Swaged copper alloys

[clodhopper]

Does anybody want to discuss manufacture process for bullets like the barnes X bullets. My knowledge is slim.
Please correct if wrong, are the bullets lathe turned to form the boattail and the relief bands.
Center drilled, then milled with two perpendicular deep vees on what will be the point end.
Then swaged into final form?

[reed1911]

I've heard various ways that it is done, some credible some not. I've made some on the lathe before that did well, navy brass that was annealed dead soft and then turned to size, bands cut, and a hollow point drilled. Worked well and shot fine, but I only have a manual machine so it is not efficient.

[bullet maker 57]

The Dave Corbin website has information on swaging copper into bullets.

[midnight]

I believe Nosler at one time and maybe even now make their partition jackets by the impact extrusion method. Moving brass like that is way beyond the capabilities of most of us here. Not that it couldn't be done but it would involve a very large investment in machinery and tooling.

Bob

[bangerjim]

Lots of pressure and very heavy equipment needed to swage copper!

banger

[lup]

I'd say that lathe turned solids or swaged copper powder sintered are within the hone hobbyist for small runs.

[clodhopper]

With the four petals cut in the nose part of the bullet, the swaging I was thinking of might be better described as shaping.
Just pushing the four points around the circumference into a point.

Thinking the final diameter is determined on the lathe or screw machine.

[aaronraad]

How long is a piece of string...

I know Aussie Custom Projectiles are using CNC multiple Swiss-style CNC machines - http://www.auscp.net.au/www.auscp.ne...nce_force.html

[Larrypeterson]

neat's "swaging- titan" but even with the tremendous pressure it developes, I would be cautious about swaging copper.

[Larrypeterson]

I was typing about touring the Barns Bullet factory out here in Utah. I observed that they machined the .50 Cal. solid copper boolet with a CNC machine. No other Bullets were made that way. I was mentioning that I just finished Aneats press in the above posting. Please forgine me for the screwed up post. LP

[Randy C]

I would like to know more about this, I'm at a crossing point I have Richards set up and Its helps to keep up with the times and what's new, BT has done that and is good at it.

[aaronraad]

I would like to know more about this, I'm at a crossing point I have Richards set up and Its helps to keep up with the times and what's new, BT has done that and is good at it.

No offence Randy, but sadly there is nothing new and very little in the way to help "keep up with the times and what's new" in bullet swaging in the true sense of the meaning.

If there was less marketing hype and more peer reviewed reference texts about the subject, we'd all see modern small arms projectile "technology" for what it is.

If you're keen to know more, I'd suggest starting by going back to 1898 with the manufacturing methods developed for the French Balle D projectile. I know that seems a bit extreme, but in terms of mass producing monolithic bronze/brass/copper projectiles this is where it hit it's peak. Most other common bullet swaging technology was introduced by 1921 and the remainder of the time has simply been spent perfecting it, forgetting it and then regurgitating it.

[clodhopper]

It may not be new, but it's new to me. Thanks for the info arronraad. Going to do some reading.

[clodhopper]

So, the French Balle D, two diameters, the nose riding, or lightly engaging the lands, the base filling the grooves.

A hard bullet goes down the barrel sealing the gasses with out excess pressure.

Yet can be formed in swage process. I did not yet find any information on the manchinery used to form Balle "D" projectiles. If they were formed in one die, or a succession of dies. If they were formed hot.

Today's Barnes X bullets take more steps to form with the relief bands, but may give an edge to accuracy especially in looser barrels.

[aaronraad]

You can't have been too far off Clodhopper!

This book is a little piece of gold to keep in your collection: https://archive.org/details/cartridgemanufac00hamirich I would suggest downloading a copy for yourself while you still can.

Try the last section, Chapter X: Manufacturing The French Military Rifle Cartridge...You're a better man than me if you can skip over the first 9 chapters!

...and here's a bit of a review to put the Balle D in perspective...http://www.quarryhs.co.uk/Toward%20a...GP%20round.pdf

[deltaenterprizes]

I talked to Hornady about the GMX bullets, they are swaging guilding metal bullets and the hollowpoint is formed during the swaging process.

[clodhopper]

I did read most of the book, the chapters on shotshell making, just got a browsing.

With Deltaenterprises comment on Hornady there truly is nothing new under the sun

[rbt50]

I have made some bullets using a jacket with copper powder . need to do more testing to really know what I have.

[clodhopper]

Do you mean a jacket filled with copper powder?

I bought a box of Varmit grenade bullets once, They are light jackets filled with powdered copper and tin. They do make a mess out of ground squirrels.

Do want to hear more about your bullets rbt50.