Why use a toaster oven?

[WallyM3]

I think we have an answer.

Gov't literature seems to concentrate on the PC in its pre-baked form...some formulations contain........................................... .............lead.

[Yodogsandman]

You could look up the specific MSDS on the powder coating manufacturer's website or request a copy of it.

See "Material Safety Data Sheet"

[bangerjim]

The saying is that opinions are like *******s, everyone has one...


I have an old oven that I've been meaning to wire up an outlet for in the garage. The original intent was for ESPCing motorcycle parts. Then I saw about PCing boolits. I haven't worked up to the full size kitchen oven yet. I'm a bit concerned about hot spots in the oven, and am looking for a way to make it work like a convection oven.

If you want a convection kitchen oven.....buy one. If you have ever looked inside a real convection oven they are build totally different that your standard "old" kitchen oven with cal rods in the bottom.

And yes you WILL get hot and cold spots. And NO a PID controller will NOT solve the problem. Every convection kitchen oven I have had has special high temp blowers to circulate the air and even out the temp......just like we do in our little ovens.

Bakers have the hot and cold spot problem all the time cooking standard foods in conventional ovens. That is why the conv ones are so popular with cooks these days. I love ours!

I have no suggestions for you on to build high temp blowers (blades/belts/bearings,motors,vents, etc) into an old junker kitchen oven. If someone has done it successfully, please post directions and parts lists.

I get up to 375-400 boolits in my little conv toaster oven at a time. Is that no enough for one bake?

Good luck on your conversion adventure.

banger

[el34]

And the oven gets coated all over inside with condensed PC gas......yes GAS. The same cloudy filmy stuff you get on the inside of you car windows (non-smokers only, please). That is polyvinyl chloride gas. Polyester powder out-gasses also and coats everything inside that oven cavity. You do not want to bake your lasagna or pizza in there!

Does polyester powder create PVC gas when it's baked? Interested enough I googled and learned from the first 3 sites that outgassing in the powdercoat world means the trapped air in metal pores expanding during baking and pushing through the PC. Nothing about the powder itself and nothing about toxic anything.

Toaster ovens are not that expensive! Just buy one. Your life and that of your family is worth far more.

banger

It's not one or the other. That's an example of "stop asking just blahblah". Works with some folks I guess.

I'm not gonna do boolits in my kitchen and I don't advocate it. A question was asked about the dangers involved and the only valid answer would come from truth-seeking science, not vivid imaginations.

[1911KY]

I have not been powder coating boolits very long, just three batches with the first one only 20 or so boolits as a test.

I noticed when I powder coated in a toaster oven there were no noticeable fumes at all, maybe because I cooked them off outside.

So I moved inside to my kitchen and used my regular oven to bake the finish in, which was nice because I can fit well over 100 boolits on the larger tray. I could only detect the slightest of odors when doing this inside.

My question is simple: why do you guys not use the regular oven in your kitchen to bake the finish?

Simple question deserves a simple answer, because I am married and wish to stay that way.

[brtelec]

Even if it were safe to do, the risk of pissing off my wife is not worth it. Years ago I used the oven to heat some motorcycle parts and it stunk the whole house up and she spent the next afternoon cleaning the oven. Then when Colt made a stainless Govt model, they ran an add in the gun magazines with a picture of one in the dishwasher. Well.....me not being able to leave anything alone I figure to try it out of sheer curiosity, just like firing the same pistol underwater. Well it worked pretty well, except for the black hard ring it left in the bottom of the dishwasher. I never heard the end of that one.

[xacex]

If my toaster door oven is any indication of what is left after I bake the powder coat I would not do it in a oven food gets cooked in. Just an observation from a college educated idiot.

[btroj]

Don't know about powder coat but I can tell you that Hi-Tek coating has left a distinct film on the inside of the glass door on my convection oven. No way I want that in my kitchen oven. If the stuff can migrate under heat from bullets to the door why would I take a chance of it moving from door to food?

Gun stuff doesn't go near food handling equipment. Not ever.

[C. Latch]

When I bake my PC bullets, the noxious fumes are obvious.

You want to use your family as guinea pigs to experiment with the impact of those fumes?

[silverado]

If I lift weights in the garage or reload while cooking my boolits, it makes me light headed and I get the taste/smell stuck in my head. Even worse than when I shot plain lead at an indoor range.

[Roosters]

This guy was telling me he had used his kitchen oven for over two years to powder coat boolits with no ill affects.......

[el34]

This guy was telling me he had used his kitchen oven for over two years to powder coat boolits with no ill affects.......

How'd you get that? I quit posting pictures of me long ago!

From a pure truth-seeking standpoint there still is the question- if there is pink on the sides of your oven from pc, is it harmful? It will OBVIOUSLY cause an emotional reaction, anything mysterious is usually immediately feared. But what is the truth about it?

Observations that reach a conclusion are always good, doesn't have to be something published by NASA. Caution is a good thing also. For some folks that's the end of the story. For some people with a natural curiosity the caution is a temporary and prudent guide until the truth is known, if the juice is worth the squeeze.

There's a good chance Elmer Keith was warned or admonished for some of his truth-seeking adventures.

[WallyM3]

And Christopher Columbus.

[Smoke4320]

From the manufacturers MSDS SECTION VIII - EXPOSURE CONTROLS/PERSONAL PROTECTION

Product ingredients other than ingredients with established airborne exposure limits may be considered under the PEL for particulates not otherwise regulated (nuisance dust).

Occupational Exposure Limits

Ingredients ACGIH TLV ACGIH TLV-C ACGIH STEL OSHA STEL OSHA PEL BARIUM SULFATE 10 mg/m3 n/est n/est n/est 10 mg/m3 HYDRATED ALUMINA 10 mg/m3 n/est n/est n/est 15 mg/m3 1,3,5 TRIGLYCIDYL ISOCYANURATE 0.05 mg/m3 n/est n/est n/est n/est CARBON BLACK 3.5 mg/m3 n/est n/est n/est 3.5 mg/m3 NUISANCE DUST 10 mg/m3 N/est N/est N/est 15 mg/m3 (total) 3 mg/m3 5 mg/m3 (respirable)

The Health and Safety Executive (Great Britain) has set a rocommened exposure limit for powder coating products containing less than 5% (w/w) Triglycidyl Isocyanurate (TGIC) of 2 mg/m3 [Engineering Information Sheet No 15 (rev2] . This limit value is based on an occupational exposure limit for pure TGIC of 0.1 mg/m3, which differs from the ACGIH TLV given above. Using the ACGIH TLV for TGIC of 0.05 mg/m3 gives a recommended occupational exposure limit for powder coating products containing less than 5% (w/w) TGIC of 1mg/m3. Exposure limits for products containing less than 5% (w/w) or more can be calculated based on the upper TGIC percentage in section II. The formula to calculate limits is "5/(percent TGIC)=mg/m3."

ENGINEERING CONTROLS: Provide ventilation to keep airborne particulate concentration below established airborne exposure limits (TLV's or PEL's). It is recommended that all dust controls handling this product be explosion proof, contain relief vents, or other commensurate measures. Ensure that dust-handling systems (such as exhaust ducts, dust collectors, vessels, and processing equipment) are designed in a manner to prevent the escape of dust into the work area (i.e., there is no leakage from the equipment). Ventilation equipment, baghouse, and cyclone dust collection should be grounded. Curing ovens and heating chambers should be properly vented to prevent any fumes from entering the workplace RESPIRATORS: Use a properly fitted NIOSH/MSHA approved respirator if needed to avoid breathing dust. SKIN PROTECTION: Protective gloves & clothing recommended. EYE PROTECTION: Goggles or safety glasses with side-shields recommended. Hazardous decomposition products: Combustion may contain CO, CO2, incompletely burned carbon compounds, NO2 or other byproducts

[el34]

Smoke, you da man. The part about dust control is without question but the part about fumes is the answer to this thread. It stands on its own merit, and it would be fun but not necessary to know how much boolit baking is required to become toxic and what kind of toxic is it. Really pushing it, I know. Been that way for over 60 years.

I wonder if spraying Pam in the kitchen is ok.

[zxcvbob]

Does polyester powder create PVC gas when it's baked? Interested enough I googled and learned from the first 3 sites that outgassing in the powdercoat world means the trapped air in metal pores expanding during baking and pushing through the PC. Nothing about the powder itself and nothing about toxic anything.

No it does not; polyester does not contain any chlorine. It might outgas something worse than vinyl chloride, I don't know. (but I doubt it)

I would not use the kitchen oven for baking boolits. (even if I was tempted to do so, I'm married and know better) What I'm curious about is, if I buy a 2nd oven for the garage, can I use it occasionally for food if I clean it first? That could be really handy for holidays, or baking during the hot summer months.

I really want a continuous-duty electric stovetop in my garage for small-batch smelting. Hotplates die too quickly, or they cycle on and off just as they almost get hot enough. Just one 6" burner would be enough, but if I could get a little 3-burner range (two 6's and one 8"), that opens all kinds of possibilities. (mashing and brewing beer, etc)

[bangerjim]

I used the PVC gas as an example of plastic polymers giving off potentially noxious gasses.......please do not read anything into what I said!!!!!!


Smoke deals closely with a distributor/manufacturer of our magic powders and has the documented answer most of us knew was true from common sense.

But there it is.................. in plain English black & white.........for those that need it from an "authority document". Don't breathe it.

Just don't bake indoors or in your food prep ovens! Even doing it totally outside, the smell gets to me occasionally when there is no breeze around! And that "cloudy stuff" I scrub off the glass door frequently??!?!?!?............not good for your lungs or kitchen or food or kids or pets.............OK................or wife!

Be safe................at the range AND baking your goodies!

banger

[bangerjim]

No it does not; polyester does not contain any chlorine. It might outgas something worse than vinyl chloride, I don't know. (but I doubt it)

I would not use the kitchen oven for baking boolits. (even if I was tempted to do so, I'm married and know better) What I'm curious about is, if I buy a 2nd oven for the garage, can I use it occasionally for food if I clean it first? That could be really handy for holidays, or baking during the hot summer months.

I really want a continuous-duty electric stovetop in my garage for small-batch smelting. Hotplates die too quickly, or they cycle on and off just as they almost get hot enough. Just one 6" burner would be enough, but if I could get a little 3-burner range (two 6's and one 8"), that opens all kinds of possibilities. (mashing and brewing beer, etc)

I personally would be extremely hesitant on using an oven "on the holidays" that I had baked PC in all year long. You could not possibly scrub out all the nooks and crannies. But it is totally up to you.

banger

[Smoke4320]

I wonder if spraying Pam in the kitchen is ok.[/QUOTE]

That would depend on how good a sport Pam was and exactly what you were spraying her with !
sorry I just could not resist

[Smoke4320]

I cast, PC and heat my bullets in a detached shop.. The oven is on one side beside the door, Pot on other side and a fan is half way across the room pointed at the door ..when I do any bullet related jobs, casting PC or heating, the fan is running behind my back taking fumes out the door away from me..