8mm Mauser questions

[zubrato]

I've heard folks rave about the m die before, but lee is a good deal and I'm already going thin investing in all these reloading dies, mold, sizer, trimmer and gas checks.

I'm already skipping the case forming die and hoping I can rock out with the full length sizing die alone :/

So is there anything the m die does differently that the lee won't? I'd like to have one but cant afford the cost of individual expanding parts.

[zubrato]

Ps you guys are an incredible breadth of information, and experience all presented logically, so for all the posters before and after this post, I really thank you for your time and effort.

My quest for information surrounding case forming and 8mm cast load data continues!

[Maximumbob54]

I've heard folks rave about the m die before, but lee is a good deal and I'm already going thin investing in all these reloading dies, mold, sizer, trimmer and gas checks.

I'm already skipping the case forming die and hoping I can rock out with the full length sizing die alone :/

So is there anything the m die does differently that the lee won't? I'd like to have one but cant afford the cost of individual expanding parts.

YES!!!!

Check out their diagram:

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/d...idge=26&die=52

It's not just about flaring the case mouth so you don't shave lead; you also want to be sure the bullet goes in as straight as possible to avoid run-out. The M die puts a step in the case mouth that holds the bullet straight up for seating. It's so positive about it that I even started using them for pistol loading as the shell plate will often make the bullet fall sideways during rotation. They are an easy answer to what isn't a massive deal and thus you often hear the "solution in search of a problem" by people that don't feel the desire to use them. Like many reloading tools though you don't have to use them but if you do then you may find you really like them. I know I do.

[CHeatermk3]

The Lee "universal expander" tool does not expand the case mouth, it Bells it. You can do the same thing by using a pair of needle-nose pliers. With the jaws closed, place the case mouth over the jaws and push gently while turning the case--The M-die worrks as Maxbob54 stated amd if I'm not mistaken the mandrels are interchangeable in the same die body.

[Beagle333]

The Lee "universal expander" tool does not expand the case mouth, it Bells it. You can do the same thing by using a pair of needle-nose pliers. With the jaws closed, place the case mouth over the jaws and push gently while turning the case--The M-die worrks as Maxbob54 stated amd if I'm not mistaken the mandrels are interchangeable in the same die body.

All true!

[Donor8x56r]

Lee .329 works great in my 8x50R (aka Lebel) Gras single shot.I tried it in big bored Turk Mauser with no luck-nose section too large.

In 8x57 Lee 175 works for me and it seems to work better with powders like 2400 and Win WSF rather than Red Dot.Green Dot works but not better than 2400.

I shoot mostly range scrap rather than WW or anything harder so maybe that's why...

[Ben]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-arrived-today

[curator]

When making 8X57 cases from .30-06 or .270 Win, it is a good idea to take a little metal off the top of your case holder so the case will go a tiny bit farther into the full length sizing die. This insures that the newly formed case will chamber in a tightly chambered rifle. My Yugo M48 needed this but several M98 Mausers didn't. Once cases are fireformed, I set the dies to only size about 3/4 of the neck so the shoulder stays where it is. Neck sizing is even better. All of my 8X57 mausers like boolits of .325" diameter made from 50/50 wheel weight/Linotype. Smaller diameters often result in leading near the throat and accuracy that degrades after a few shots.

[zubrato]

Curator I was considering doing that, but after testing (with some difficulty feeding empty cases) they chamber just fine, and it isn't any harder to close the bolt. Was a little concerned knowing I was converting non resized 30-06 cases, but I'm very happy with the results. Spent a little time today annealing the cases, as I dont have a lot of 30-06 cases, theyre once fired range pickups and donations from a generous reloader to help get me started.
I think for my first time annealing I did a pretty decent job with regards to consistency and not over annealing, and might post up some pics tomorrow for review

PS converted some 270 cases and I really didnt give the brass enough credit. That's some magic! One split case out of 10!

BTW I found a copy of Lymans Cast bullet 3rd edition manual, and it's a lot better than the 4th, with some load data for the 181 grain boolit I feel a lot more prepared with regards to IMR 4198, H4895. I'll work up parallel loads with IMR 3031, and whichever I can find at the store tomorrow.

Now I'm just waiting on the mold, gas checks, sizer, and case neck expander to come in..

[Blammer]

get the 200gr mould, use IMR 3031 and you'll get a nice thump and some good accuracy, try for about .325 size

[zubrato]

Blammer I'll be using the 175gr Lee Mold, figured it was a safer bet for load data/popularity and I would have to size the boolit less than the .329 mold.
I'll be using the Lee .323 sizing die, once I hone it out to .325 using buckshot's article on versatility of Lee dies, with your gaschecks! just sent the MO today for the 8mm gas checks.

[UBER7MM]

get the 200gr mould, use IMR 3031 and you'll get a nice thump and some good accuracy, try for about .325 size

Blammer,

What did you use as your starting powder charge, for load developement? Please advise.

Thank you and regards,

[zubrato]

Sorry guys, stupid question..

Will a healthy double coating of 45-45-10 be enough for a non TL boolit at ~2000 fps in a 23" barrel?

I'm looking at pan lubing with Barry Dars as an alternative if necessary, but I'd like to hit the nail on the head on my first go..

[cosmoline one]

If you open the 270 brass to .30 caliber first (before 8mm)you won't get splits.Also, I've never bothered with annealing and I'm getting good case life.

[Blammer]

30gr of IMR 3031 is a good place to start, as I recall I ended there too.

also 31 gr of IMR 4895 did well too with 190 gr or so

[ak_milsurp]

I use the Lee 324-175 with aluminum gc's, sized .325 in my Turk mausers. 16 gr 2400, CCI 200 Primers. Cast from ACWW, Ceresin Purrple lube.It's as accurate as Yugo M75 sniper ammo at 100 yd. Recoil is negligible. Very pleasant an fun to shoot. No leading so far

[zubrato]

Blammer, sorry if I didn't catch earlier, did you mean 30gr imr3031 for a 175-180 gr boolit? I'll be casting them up in a few days, and bought a lb of IMR3031 but I'm having some trouble finding load data, and I've checked about 5-6 manuals so far. Only Lyman 44th has data for a 168 cast boolit starting charge at 33 min.
How far did you work up 3031?
Did you stick to 30gr due to the accuracy?

[hc18flyer]

Curator, I shot my 48 Yugo today foe the first time and found the bolt took a little too much effort to close? Your post got me thinking? I have an older set of Texan dies. I will make a lead chamber cast prior to reloading my next set. I received the Lee 175 grain this week and plan to cast some next week. I have been following this thread pretty closely. I did find the standard Yugo 48 sights tough to use, but didn't have access to my brothers 'leadsled', will next session. Later, Flyer

[LAGS]

@ Zubrato
Check the Lyman Cast Bullet Manual #4
It lists the 3031 for the Lee 175 gr starting at 32.5 and I think it goes up to 40 grains or so

[zubrato]

If anyone's interested, I settled on 37 grains of IMR3031 with ~186-187 gr Lee boolits. POA=POI and the recoil is pretty stout. Was exactly what I was looking for, and I've duplicated the power of surplus ammo, except now I can hold a 1.75" group at 75 yds with iron sights when prone. I could probably get better groups, since this time I had to lay on my rifle case in -10C on 4 inches of snow.
Zero leading, even with two coatings of 45/45/10 in a 23" barrel and I assume ~2000 fps. Took a look down the barrel and it's so shiny, it looks like the barrel gets cleaner with every shot! It has never been this clean, accurate, or fun!

Took a shot at 5"x6" mild steel at 100 yards standing and hit the bullseye, I never in my wildest dreams imagined that lead could divot steel THAT deep! Biggest joy was helping that old gal talk again! Was so disappointed in the accuracy and corrosive aspect of surplus ammo, and now thanks to you guys, just had an incredible weekend with the pops.

Thanks everyone!