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Thread: Is Winchester bulk .22LR ammo Garbage,,, or is it just me?

  1. #21
    Boolit Bub
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    Hi, i just have to toss in my opinion.

    As a competition shooter i shoot alot of 22 lr. (around 6000 to 10000 a year)

    Iīm not good enough to have use for the expensive selected/handpicked match stuff.

    But

    I would never, ever buy bulk!
    22lr is a sensitive little cartridge that needs to be packed separatly.

    Personally a only shoot CCI standard velocity #00035(?)
    I prefer the 100 box but itīs hard to find these days.
    I buy them 5000 or 10000 at the time.
    I have had one (1) fail to fire in over 20yr thatīs was ammo related ( several due to dirty gun)

    CCI have enough power to cycle both my Walther PP and my very hard cycled Browning Buckmark.
    They are cleanburning and have lube thatīs not sticky.

    This is MY personal opinion based on my experience and i donīt get payed from CCI. ( I wish i was!)

  2. #22
    Boolit Master
    smokeywolf's Avatar
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    Last time I shot 22LR was at least 1-1/2 years ago. Had noticeable problems with a bulk box of Remington. Problems included extraction, resistance to chambering, accuracy and fail to cycle a semi-auto.

    Next time I bought 22LR I bought CCI; still haven't dipped into that.

    smokeywolf
    A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms *shall not be infringed*.

    "The greatest danger to American freedom is a government that ignores the Constitution."
    - Thomas Jefferson

    "While the people have property, arms in their hands, and only a spark of noble spirit, the most corrupt Congress must be mad to form any project of tyranny."
    - Rev. Nicholas Collin, Fayetteville Gazette (N.C.), October 12, 1789

  3. #23
    Boolit Master
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    For range plink'n I have a distaste for plain lead bullets in my semi autos , Win wildcats , Colibri s , and Centurion are ok in my pumps and revolvers . Remington s golden ect are junk so far , mostly duds , or inconsistent , and failure to feed or fire . Winchester copper washed are good as are CCI mini mags . I have been surprised at Federal bulk packed 550 . they are good in my semi s too .

  4. #24
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Wit the increase in demand and hoarding the last few years manufacturers have tried to increase production not only to meet demand and satisfu customers but to cash in on the increase, Speeding up the equipment can cause problems with consistency, some things are better running a little slower allowing for better quality. The other side to this is the people running this equipment can only work 12-12 hour days 7 days a week for so long before fatiuge sets in and tired workers arnt as efficent. Then when tired appathy starts to set in, the Its good enoygh syndrome. At the increased speeds equipment wears faster breaks down more and dosnt function as well. New rimfire lines are being installed and set up in several factories and Ive read of 2 new factories being built to run rimfire ammo. Between adding the various new rimfire rounds, new shooters, and hoarders demand has greatly outpaced production. All you can do is call customer service accuratly describe the problems being had and let the upper managmant know. You can try diffrent brands and grades of ammo to find what works in your firearms then stock up if possible. I bought 8 cases ( 5000 rds a case) of .22 rimfire from the dcm years ago that was great ammo but it is gone now. It was 90.00 a case at the time. It was pacaged in cmp/dcm white boxes and I am pretty sure it was federal 711. Shot very good and functioned in severything we feed it thru. If the manufacturers dont recieve any complaints they think everything is fine and dandy. Complaints are what gets things changed in the process.

  5. #25
    Boolit Grand Master

    dragon813gt's Avatar
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    Who is adding rimfire lines? I know Remington is expanding their plant but I haven't heard any specifics.

  6. #26
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    W.R.Buchanan's Avatar
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    So I guess it ain't me.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  7. #27
    Boolit Master Airman Basic's Avatar
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    Must have couple dozen of these "bulk" containers. All empty now though. Was considering purchase of modern day bulk. Guess not, huh?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails ebay2-12-013.jpg_thumbnail0.jpg  

  8. #28
    Boolit Buddy


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    My son & I shot a Rimfire Poker Match yesterday, using Remington Thunderbolt. It was from a bulk box I had purchased back in the summer, $50.00 ...... Anyway, after the match we shot the remaining ammo through his 20" Bull Barrel 10-22 that I put together 2 weeks ago, and his Marlin 995 that I got him for his 14th Birthday in 1996. Had 3-4 FTF's out of that 500 round box, none during the match fortunately. He wanted to blow it all off since it was .... " JUNK " ....... Junk that I paid for ....

    BTW, it was pretty consistent for ringing steel at the 366 yard berm once we figured out sight pictures in the scopes. FWIW, I had bought four of those 333 Win packs a few years ago, traded them off this summer without firing any of them. Sounds like that was a good plan .....
    Livin' my dream in a little cabin on a mountain .....
    USN Vet 1972-1980, Retired CA Peace Officer, NRA Lifer
    Plank Owner - USS Jesse L. Brown (DE-1089) 17Feb73 / USS Kinkaid (DD-965) 17Jul76
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  9. #29
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Interesting. Haven't bought or shot any 333rd Win .22 ammo. Some others slamming Rem Golden
    Bullet rounds. I have run through several of these Rem bulk packs with no particular issues, shoot
    reasonably well - some guns do well, others not as accurate, no feeding issues in most guns.

    I have noticed an increase in failures to fire, but not too bad.

    Of course, I have only bought one brick of .22 since the problems began, and it is subsonic
    Rem which seems OK, not particularly accurate, though.

    Eley Sport smells exactly the same as Aguila, and apparently they use Eley primer technology,
    strange smell, not like other ammo.

    Bill
    If it was easy, anybody could do it.

  10. #30
    Boolit Master TheDoctor's Avatar
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    I haven't SO FAR had any issues with Winchester bulk. I will not compare it to any of the CCI standard velocity, but you get what you pay for. Sometimes. Used to buy Remington golden in the 100 plastic packs, had a MKII that loved it. Never had an issue. Best paper packaged I have ever used are CCI blazers, but they do have the plastic spacers in each 50 round box. Aguila of any flavor has always been abysmal for me, regardless of which gun I use. Found a new candidate for worst ever this weekend, though it may be this particular lot. Federal, white boxed, 325 round, says auto-match and target grade performance on box. Had several rounds that the rim must have been solid! Pin would barely dent it. Try the same round in a different gun, again, light strike, no fire. Some would not fire at all. Rim diameter may have been off also. Had a first time ever, for me at least, double feed in a Marlin 60. Gun did that twice in less than 50 rounds. Did not even know that it was possible. Switch ammo to CCI, gun functioned flawlessly. This stuff, even though it claims target grade performance, is NO WHERE CLOSE to the excellent Federal ultra gold I used to get when it was cheap, $6.00 a box cheap. Hate to see what that stuff would cost now! And what would its quality be?

  11. #31
    Boolit Master trixter's Avatar
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    I had a lot of issues this past spring; squeek hunting with my Marlin 60, everything that FTF, was fed into my Wards Westernfield bolt action tube fed and worked perfectly. This gun was made between 1938 & 1939; butt ugly but became beautiful to shoot squeeks. I found the Marlin extremely dirty and gave it a MAJOR cleaning, That didn't alleviate the problem, but did make me feel batter abut knowing that I was trying to shoot **** ammo. I have procured various brands during this shortage, and checked each on gun by gun for consistency. Now I know which ones will cycle the Marlin 60, (the fussiest), almost everything will go through my Ruger 10-22, and of course the bolt guns; nothing argues. Even the single shot Crickett fires everytime you put one in and cock it. Research pays off.

  12. #32
    Boolit Grand Master

    mdi's Avatar
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    None of my Ruger 22 LRs have a problem with Winchester ammo and of course my Marlin and Savage bolt actions will shoot anything. But I've not experienced any FTF with the Winchester bulk stuff, not as accurate as most, but all went bang. The only rimfire ammo I won't buy is anything made by Remington. I've had trouble in semi-auto and dirty, poor accuracy in all my 22s (it doesn't even feed consistently in a Remington rifle!)
    My Anchor is holding fast!

  13. #33
    Boolit Master
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    I stopped using Remington .22 ammo because of the number of FTF rounds with Golden bullet and particularly Thunderbolt. Even my Squires & Bingham with a chisel ended firing `pin` failed to get the stuff to work consistently.

    I switched to Blazer and no longer have problems.

    ukrifleman.

  14. #34
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Years ago one of my schuetzen friends turned me on to Federal Auto Match™ at an event we were shooting down in Asheville, NC. I've tried to keep a reasonable supply (the equivalent of at least 2-3 bricks) for what shooting I get to do with my 22s these days. It isn't the most accurate I can find, but it is reliable and reasonably accurate, and it functions well in all of my 22s regardless of action type. I wouldn't take it to a 22 BR match or anything, but it's my go-to for practice and plinking, so I still pick it up when I can find it. YMMV, but if you get some reasonably priced and it doesn't work for you, just sell it to me!

    Froggie
    "It aint easy being green!"

  15. #35
    Boolit Master

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    I just find it funny because when I was a kid I used to worship having enough money to buy a full block of Winchester .22 LR and shoot away the whole afternoon and again the next day. I don't remember hardly any failures and I think they were more from the amount of crud building up in the chamber. That filth was the only reason I would close up for the day. Now thirty years later I can't get through a red bulk 333 box without a failure per magazine. That's through a Henry, 10/22, M&P 15-22, Nylon 66, and a MK III standard. The MK III does have the least trouble though.

  16. #36
    Boolit Master MarkP's Avatar
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    Back in the Mid 90's I noticed one day while practicing off hand shooting in a shooting tunnel some shots made a crack and others did not. Being curious I did a test with Winchester, Remington, & Federal bulk 22 ammo. The Remington and Winchester velocities' had large spreads, large enough that the velocity of some were below sonic, at that time the Federal bulk was noticably more consistent. After that I switched to buying only Federal bulk packs.

    I did however buy some Remington bulk packs (Golden Bullets) after the 2008 shortage they shot well, as in I do not recall misfires.

    I remember Winchester Wildcats and Remington Thunderbolts having several misfires, that was at least 25 years ago so nothing new.

    I would use Federal match for competition these have a negative dimple in the center of the head, the dimple is larger than a heavy strike on a shot shell primer.

  17. #37
    Boolit Master bbqncigars's Avatar
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    I had the same experience as TheDoctor with some execrable Federal AutoMatch that I bought recently to test. Failures of every kind in all the guns I tried it in. Huge variations in velocity with corresponding lack of accuracy. I'll stick with CCI. The S&W 41 just loooves Blazer in the original barrel, and Minimags are favored in the Clark Custom pipe. That Federal stuff must have completely bypassed q.c., even worse than the last golden Remington I tried years ago. Now the new Norma stuff shoots nice, but I don't like having to wipe lube off my hands after handling it.
    "Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most." A. Brilliant

  18. #38
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    W.R.Buchanan's Avatar
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    I just bought a brick of the Norma T22 ammo today from Mid South. $5.40 per box so I got 10 boxes.. I already had a brick that I bought from them a year ago so I'll shoot that up first.

    Prices are coming down, Slowly but surely.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  19. #39
    Boolit Master
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    Try some Remington bulk ammo and you will think more kindly toward the Winchester. I quit buying the Remington in 1988 I did not quit on the Winchester until 1992. The last Federal i bought was in 2006. I am almost down to a hundred thousand rounds.
    The man who invented the plow was not bored. He was hungry.

  20. #40
    Boolit Master
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    Haven't had any reliable sources of any 22lr ammo, but would be willing to try the Winchester out of curiosity.

    As far as **** ammo, Remington thunderbolt is it! I've tried it off and on for decades and you can be guranteed for ftf's and a filthy gun. On the flip side I've popped nearly 10,000 federal bulk's and they are great, just wish I could get my hands on some.

    I'm a big fan of Winchester power points for hunting, still have a few boxes stashed.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check