How hot do you want your lead?

[Clinton]

I've been complaining about a Lee mold I have that casts too small. Its a C309-170. The nose of the bullet is usually around .299-.300 and the driving bands barely make .308. After skimming different threads here I believe I may have my lead too cold. I have a Lyman lead thermometer and I usually keep the temp right about in the middle of where it says "wheel weights" at 650-675 degrees. Is this too cold? Is this what's causing my molds to drop bullets too small?

[geargnasher]

What's your alloy? That determines what general range your alloy temperature should be in, and tune to the top or bottom of that range and adjust casting pace for optimum mould temperature to manipulate final size.

WW usually cast the fattest at around 725F with the mould cool enough to drop shiny bullets. I've never been able to get good fillout from a Lee mould with it cool enough to cast WW shiny, though, usually have to run it faster and into the "light frost" stage, which takes off a couple of ten-thousandths from the final diameter. A tiny bit of tin, half to one percent, can make a big difference in as-cast size.

Gear

[Clinton]

It's straight COWW. I suppose I should turn up the heat and add some tin. Whats the best source of tin to add to the mix?

[geargnasher]

Lead-free, solid-core plumber's solder is a good source of tin if you look for it locally. Don't overdo it. I'd shoot for for 725F and see how it goes.

Gear

[Clinton]

Ok will do thanks.

[Beagle333]

Definitely warm it up a little. I leave my PID on 730° for my rifle boolits.

[Clinton]

Yeah I guess I should have thought of this earlier. I guess the temp range for wheel weights on the lyman thermometer is a bit misleading.

[RED333]

Yeah I guess I should have thought of this earlier. I guess the temp range for wheel weights on the lyman thermometer is a bit misleading.

Yep, the temps shown on the gauge face are for the temp the alloy melts at.
Give you an idea of what alloy you have, not for casting temp.

[Yodogsandman]

I cast up a bunch of Lee 309-170F's two weeks ago. I used 9 3/4lb COWW and 1/4lb of 50/50 lead/tin plumbers bar solder. Ran my casting pot at 725F (PID). My boolits were just shy of .309" and I sized and gas checked them with a .309" sizing die. I always wait at least 3 weeks to shoot air cooled boolits and have not shot any of these, yet. Other batches have shot fine in my 30-30.

Clinton, have you shot any of those, yet?

[Clinton]

Yeah I couldn't get them to hit worth a damn. But they were undersized and I knew that.

[Clinton]

So any solder that says "lead free" is what I want? I know nothing about solder.

[prs]

Clinton, the solder package will tell you the composition, but it will be essentially "pure" tin. It is expensive. Search for threads here about seeking pewter at yard sales and such too.

prs

[John Boy]

Regardless of the alloy be cast with:
* Warm the mold
* Heat the pot melt to the temperature so with a 5 second pour into the mold, the sprue puddle frosts in 5 seconds. Hold the pot melt at that temperature
All molds are like women - they're different and require a specific temperature for the 5 second frost

[44man]

Gear has it, just the right temps are best for fill out. Too hot will make boolits smaller. Once you see frost, they are smaller.
I run about 730* to 750* and pre heat my mold to 500*.
If that boolit is for a Marlin 30-30, it is still too small. I made my molds to cast a .311" drive and a .301" bore ride.

[Foto Joe]

If you're gonna use solder try to avoid blends with silver or copper. You're pretty much looking for 97/3 which would be 97% tin and 3% antimony I "think". It's been a while since I've used solder since adding tin that way will cost you around $40 per pound but it's a good way to get to know the attributes of adding Sn.

A wise sage on this forum once told me, "You can cast good boolits with straight COWW's but add 2% tin to the mix and you can cast GREAT boolits."

I think that your size problem has more to do with the lack of tin in the alloy than it does the Lee mold.

[runfiverun]

Regardless of the alloy be cast with:
* Warm the mold
* Heat the pot melt to the temperature so with a 5 second pour into the mold, the sprue puddle frosts in 5 seconds. Hold the pot melt at that temperature
All molds are like women - they're different and require a specific temperature for the 5 second frost

5 second frost..... phhhht you obviously don't know my wife.. more like 2..

I use a 5 count after filling too, and sometimes the frost hasn't come yet when I open the mold.
each mold being just a bit different is right on though, once you figure one out,,,, write it down in a note-book.

[44man]

Naww, I have a drawer full of molds, hundreds and all work the same. I have no notebook. It is feel as you cast. It is experience, nothing measured by time. It is like Star Wars, feel the dark side!
Getting it right is instant. It is the flow of nature.
Best to buy pure tin or find some old 50-50 body solder. Solder is way too costly. I used to get 1# bars of tin for $4 but it has gone up. Midway usually has it even though I hate to buy from them.
Go online and you can find it much cheaper.

[rsrocket1]

Did you try beagling the mold as was suggested earlier? There is a Hobby Lobby in Biloxi that should have the copper tape you need for about $7. You get 36 yards and you need 2 sections of about 2" on either side of the mold. It's 1.25 mils thick and you can stack layers if you need (at least 2 high successfully).

[bangerjim]

Naww, I have a drawer full of molds, hundreds and all work the same. I have no notebook. It is feel as you cast. It is experience, nothing measured by time. It is like Star Wars, feel the dark side!
Getting it right is instant. It is the flow of nature.
Best to buy pure tin or find some old 50-50 body solder. Solder is way too costly. I used to get 1# bars of tin for $4 but it has gone up. Midway usually has it even though I hate to buy from them.
Go online and you can find it much cheaper.

Sounds like me! I do not use a thermometer or controller and cast perfect boolits. It is all experience, voodoo, patience, and mabe a little luck of the Irish?

Preheat the mold to FULL CASTING TEMP, not 500 or 600F, on an electric hotplate. Works miracles! And you can pre-heat your feed ingots also! Saves melt re-cycle time

As said watch the freeze-over time of the sprue.

I water drop all my boolits to just cool them off. I listen for that sharp sizzle when they hit the water. No or hardly any sizzle and you are too cold. A steam "explosion" and you are too hot. Only time and experience will let you know the sound you are listening for.

I only go buy expereince and setting my 4-20 dial to ~6.5....Works every time. Mabe I just hold my mouth right?!?!?!?!?

Good luck figuring out your casting routine. But 675 is too cold for your pot pour lead.

bangerjim

[geargnasher]

Actually, 675 is NOT too cold at all for an alloy that melts at 575, but it will likely make smaller bullets. Sometimes we NEED to do that, as in getting a fat bore rider to chamber in a certain rifle.

General pot temperature rule for any alloy has been described in books since the invention of cast bullet manuals: 100 degrees above full liquidus. Give or take depending on exactly what you need the alloy and mould to do. Using "the force" is fine if you have an unusual concentration of Midi-Chlorians, but for the rest of us, using a thermometer and the known constants of metal alloys is usually best for getting the same results every time. A notebook IS handy for this.

Bangerjim may not take a very scientific approach to his casting and yet it works for him, HOWEVER he doesn't post much about shooting cast in rifles for competition-grade accuracy or extremely high velocity. Consider the context of the advice given. For most pistol work, it really doesn't matter that much as long as you can cast a bullet with a good base. For other things, bullet quality and repeatable casting techniques matters a great deal. Context is always an important consideration when reading generalized advice.

Gear