

Jerry

[robertbank]

That gun is pure art!


Bob

[gmsharps]

I have Colt New Frontier in 44spl and i'm keeping it.

gmsharps

[robsguns]

Exhuming this thread from the dead, just to say, you all got what you asked for. The GP-100 3" stainless .44 special, and Lipsey's GP-100 5" blued .44 special. Someone must have been listening.

[Tackleberry41]

Everybody seems to know why few make 44 spcls. I cant think of a single person in the last 30 yrs of shooting that owned one. I have never been to a range and seen someone shooting one. Never been in a shop and heard someone ask for 44 spcl ammo. I have never picked up a piece of 44 spcl brass. Its like 38 super, yes its popular with a narrow slice of shooters. Its rare to see 38 super on a shelf for sale. Shops don't carry it as few ever ask for it.

Some have pointed out, factory 44 spcl sucks. Its one of those self fulfilling prophecies. Shops don't carry the ammo as nobody buys it, nobody buys it because what there is sucks. Few business will put the effort into offering better ammo that few buy. Its the same with alot of obscure ammos some of us use. Why don't more use the 357 sig, well the ammo is expensive, and its expensive because few buy it. I doubt its more expensive to make.

So pretty much to get good performance out of a 44spcl, you have to hand load, well there went 80% of your potential customers. And its generally not recommended to use hand loads in a carry gun, so your stuck with the subpar stuff on a shelf, so you carry something else. There is just not the demand for most companies to justify making them. Guns that after the initial interest, would languish on shelves. Not like it would take 100,000 units to satisfy the 44 spcl market. One could imagine Ruger has plenty of work just filing orders for popular guns.

Yes a 44 spcl only gun is way lighter and smaller than a magnum, same as 38 and 357. But we come back to the ammo, whats available isnt any good, so whos going to carry a gun full of it. Everybody wants somebody else to go first. Ammo companies arent going to make better ammo without the guns, gun companies arent going to make the guns without the ammo, so stalemate. Just be nice if Charter arms could make a consistently decent gun.

[Wayne Smith]

I caught the bug badly. Have 44 Russian, 44 Colt, 44WCF, 44 Spl., 44 Magnum, and 444 Marlin. Thought hard about getting a 404 Jeffrey, but it's .006" too small. . Still thinking about how to get a 44 American.

The ONLY difference between the 44American and the 44Russian is the heeled boolit in the 44American. Are you sure you want to go there? This from the guy who loves his 41Colt!