Shooting lead through AR type rifle... Gas port blockage?

[SteveK]

I would love to shoot lead boolits with my HK MR556 upper. However, the owners manual, and a few other seemingly knowledgeable sources say that the lead plugs up the gas port and leads to improper cycling of the weapon, so DON'T DO IT! OK. That makes sense, I guess.... but, there must be some way to clean the barrel's gas port every few hundred rounds to make it all right again. Does anybody know how to do this?

Second question then: Would the lead alloy or lube used on the lead bullets make shooting lead from an AR any more provident?

Thanks.

[xacex]

Use gas checks on your boolits and it is a non issue. This has been hashed out by many of us on the board, and the consensus is that this is just a rumor. I have shot thousands of subsonic 300 blackout bullets without gas checks, super sonic with gas checks, and .22lr with a m261 in a 5.56. No problem what so ever. It seems that with supersonic there can be gas port gas cutting of a base of a boolit, but until you are above 35K PSI just a good lube to prevent leading is the only requirement. One of my rifles has at least 5K rounds of cast through it now (300 BLK) with the same gas tube.

I don't quite understand what you mean with your second question. Provident? Did you mean problematic? The problem if you call it that with lead in a 5.56 gun in the twist rate, and speed that you can shoot them. 1/7 is least desirable, and must be shot with a slow powder, at under optimal speed, 1/12 is most desirable for cast shooters with an AR15, and can shoot cast up to 2500 fps. I shoot the Blackout most with cast, and do 2100FPS with a 125 grain hollow point with decent accuracy, not competitive accuracy.

[ipijohn]

I have shot several thousand Powder Coated lead boolits through my AR's in both .223 and 300 BO. I use range lead until I get above 1500 fps then I use 50/50 range and COWW. In all loads I powder coat and GC the projectiles.

[nhrifle]

Lead works fine in a gas impingement system, you just can't drive them quite as hard as jacketed bullets due to their coming apart in flight, or so I understand it. I have personally never tried to max them out, I keep velocities around 1900 - 2000, enough for reliable function.

[Calamity Jake]

I had a Rock River 1 in 12 heavy barrel built just for CAST.
Have had no leading!!!

[seagiant]

Hi,
I shoot the 62 gr. GC NATO Mihec boolit with 19grs. of H-4895 for full function for 0-50 yd. CQB and no problems with my DD 1/7 twist CL,HF,middy barrel!

[A pause for the COZ]

Thousand of rounds through my 300 BO also a whole bunch through my 5.56 AR 1-9.

I actually have my 5.56 gas block/tube off right now. ( changing uppers)
No lead in there.

Even in the unlikely event you gum up a gas block and gas tube. ( you know some one is gona and then blame us)
A new gas block and gas tube combo would run ya $30.
Sure I have saved enough on bullets right now to buy one for every one I know. ( would just replace those parts)

[W.R.Buchanan]

I always wonder why the naysayers of Cast boolits in Gas Guns think that a smidgeon of lead will stand up to 35,000 psi.

The second question is "where is the lead that is clogging the gas system up, coming from?"

I could see if there was a burr on the hole inside the barrel and it was shaving lead each time a boolit went by,,, But then again I doubt there is going to be any burrs left in the barrel after a few jacketed bullets have been thru it.

And with a Gas Check in place I just don't understand why lead would separate itself from a boolit traveling a Warp Speed just to exit thru a small hole when there is a lot bigger hole on the end of the barrel to go thru and it's already headed that way.. Path of least Resistance and all?

I wonder how many have laid awake at night dreaming this stuff up. They obviously haven't tried it.

Randy

[nhrifle]

I wonder how many have laid awake at night dreaming this stuff up. They obviously haven't tried it.

Randy[/QUOTE]


Obama voters obviously. Some folks believe the fantasies they are told without proving things through trial and error.

[dkf]

Kinda like how Glock tells you not to use cast boolits or reloads. The manufacturer does it to cover their rear. Factory ammo is just plug and play with little room for user error and if a gun goes KB it is on the ammo company. The MR556 is a gas piston setup so you are not putting gas through the whole gun like on a DI AR so it should be less of an issue.

If you are at all concerned get some of the Hitek coating and gas check the bullets. I have had good luck thus far in my BCM BFH 1-7 twist with VHT epoxy paint on MP 75gr NATO and ACE 75gr Heavy boolits.

[bruce drake]

Been shooting the MiHec 69gr mold in a 223 Rem 1-7 barrel for almost a year now and 120-180gr boolits in 300BLK and 7.62x39 ARs for several other years, so I would say LEAD in ARs is just fine. Making a 6.5 Grendel AR this week that I intend to use 100, 130 and 140gr boolits to fireform cases as well as for general use.

Bruce

[cowboybart]

I have shot 1000's of lead bullets thru my Desert Eagle before I learned that I wasn't suppose to. All were plain based, uncoated bullets. The gas system on this gun can be cleaned very easily. I just thought it was a normal thing to have a "silver colored patch" below the gas port. A dozen strokes with a bronze brush and it was gone. I have only once ran a wire in the port of the barrel, I couldn't see any lead removed from the port or on the wire.
I would think that powder coating your bullets would remove 99.6% of the problem. Gas checking should remove 99% of the problem. If you do both 99.99956% of the problem.

[trickyasafox]

I never had a problem on any AR I used with 22lr. I shot thousands of rounds before going back to full caliber rounds. Worst scenario I encountered was the first few rounds were a bit smokey as whatever gunk was left in the gun got burned away.

[Avery Arms]

I have had a gas port blocked with a tiny piece of lead, it was a bone stock bushmaster M4 carbine firing FMJ reloads and best I can tell the piece of lead fell off the base of one of the bullets due to sloppy manufacturing. These were cheap gunshow bullets and some did indeed have sloppy looking bases.

The rifle had never fired a cast bullet of any kind but stray lead bits from any kind of bullet can and will shut down an AR instantly and there is nothing you can do to fix it except take the rifle apart remove the piece of lead.

[GhostHawk]

I think this is one place where the Russian's got this right.

I have an SKS, Yugo variant with the grenade launcher and ladder sights. No chrome lined bore, nothing fancy.

Right off the bat I was pulling down cheap Tulammo, Red Army Standard, and Privi Partizan to remove the 124 FMJ and replace it with my own cast .312 185 gr (Actual weight with Gas Check is over 190).

I have shot very very few FMJ's through mine. And yes at one point I did lead the barrel up pretty good.
That was my fault, poor lube creation.

I do however every time I clean it find a small ring of lead where the gas tube attaches to the gas block.
Not in the way, doesn't interfere, does not stop anything from functioning.

The rifle was designed to be used by illiterate Russian peasants. And so it is nearly foolproof.
The AR was designed to a totally different standard.

My conclusion, if you want to shoot cast, get an SKS! Nothing against the AR guys, I just don't think it was designed for cast.
And me I love shooting cast.

[seagiant]

Hi,
Well..the YUGO SKS wasn't made by Russians. If it was it would of been chromed lined! The bolt system and gas system are like you said, apples and oranges!

I can't help but wonder though if the AR-15 is BETTER suited to run lead in with it's direct gas impingment (sp) versus a gas piston type rifle like the SKS!

Not trying to start a confrontation just conversation as I believe lead with a gas check can be used in really anything and having owned a few SKS carbines know that they are fine robust little rifles!

[Multigunner]

How well does the bolt and carrier of the AR handle the residue from cast boolit loads?
Any build up of lube and such in the receivers?

[GhostHawk]

No confrontation here seagiant, however I do have a comment. While the Yugoslavian's may have built my particular rifle, the Russians DESIGNED it. And then spread the wealth all over the place. I think in many cases factory's were to all purposes built to be exported.

[Moonie]

How well does the bolt and carrier of the AR handle the residue from cast boolit loads?
Any build up of lube and such in the receivers?

I haven't noticed much more than the normal carbon build up associated with jacketed bullets.