Any advantage to lubing over the top of Hi-Tek or PC?

[Alley Cat]

Is there any advantage to using traditional lube over the top of either Hi-Tek or PC'd boolits? Has anyone tried this yet?

[leadman]

I have lubed over the top of Hi-Tek. I did this for a couple of pistols that did not have any leade cut in the barrel and it was cutting the HT and leading the barrels. It did work to stop the leading in these pistols.

I am going to start some testing soon with the 30-06 to find out if I can push a boolit to close to jacketed speeds for hunting. The alloys will be different and some will be heat treated.

I have obtained jacketed bullet velocities in the 30-06 and in the 223 Rem so I will try adding a wax based lube to the Hi-Tek to see if the accuracy can be improved. My previous tests in which I obtained 3,619 fps in the 223 Rem and about 2,450 fps in the 30-06 were with heat treated linotype. Good for paper and steel but would make a mess out of and animal.

[bbqncigars]

One thing that will do for sure is enhance muzzle smoke.

[Pablo 5959]

I was wandering the same thing concerning my revolvers.
.430 is a little tight going through the cylinder.
I need to tap the boolit through my Smith 629.

Im not ready to ream my cylinders out yet.
Not getting any leading using the PC, I was just thinking it might cause a little less stress on the gun.

I guess I'll have to worm up the old bottle of Alox and see.
Pablo

[mdi]

I was wandering the same thing concerning my revolvers.
.430 is a little tight going through the cylinder.
I need to tap the boolit through my Smith 629.

Im not ready to ream my cylinders out yet.
Not getting any leading using the PC, I was just thinking it might cause a little less stress on the gun.

I guess I'll have to worm up the old bottle of Alox and see.
Pablo

I'd run the .430" bullets through a Lee .429" sizing die before I'd try lubing a PCed bullet. A .001" larger bullet, even PCed, won't make any difference being swaged through the cylinder throats. But I suggest you measure again, a "tight fit" of a .430" bullet means a cylinder throat .430" or smaller, which seems too small to me (none of my .44 revolvers has a throat dimension less than .431", my 629 included)...

[Pablo 5959]

I'd run the .430" bullets through a Lee .429" sizing die before I'd try lubing a PCed bullet. A .001" larger bullet, even PCed, won't make any difference being swaged through the cylinder throats. But I suggest you measure again, a "tight fit" of a .430" bullet means a cylinder throat .430" or smaller, which seems too small to me (none of my .44 revolvers has a throat dimension less than .431", my 629 included)...

The .429 sizer is on the way.
It's to bad lee doesn't sell just the die and plunger.
The wife wants to know why I need so many of those round red things.

But ya, at .430 I have to tap them through with a wood dowel and brass hammer.
when I mic them after running them through the cylinder there still at .430 and no noticeable PC is removed.

My 686 is a little tight also but at .358, I can push one through with a dowel hitting the dowel with the heal of my hand.

This is why I was thinking a little alox might not hurt.
Pablo

[roberts1]

I have done it with 45-45-10 and hf red with no problems. I don't know if it hurt or helped. They all shot and were as accurate as I could hold.

[bangerjim]

There has always been the unknow of the lube being down in the brass and degrading the PC over time. No one has tested it as most seem to shoot stuff as fast as they load it!!!!!

I use absolutly NO lube or have seen no need for it on any of the many PC'd cals I do.

banger

[roberts1]

That is a good point and I have not tested the long term affects tho I do have some that are lubed and pcd sitting in a box im not sure what the difference is between that and a loaded round. It would be easy enough to load and date one and give it a year or so but then again it doesn't appear that lube is needed anyway so maybe its just a moot point. I was just trying to work thru a leading issue which was a sizing problem and the pc took care of that giving me a couple thousands more in diameter. Lubing just seemed like an extra precaution. I guess I could try some unlubed and see where that takes me.

[bangerjim]

If you do, store some PC/lube loaded rounds for several months and then break them down to see if the PC is still hard or look for any degradation by the components of the lube. Just shooting them will not really tell.

JPW will dissolve many plastics over time, as could many of the constituents normally used in most lubes, comercial and home brews. The culprits will be any hydrocarbon derivitives that may be in there.

Let us know! This question comes up now and then, but I know of no one that has dedicated some loaded rounds to this test.

bangerjim

[roberts1]

will do I have some 44 special brass that I rarely use ill stick some 240 grain swc that I have which are already pc and lubed. How long do you suppose I should wait to break them down?

[upnorthwis]

As bbqncigars said about enhancing muzzle smoke. In a 3-gun match we had to shoot thru several drums attached end to end. After only a few shots the smoke was so bad could hardly see the targets. That's when I quit lubing PC'd boolits.

[roberts1]

Ok I have 3 rounds of 44 special loaded, dated and set aside for future scientific knowledge. They are 240gr swc with hf red and 45-45-10 lube in starline cases. The suspense is killing me...

[LAGS]

Even with PC and lubed, I dont think you are going to be able to reach J bullet speeds.
The Pressure goes up too, and the Lead Boolits even with a GC is only so hard and subject to deformation.
I did some experimentation, and find that the Lubed PC'ed boolits , dont shoot as clean as a boolit that is just PC'ed.
It took longer to clean the barrel when they were lubed over PC.

[roberts1]

I don't think the goal for most is to surpass jacketed speeds. For me anyway, I was just looking for a way so size them up a bit to help with a leading issue and have an alternative to messy lubes. Plus the fun of it all for me is tinkering with something new. Interesting finds from you experiments in regards to barrel cleaning.

[popper]

Even with PC and lubed, I dont think you are going to be able to reach J bullet speeds.

Hodgdon says 2450 starting load for a 168 from a 24" 1:12 jacketed (H335), I got 2450 with 168 gr. HF red from a 1:10 16" carbine, near MOA (1 1/2). 24" shot the same but fps should be higher, didn't chrony. I haven't found a need to lube on top of PC. I did chrony the BO at starting load fps in a 1:7 carbine but accuracy wasn't great. I haven't tried to exceed max jacket loads but that is only 50 fps more in the BO. I don't see a problem.