25 acp rifle?

[nanuk]

a 25ACP would make a handi light easy carrying Legal Elk Rifle up here!

you'd have to shoot 'em in the eye!

[psweigle]

I do understand the 'want one'...lol The TJ liners are .250 bore and .243 land...available up to at least .500, and since he can hammer .257's to .560 I bed he can do 25 auto to that OD as well...and maybe he has some tubing that will allow bigger.

LBT has a high-BC, rebated boat tail in .25 that would do well in the 14" twist TJ barrel( it was made to deliver 1.5 SF at up to near Mach ). Just because it was designed for the Air Rifles does not mean it won't do well in the weaker powder burning set up...LOL Ask Veral for the 25 Bob's Boat Tail.
cheers,
Douglas

Sounds like someone else has thought about this. I'm interested in those bullets you are talking about. Any chance this is first hand knowledge?

[Geezer in NH]

I remember advertising in the Boy Scout handbook and monthly publication in the mid 60's showing their handgun in 22 and 25 that fit into their rifle conversion.

Living in MA it was not possible, when I was that age even though My father and I had our Firearms Identification Cards "good for life" so called.

I had the calling of the gun culture he did not have and never found one. It would have been cool

[leveraction 45 colt]

well I see someone else had the same idea I had for years I wanted a singleshot 25acp rifle for squirrel and rabbit hunting! well I hope to see how this goes for you guys? like to see some pics of this cool gun??

[3leggedturtle]

a 25ACP would make a handi light easy carrying Legal Elk Rifle up here!

you'd have to shoot 'em in the eye!

A 25 auto and 50 rounds of ammo weighs about a 1lb or so. That way you would be able to carry more food and beverages so you can hike further into the boonies and shoot elk; that dont know that they are sposed to need a magnum to be killed with. Sorry for the friday sarcasm and sidetracking.

[Vagabond55]

Up here in the Great White North, we had a company called Cooey. Made a lot of inexpensive rimfire rifles, one was a single shot in 25 rimfire. Over the years saw a number converted to 25ACP when 25rf was no longer available. If I remember correctly the conversion wasn't much more than converting to centerfire.

[aussiebo]

Cool,I am interested in this conversion as well.I have an old .410 2inch single shot that needs converting!Please keep the updates coming!

[Chev. William]

IF, and I do mean IF, I can get some 'Discretionary Spending Money' again (I have had 1/2 day of work so far this year); I have Marlin model 56 "Levermatic" in .22LR along with some parts (CF Bolt assembly, Barrel blank, etc.) to convert it to a .25ACP Rifle. It would have my Lothar Walther 23.4" long barrel blank fitted and I hope near to 22-23" finished barrel length. You might keep an eye out on Gun broker or other Gun Seller's sites for one to convert.

Both the Models 56 and 62 were detachable magazine fed while the 57 and 57M were Tube magazine fed; and the model 62 have been available in 30 Carbine and 256 Winchester Calibers.

I have some surplus Phoenix ten round magazines and some Barreta 8 round ones that I intend to convert to .25ACP properly so they will hold and feed all ten or 8 cartridges (the Phoenix magazines look like they tried to use a .32ACP mag to hold the .25ACP round and it seems to jam at around 5 to 7 cartridges in the Mag).

My intended conversion is to add "pads" on the interior sides of the Phoenix magazine to hold the .25ACP closely in a vertical stack while leaving rim clearance at the rear and at the top round to allow proper feed. The Barreta ones need a outside mounted padding and length extension to match up to the Marlin .22 Magazine sizes. Also I will add a 'welded' lump on the magazine rear face to engage the Marlin magazine catch and remove the Phoenix installed plastic nose filler and follower to allow for a home made metal follower.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Chev. William]

Getting Closer to assembling the Marlin Levermantic conversion to .25ACP as I got my Tax Refund (I filed Oct. 14th with a filing extension) and ordered a New "Lothar Walther" (LW) ".25ACP/6.35 Browning" Barrel Blank of 26mm by 605mm overall dimensions, which should allow up to 23.8" finished length if carefully done. And I am hoping that the "Match Grade .25ACP Finish Chamber Reamer I ordered from "Pacific Tool and Gauge" (PTG) arrives soon after the barrel. LW told me my payment made it in time for my ordered Barrel blank to be included in the next Bulk shippment from Europe, and PTG is quoting 6 weeks for the Reamer, so they will be 'neck and neck' in getting to me. I intend to have this barrel fitted by my gunsmith and the stock relieved to 'free float' the new barrel. Marlin used a 'cross pin' to retain the barrel in the receiver so the new one will be machined to fit the existing mounting so I will have the option to return it to 22LR at a later date if I am not satisfied with its performance.

Now I must be patient and wait for things to arrive in 'due time'. Anticipation is 'exciting' isn't it.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

Added 2014NOV21: My New Lothar Walther .25ACP/6.35 Browning , 26mm x 605mm C-M Steel barrel Blank arrived. Sadly PTG says may Reamer is still in the Manufacturing stage and wll be another few weeks until completed. Also I received the T.O.T.W. .25ACP 25" long Barrel Liner arrived, it was slightly more expensive than the L.W. Barrel Blank when shipping and such are included. Now I need to wait until next month to do any more purchases. Chev. William

[Bill*B]

That's what I love about this board - were else on the planet would you find a discussion about creating a .25 ACP rifle, with a guy who's already done it and another who is about to?

[NoZombies]

redman and track of the wolf have barrel liners. a single shot 410 bored out and an 11 inch liner installed should be perfect. and yes, it is legal, as long as the shotgun barrel is no shorter than 16 inches. i will be having it cut to 16.5 just to be safe. according to ballistics by the inch, that barrel length seems to be optimal for my needs.

Actually, since the gun started as a shotgun, the shotgun barrel must be at least 18" to be legal.

It's a weird legal abnormality, but true. Because it's a 'firearm made from a shotgun' it must comply with shotgun rules, rather than rifle rules, even though it's becoming a rifle. The liner can be any length you want.

[Chev. William]

A 25 auto and 50 rounds of ammo weighs about a 1lb or so. That way you would be able to carry more food and beverages so you can hike further into the boonies and shoot elk; that dont know that they are sposed to need a magnum to be killed with. Sorry for the friday sarcasm and sidetracking.

Anyone know how many Elk have been killed by 'Native Americans" with Basic Bow and Arrow?
I would guess the arrow shafts would be around 1/4" inch diameter although the head might have been larger in one dimension but smaller in the Cross dimension to allow 'seizing' to the shaft.
I also expect they were not shot at long distance as the hunters of the time would have had Outstanding Skills at sneaking up close to the Game, after all it was survival hunting.
Best Regards,
Chev. William

[35remington]

Arrow also tend to have sharp pointy ends on them, making a comparison to a small handgun round very problematic.

[BAGTIC]

Me too but I ran out of patience before I wore out the cases.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

There was indeed a .25 necked to .22, the logic being that it would function better with cast bullets in a pocket pistol than the .25.

There was at least one long thread about a .25 rifle on www.shootersforum.com/ by someone who was obviously very knowledgeable on some aspects of the problem. "Why" was his weak spot. I think you could find lots of more useful things that nobody is doing. The .25 pistol is far from the mouse gun some say, as long as a malefactor is wary getting his DNA on your carpet or doing some fast talking to get medical attention. But the rifle might be considered so.

You would probably want different bullets, and to load with other powders than those which work in the pistol. You might have to segregate your two kinds of ammunition. For a chambering reamer, if you have a lathe, you might do by turning or inserting a pilot on a 7mm. engineering reamer, and lapping out the last two or three thousandths. There is also an erratic supply of 7.2mm reamers on eBay. In most rifles you would have to do quite a bit of work to make a workable extractor, and I wouldn't count on it staying workable. "It'll be cheap because I have the brass" has never worked for me.

If you want a very practical small-game rifle, how about the .270 REN, which is what you get by making the Hornet case dead straight? It should work far better than a .22 with cast bullets.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Ah, I didn't notice the very person I mentioned in my last post. I still think the "why" is the tricky bit.

A point to watch out for is whether a liner much shorter than a larger caliber shotgun barrel might be classed as an illicit sound suppressor. In the UK any sort of silencer is uncontrolled as long as it is built in but non-removable. But I don't know the position in the US, and a decision in your favour might still cause you a lot of stress. For policemen the world over, a "crime" that can only be detected once you have a perpetrator is statistical nirvana.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Cooey made my first rifle, in 1968. It was about as accurate as any sporting .22, but had the unusual feature of being a bolt action with a sliding tube magazine. It could never be cycled quietly, and eventually the spot welds on the magazine support broke.

[waksupi]

Ah, I didn't notice the very person I mentioned in my last post. I still think the "why" is the tricky bit.

A point to watch out for is whether a liner much shorter than a larger caliber shotgun barrel might be classed as an illicit sound suppressor. In the UK any sort of silencer is uncontrolled as long as it is built in but non-removable. But I don't know the position in the US, and a decision in your favour might still cause you a lot of stress. For policemen the world over, a "crime" that can only be detected once you have a perpetrator is statistical nirvana.

Great to see you back on the forum!

[Chev. William]

Arrow also tend to have sharp pointy ends on them, making a comparison to a small handgun round very problematic.

But aren't they around 1/4" Shaft diameter? Yes a "Hunting Broad head has sharp 'wings' that act like an Expanded bullet to increase the 'Wound Channel' damage in the Target game. But there are 'sharp pointy heads' that are only shaft diameter also.

Re: the long ago post query about lengthening the .25ACP by spinning; that would possibly be feasible but would work harden the brass so it would need annealing often in the process and the wall thickness might get too thin to handle reloading forces. A better way to get longer cases is to shove either a .22 Hornet or a 5.7x28mm case into a .25ACP sizing die all the way to the rim top surface, then chuck it in a lathe and trim the rim diameter, cut the extractor groove (it is .250" diameter), and then trim to a suitable length. I have some experiments in progress using such home made cases of .750", .960, 1.055", 1.125", 1.250", and 1.350" nominal lengths. These all are .276" body diameter and have rim diameters of .303"-.308" measured. The Rim thicknesses are between .047" and .053" measured. I did find I best used a RCBS Pocket Swage Punch with their Stripper cup and a 3/16" Id Fender Washer as the pusher to size the case and then run a decapping punch or 5/64" Drill bit through them to bring the flash hole back out to nominal diameter. Squeezing the Head from .300" down to .276" means the metal has to go somewhere.

0.750" is similar to the case length of a .22 LR cartridge.
0.960" is similar to the case length of a .22WRF cartridge.
1.055" is similar to the case length of a .22 WMR Cartridge.
1.125" is similar to the case length of a .25 Stevens Cartridge.
The other two lengths are "Wildcats" custom lengths.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

PS: Also, this last week I received back from my Gunsmith a 1915 'modified' Favorite rifle with a '.25 Stevens' Barrel currently fitted with a .25ACP extractor so I now know these longer cases CAN be used in that chamber. The 'little' problem left is that this action has a RF positioned Firing pin tip that hits on the .25ACP case rim just outside the primer so I cannot presently test it firing a CF cartridge.
Chev. William

[psweigle]

I am soooooo excited to see that rifle when you get the firing pin figured out! Please please please send me lots of pics.