Why use a toaster oven?

[el34]

I wonder if spraying Pam in the kitchen is ok.

That would depend on how good a sport Pam was and exactly what you were spraying her with !
sorry I just could not resist

Best post so far!!

I cast, PC and heat my bullets in a detached shop.. The oven is on one side beside the door, Pot on other side and a fan is half way across the room pointed at the door ..when I do any bullet related jobs, casting PC or heating, the fan is running behind my back taking fumes out the door away from me..

Mine is in the garage, almost the same setup. Mostly for convenience and common sense, and prudent caution. From being constantly wanting to know a bit more than the typical limit of typical patience I would still like to know how many boolits have to be baked before it is toxic to people and what is the nature and effects of it. Cancer? COPD? Nosebleeds?

I have a parrot. Spraying Pam is possibly dangerous for it due to its delicate respiratory system. Cooking with Teflon and spraying room deodorizer can kill a parrot.

Question everything my friends, when possible. And stay thirsty.

[bangerjim]

el...........as you know, this "boolit thing" we are all doing is not an industry standard and I doubt there is any relatable scientific or medical data that exists to our processes. We have only been doing it for a year or so in small batches in nooks and crannies of our home shops.

For now, we probably should rely on the MSDS data from industry proven tests from industrial standard applications.

If anyone dies from this......please post and tell us!

banger

[el34]

el...........as you know, this "boolit thing" we are all doing is not an industry standard and I doubt there is any relatable scientific or medical data that exists to our processes. We have only been doing it for a year or so in small batches in nooks and crannies of our home shops.

For now, we probably should rely on the MSDS data from industry proven tests from industrial standard applications.

If anyone dies from this......please post and tell us!

banger

I never thought anyone was gonna die but I remember your saying something about family members.

This has been beat to a pulp. The only point was the validity of questioning everything as opposed to jumping to emotionally-created half-imagined conclusions or cowing down to someone else with a louder voice and a fondness for the stump.

And to address the OP's original question. I have no related facts, hence no contribution other than to defend his pure curiosity.

[tazman]

It seems the pc powder gives off gas as it cures. At what point does it stop giving off fumes?
Does the cured, hardened pc give off fumes again if it is reheated to curing temperature?
If not, then the pc film on the inside of your oven would not be a danger as it is already cured. I don't have any answers here just questions.

2 facts I know for certain. First one is if you put powder coated boolits on top of your lead pot you get terrible strong fumes and smoke when the lead gets near melting temperature. The powder seems to turn to a black somewhat powdery residue with some portions retaining their shape. Oddly enough this seems to do a great job of fluxing the lead and providing an oxygen barrier.
Other fact is, the shop I retired from began powder coating all the parts about two years ago. The only people who wear protection of any kind other than safety glasses are the people in the spray area running the guns.The spray gun operator only wears a filter mask. The booths are open from the back side with suction blowers in the closed side of the booth. Parts hang from an overhead continuous conveyor and are moved through the booth slowly and then through the baking oven which is also open where the conveyor enters. You can smell the stuff but it isn't terribly strong in there.

[hornetguy]

Just because something "smells", or gives off fumes, it is not necessarily hazardous. I used to work in plastic injection molding, where we would mold delrin. If the delrin got overheated and degraded, when the barrel was purged, it would literally clear out the building. The fumes were about what I would imagine tear gas would be like. We were told that delrin, when degraded, created formaldehyde gas. Naturally we were concerned with this, until we learned that the ppm concentration of formaldehyde that would be considered hazardous would have rendered everyone unconscious... well before it reached that concentration. It was noxious, irritating... all the adjectives you can imagine, but it was not hazardous.
I have read the MSDS for the powder from PBTP, and saw nothing to indicate any danger from fumes. The only mention was if the material gets decomposed from high heat, it could give off some gases or fumes, such as carbon monoxide, etc. It also stated there was no danger of decomposition if the product is used as directed. The fact that a company strongly suggests that a bake oven used in commercial coating be vented outside does not necessarily translate to a small, lightly used oven.
I agree that for comfort it is probably a good idea to vent any fumes away, I believe the jury is still out on whether those fumes are hazardous, or simply irritating.

[el34]

Just because something "smells", or gives off fumes, it is not necessarily hazardous. I used to work in plastic injection molding, where we would mold delrin. If the delrin got overheated and degraded, when the barrel was purged, it would literally clear out the building. The fumes were about what I would imagine tear gas would be like. We were told that delrin, when degraded, created formaldehyde gas. Naturally we were concerned with this, until we learned that the ppm concentration of formaldehyde that would be considered hazardous would have rendered everyone unconscious... well before it reached that concentration. It was noxious, irritating... all the adjectives you can imagine, but it was not hazardous.
I have read the MSDS for the powder from PBTP, and saw nothing to indicate any danger from fumes. The only mention was if the material gets decomposed from high heat, it could give off some gases or fumes, such as carbon monoxide, etc. It also stated there was no danger of decomposition if the product is used as directed. The fact that a company strongly suggests that a bake oven used in commercial coating be vented outside does not necessarily translate to a small, lightly used oven.
I agree that for comfort it is probably a good idea to vent any fumes away, I believe the jury is still out on whether those fumes are hazardous, or simply irritating.

Good story. It shows the relevance of facts.

[Gremlin460]

For the price of a $50 old house wall oven, why is this even a valid question?

Answering a question a few pages back, you can fit a old metal bladed fan inside and a motor on the outside of a old wall oven and fix your hot spots.. I coat in hi-tek not PC. But either /or cooking man made chemicals should always be treated with caution and respect IMHO.

Just my $0.02AUD

[hornetguy]

Gremlin... while I agree with your premise, an old, cheap wall oven is not a viable option for many folks... most ovens require 220V, which is usually not readily available in the garage, and a lot of us really don't have the space to dedicate to something that large. This is where the toaster oven comes in.... or, using the oven in the kitchen.. Your suggestion to treat chemicals with caution and respect is dead on... but that caution should be tempered with facts, not hearsay.

[morayman]

Well I think I'll just keep on curing my boolits and powder coating in my little old toaster oven outside in the carport.It serves my needs and I don't have to worry about anything out there.As far as doing big huge batches of boolits,I don't need to do that,I can do them in the toaster oven and run them one after another pretty quick so my needs are served.morayman.............

[Beagle333]

Answering a question a few pages back, you can fit a old metal bladed fan inside and a motor on the outside of a old wall oven and fix your hot spots.

I still got some feathers on me and a few spots of tar left from when I suggested that a few months ago.

[snuffy]

Well I think I'll just keep on curing my boolits and powder coating in my little old toaster oven outside in the carport.It serves my needs and I don't have to worry about anything out there.As far as doing big huge batches of boolits,I don't need to do that,I can do them in the toaster oven and run them one after another pretty quick so my needs are served.morayman.............

Nice that you live in Florida, I live near by the frozen tundra of Lambeau stadium. Even now it gets pretty cold outside, it takes a bit longer to pre-heat the oven. November thru April will be just about impossible. No garage either, I stopped at numerous "garage sales" this past summer, none of them would sell their garages! I DO have a carport that keeps the rain off, and the snow , IF it doesn't blow too hard, But little to no protection from the cold.

I'm spraying/coating/curing outside right now, but soon will have to move everything inside. That's just what I was seeking to avoid by starting with tumbling to coat the boolits. I never reached my level of perfection by tumbling, so I just sprung for the ES spray outfit from HF. Got it on sale along with their 100 PSI 3 gal compressor. I sorely needed the compressor for the loading room and for gun cleaning, so that will be used quite a lot.

As for the not using the cooking oven, that's where the first 3 batches of tumbled boolits got cured. The HF red didn't stink too bad, and I haven't tipped over after making several pizza's since then. MY 10$ goodwill toaster has taken over the curing duties. I intend to sit it on the cook top over the gas burners, there's an exhaust fan right behind it. Wintertime I will be doing it that way.

[WallyM3]

I still got some feathers on me and a few spots of tar left from when I suggested that a few months ago.

Bamboo rod makers have been doing that for decades...and making their own ovens.

[zxcvbob]

For the price of a $50 old house wall oven, why is this even a valid question?

I have a 220V outlet in my garage (2 actually, but only 1 big enough for a real oven), but no room for a wall oven. I could sort of make room for a free-standing range because it would have other uses. It could also be put on casters to roll it out of the way when not in use... (if I just had a place that wasn't already stacked high with junk)

[ipijohn]

Nice that you live in Florida, I live near by the frozen tundra of Lambeau stadium. Even now it gets pretty cold outside, it takes a bit longer to pre-heat the oven. November thru April will be just about impossible. No garage either, I stopped at numerous "garage sales" this past summer, none of them would sell their garages! I DO have a carport that keeps the rain off, and the snow , IF it doesn't blow too hard, But little to no protection from the cold.

I'm spraying/coating/curing outside right now, but soon will have to move everything inside. That's just what I was seeking to avoid by starting with tumbling to coat the boolits. I never reached my level of perfection by tumbling, so I just sprung for the ES spray outfit from HF. Got it on sale along with their 100 PSI 3 gal compressor. I sorely needed the compressor for the loading room and for gun cleaning, so that will be used quite a lot.

As for the not using the cooking oven, that's where the first 3 batches of tumbled boolits got cured. The HF red didn't stink too bad, and I haven't tipped over after making several pizza's since then. MY 10$ goodwill toaster has taken over the curing duties. I intend to sit it on the cook top over the gas burners, there's an exhaust fan right behind it. Wintertime I will be doing it that way.

Or you can do like I do, put the "toaster/convection oven" in the fire place and let the normal air flow suck the fumes out of the house.

[hornetguy]

Or you can do like I do, put the "toaster/convection oven" in the fire place and let the normal air flow suck the fumes out the of the house.

Now that's not a bad idea..

[StromBusa]

still nobody posting that they died from it......

[Beagle333]

I don't have any idea if it'll kill ya. I just know it smells bad to me and I wouldn't want any of my baked goods to smell like melting polyester, and it does discolor the interior of the oven from the fumes. But I don't know of any health reasons why one shouldn't give it a go. I know of a lot of things that smell and taste bad that won't kill ya!
Save the 10-20 bucks and get the advantage of 2 huge racks over one little bitty toaster oven rack!

[Yodogsandman]

I work in the plastics industry. It includes electrostatic powder coating, both polyester and epoxy in small amounts. Also, powder coating by dipping parts in a fluidizer bed. This for over 35 years. I've lost coworkers and friends to the effects, which are CANCER. It doesn't happen overnight but, from exposure over many years. Most didn't think they needed to wear respirator protection back then, it wasn't required, just suggested. They put parts in ovens and removed them with no respirators. They worked in close proximity to the ovens. They only breathed in small amounts of dust and fumes.

Please, don't take precautions lightly, limit any exposure as much as you can. If you can smell it, you're being exposed to it. Use PC in well ventilated areas only. Never in your living space!

[el34]

My TO had baked powder on the inside of the glass until the PVC primer/acetone trick and there's a twinge of color on the inside walls. I can't really say I've noticed any smell even with the garage closed but I definitely wouldn't want any of that in the kitchen. Besides, spraying out there and toting trays inside would be impractical.

The stinkiest my garage gets is from cooking wood chips in the casting pot.

Whether kitchen or garage it's still of interest to know if curing powdercoat has any health risks. And it's always good to at least be interested in knowing more.

[el34]

I've lost coworkers and friends to the effects, which are CANCER. It doesn't happen overnight but, from exposure over many years.

Was the cancer attributed to the pc? (Not a challenge, just a genuine truth-seeking question.)