help identify CSB powder

[jim8115]

Question. I traded my wifes XD9sc for a Ruger sr9, because she wanted a manual safety, and she likes the way that gun feels.
previously, i loaded 115 plated with 4.4 W231, and 147 Zero JHP with 4,2 Power pistol. Shot thusands of both from the XD with no problem. These loads are too light to cycle the ruger, brass hit you in face. etc
I also tried 4.2 NR-485, averaged 971 FPS , same thing
Anyone have a suggestion for a load for the 115 with NR-485? I was thinking of moving up to about 5.0. Not sure about the 147, may stick with PP.....

JIM

[tazman]

Assuming that NR-485 follows Universal which all your testing seems to prove, 5.0 should be a safe load for a 115 grain plated bullet. I would approach it step-wise until the action worked as it should.
There is a lot of difference between 4.2 and 5.0 in a 9mm case. It isn't much of a surprise when 970 fps with a 115 grain bullet doesn't work the action properly.
Hodgdon data site calls for 5.0 grains with a 115 grain gold dot hp
5.0 might be in the +P range when using cast.

[jim8115]

Any suggestions for 9mm 147 Zero JHP with nr-485?

[tazman]

I would start at 3.0 grains. Should give about 800fps. Max is probably 3.3-3.4. Expect a velocity of 875-900fps. Not a big window there.
These are the loads listed for universal on the Hodgdon data site for a Hornady XTP.

[sargenv]

I concur with post #44.

[jim8115]

Im going to hold off on the 147's for now, just stick with pp for now. Changing guns has slowed things down, since this SR9 wont even cycle some of the lighter loads we used to use in the Xd.
Next up, tomorrow 115 plated 4.5 & 4.8 Nr-485 (4.2 would not cycle the SR9 reliably, though it would lock the slide back on last round)

[tazman]

Keep posting results. This is interesting.

[jim8115]

Wife wasnt with me to log shots, so all I have is HLA of 5 shot string, no ES or SD
Ruger SR9 115 plated @ 1.120
4.5 NR-485 H 1066 L 1035 AVG 1049 - 2 stovepipes out of 50

4.8 NR-485 H 1101 L 1080 AVG 1089

[tazman]

I assume there were no malfunctions with the 4.8 grain load. How was the accuracy? Felt recoil?
It may be time to go up to 5.0 with the plated and see how that works.

[jim8115]

I assume there were no malfunctions with the 4.8 grain load. How was the accuracy? Felt recoil?
It may be time to go up to 5.0 with the plated and see how that works.

No malfunction at 4.8, throwing the brass maybe 6 to 10 feet near as I remember. Recoil felt about normal. Accuracy? let me tell you, I love my XD pistols, but this dang SR9 will shoot the center out of the target at 25 feet with anything I put in it so far. With the 115's i am jusy trying to get a nice target load for my wife, so I may actually go down to 4.7 and see what happens.
I would like to go up a bit just out of curiosity , but just dont know about the pressure.....
For her carry load, i run 147 JHP's at about 950 with Power Pistol

[tazman]

If you are satisfied with the results from 4.7-4.8 stick with it and just use that load. Really glad it's working out for you.

[jim8115]

Ok , so here is my question, With the testing we have done so far , it appears that the CSB-1 / NR-485 is very close to universal as far as charge / velocity. So, can I safely assume that pressure is in line also?

[tazman]

I would think so. Yes

[sargenv]

I concur with tazman.. Initially I was told that NR485 was close to titegroup.. with testing, it was not in line at all with titegroup and was acting more like Universal.. so that's the data I reccommend people use.. I've stuck with that data in working up my loads using both powders in a few different calibers.. It's not exact, but within the batch to batch limits that would be used had we been using different lots of Universal.. In my opinion.. which is worth, whatever you think it's worth..

[jim8115]

I concur with tazman.. Initially I was told that NR485 was close to titegroup.. with testing, it was not in line at all with titegroup and was acting more like Universal.. so that's the data I reccommend people use.. I've stuck with that data in working up my loads using both powders in a few different calibers.. It's not exact, but within the batch to batch limits that would be used had we been using different lots of Universal.. In my opinion.. which is worth, whatever you think it's worth..

I really appreciate everyones assistance. Like you, I was told to use titegroup data. As soon as I started testing I realized that was way off.
By the way, the 147 loads you posted... do you know the exact length of the bullet you were using? and what COl ?
I want to compare with the zero 147 JHP's I use before I start. The zero's are .665 and i run them at 1.110

Thanks,
JIM

[sargenv]

It was short enough to load into my Lone Wolf barreled Glock, which is usually shorter than the stock barrel. It was under the SAAMI max OAL of 1.135", but I don't know the exact length.. If I were to guess, it would be that the straight part of the bullet was nearly flush with the shoulder of the 9mm brass since the Lone Wolf Barrel did not like any sort of bullet at .356" past the cartridge mouth. I really need to get the chamber cleaned up a little bit so that I can seat the bullet a tad longer..

My 130 gr bullets cast from the Lee 125-2R mold need to be seated very deep to even allow the slide to close.. Something in the 1.050" range.. I would prefer to load them to 1.135-1.140" range but the barrel doesn't allow it..

[tazman]

Sounds like a very short throat or no taper to the rifling. I am lucky in that my 9mm pistols have generous chambers and long tapered throats. I can run almost anything through them.

[sargenv]

Yeah, you're supposed to send the barrel back to lone wolf for lengthening. I know someone local who can do it, I've just been lazy getting it done.

[guncheese]

here are some #s i got off the new chrono today

black & blue bullet 0.356 tc hi-tek 125gr
3.8-3.9gr csb-1. 1.120
5" 1911
# FPS
7 1013
6 1025
5 1016
4 1007
3 1017
2 1039
1 1033
Average: 1021.43
StdDev: 11.43
Min: 1007
Max: 1039
Spread: 32

black & blue bullet 0.356 tc hi-tek 125gr
4.1-4.2gr csb-1 1.120"
5" 1911
# FPS
9 1049
8 1069
7 1073
6 1057
5 1059
4 1077
3 1074
2 1082
1 1065
Average: 1067.22
StdDev: 10.64
Min: 1049
Max: 1082
Spread: 33

LEE 0.356 356-120-TC 120
3.8 gr csb-1 1.070" .357" powdercoat
5" 1911
# FPS
9 1033
8 1002
7 1040
6 1009
5 1007
4 997
3 1012
2 1005
1 964
Average: 1007.67
StdDev: 21.70
Min: 964
Max: 1040
Spread: 76


black & blue bullet 0.356 tc hi-tek 125
4.1-4.2gr csb-1 glock 34 1.120"
# FPS
10 1075
9 1075
8 1055
7 1066
6 1079
5 1081
4 1075
3 1079
2 1065
1 1077
Average: 1072.70
StdDev: 8.17
Min: 1055
Max: 1081
Spread: 26


LEE 0.356 356-120-TC 120 powder coat
4.1-4.2gr csb-1 1.070 .357" glock 34
hots
# FPS
9 1103
7 1083
6 1077
5 1084
4 1062
3 1081
2 1090
1 1088
Average: 1080.7
StdDev: 9.30
Min: 1062
Max: 1103
Spread: 41


i may try some at 4.4 just to see whats up if i can even get that much in the case
4.2gr under that long hi-tek coated bullet is right on the powder
no issues with anything and it burns real nice with these loads

[new cal shooter]

.380 acp 100 gr plated RNFP 3.4gr CSB-1 @ .980" = great shooting load.