Homemade Lube, Geargnasher's SL68 recipe

[btroj]

The fact we call it bullet lube leads way too many to assume that lubricarion is the key. We actually need little, if any, actual lubrication. Matter of fact excess lubricarion is detrimental to accuracy is almost every instance.
Only one way to know what lube is going to work in a specific situation, that is by testing. We have found lubes that are awesome in a handgun yet horrible in a rifle.

Not sure how many here know what the 68 in SL 68 stand for. It is the 68th major lube test in the soap lube series started by Gear. Many have had sub-lubes made with minor tweaks.

[geargnasher]

....and that's just SOAP lube. I did include all the TnT and similar wax-free soap lubes in the series count, that was back in the low to mid 50s. I have no earthly idea how many lubes we all actually have made and tested in the quest, probably several hundred individual recipes.

Speaking of TnT, I still like it a LOT for pistol work, and my .35 Remington is liking it very much as well, NO first-shot flyers, pre-condition the bore with straight Maxima K2 oil after a cleaning, shoots the same in all weather so far, it's a good system. I never had any trouble with TnT in midrange rifle loads as long as I used a buffer, and the .35 doesn't even need that.

Something I've been meaning to run by you, Brad. Remember way back when other testers started complaining of the brown plague using TnT in rifles and you suggested using just a tiny it of wax (like 15% or less) per my de-oiled Mobil 1 synthetic red grease testing? I'm wondering if a little bit of the 180F microcrystalline wax would just tidy it all up and perhaps eliminate the need to cut the polybutene content with some air conditioning ester oil. One problem I never have had with any of the soap/wax/oil lubes is the brown plague.

I do still have that beeswax/soap/ester oil lube you made, actually shot it last year and it did pretty well except for smoke, but I got sidetracked trying to duplicate Starmetal lube because I know it does everything I wanted.

Gear

[btroj]

I have some lubes I never even shot! The Ester/soap/wax lubes shot well for me. They need more testing to really know. Maybe I can get some winter testing done since cold will be the word for the next 4 months or so.

[Elkins45]

I got sidetracked trying to duplicate Starmetal lube because I know it does everything I wanted.

Is the formula for Starmetal lube lost to antiquity? Why can't you just whip up a new batch?

[btroj]

Is the formula for Starmetal lube lost to antiquity? Why can't you just whip up a new batch?

Dude, if you only knew.....

[bruce381]

Oh, yeah, it does stink a bit, sorry. Maybe I should add some potpourri oil? How did the smoke level compare for you to BAC?

Gear

was 68.1 version smoke kinda seemed less but hard to tell was not bad but not smokless. I would say no worse to less, hard to tell.
we shot at night I guess a day shoot and video of both lubes would be a good way to tell.

[btroj]

I am yet to find a real smoke free lube. They all differ in odor and I'm ok with them all as long as they don't stink like Alox.
Smoke doesn't bother me much except at indoor ranges. Indoors the smoke is far more noticeable to me.

[geargnasher]

Is the formula for Starmetal lube lost to antiquity? Why can't you just whip up a new batch?

Nope. I wasted dozens of batches before I discovered that Starmetal was mistaken about what he called "beeswax". He finally sent me a chunk and it is NOT beeswax, but a very close petroleum-based equivalent. That one ingredient is an unknown quantity to anyone other than the US Navy who only tested it to certain physical specs (probably for use as a replacement for beeswax in A-3 or A-5 warhead explosives) and who knows who made and submitted it originally (there were many producers), and another ingredient will not be disclosed by Starmetal, though he has at least given a vague indication of the source. Besides, Starmetal doesn't even understand himself what he made, still thinks for some reason that it isn't soda grease, and his instructions are about as clear and precise as three generations of verbally handed-down Grandma's scratch biscuit recipe. The fact that it worked at all is mostly dumb luck, but it happens to be very, very close to a couple of other lube formulations, one of which can still be purchased today and is widely regarded as a pretty good lube.

You haven't been around the lube threads much, have you?

Gear

[45 2.1]

Nope. I wasted dozens of batches before I discovered that Starmetal was mistaken about what he called "beeswax". He finally sent me a chunk and it is NOT beeswax, but a very close petroleum-based equivalent. That one ingredient is an unknown quantity to anyone other than the US Navy who only tested it to certain physical specs (probably for use as a replacement for beeswax in A-3 or A-5 warhead explosives) and who knows who made and submitted it originally (there were many producers), and another ingredient will not be disclosed by Starmetal, though he has at least given a vague indication of the source. Gear

Complete balderdash Ian.......... I have that same Navy beeswax. You researched one use... unfortunately the wrong one. The one it is for fits it well and is in spec for it. It is beeswax, but it is unlike what you are used to. I also know the source and spec for the missing ingredient... and No, it isn't for general consumption. Joe worked in the plant making it and knows quite a bit about what happens as well. You're not as close as you think you are...keep trying though.

[btroj]

So you know what it is but won't tell anyone. That is helpful how?

[stephen m weiss]

Ah thanks so much! I had actually read both of those posts and most of the replies, but the definitions of 'lube purging' and 'consistency' were not clear enough for my mechanist head. Even now, I see no hypothesis for why the lube builds but then suddenly purges, so I will toss one out: the wave equation. The lube stuck to the barrel becomes effectively liquid during bullet passage but then cools rapidly and stays for the next bullet. As the deposition depth builds, so do the surface waves created ahead of the bullet. Eventually, the resonant point is approached and the wave breaks and all the wax becomes involved and pushed in a bow wave ahead of the bullet. Why is the shot always high??? I can see only that the nature of the exit of the bullet from the barrel is affected, with most of the old grease on the bottom of the barrel and deflecting the bullet at exit. Sounds sketchy but could be true.

This explanation begs the question, why didn't the packing scrape out the excess lube with every shot? The circa revolutionary war cannonry guide I read somewhere said that was one of the functions of the hay put ahead and behind every shot. Could it be that the popular use of Dacron has so little volume and stiffness that it rides right over the lube? I dont see the lube buildup problems even after 40 shots or more using Lee Alox and grits or toilet paper filler. Dry barrel...I motor oil lube it for fear of rust. I do see 5-15 chunks of grits in the barrel when looking down it, all within 6 inches of the chamber end. I brush that out before re-oiling so it wont get stuck in the oil.

Just stirring the lube, pardon my curiosity and critique.. shoot me down if I am all wet..with lube buildup...

[45 2.1]

So you know what it is but won't tell anyone. That is helpful how?

Ya know Brad.... anyone here can buy yellow vaseline in this country. It's made for export to other countries, BUT, you have to buy a minimum of five gallons and it doesn't seem too cheap from the price I heard. The man in question bypassed that difficulty by making his own because he knew how....... you can either buy it or learn how to reproduce what we used to commonly have 40 years ago. You should know enough chemistry from your choice of occupation to do that. The choice is up to you.

[btroj]

If I knew what the old stuff had refined out of it I would make my own. I have had zero luck finding what the difference is.

[geargnasher]

Complete balderdash Ian.......... I have that same Navy beeswax. You researched one use... unfortunately the wrong one. The one it is for fits it well and is in spec for it. It is beeswax, but it is unlike what you are used to. I also know the source and spec for the missing ingredient... and No, it isn't for general consumption. Joe worked in the plant making it and knows quite a bit about what happens as well. You're not as close as you think you are...keep trying though.

I wasn't basing my assessment on speculative research, but on actual testing of the wax. You should do the same before attempting to discredit what I say. Do you think I just make this stuff up as if what I write is of no consequence to anyone? Joe obviously didn't afford me the same luxury and I wasted a lot of time and money trying to make his lube with three different grades of actual beeswax. He was honestly miffed that it wouldn't work for me, but eventually he mentioned that the stuff he made first and sent to Mike and Bruce, which he made prior to getting the Navy wax, was burnt and smelled like cat turds. He said that it was burnt because he hadn't learned how to cook it correctly, but in fact it was just that he used the different type of wax that can take the heat. Once he gave me a chunk of that Navy wax and I tested it, that little mystery was solved. Joe's lube requires 460F to become liquid and beeswax turns a dark reddish brown and scorches badly at just under 360F. It is impossible to make his lube the way he does with real beeswax. He told me recently he was going to try another batch with some actual beeswax to see, but I doubt he's going to waste any time proving you and himself wrong. The Navy wax is made from petroleum wax which can stand at least 515F by itself for an extended period of time without even discoloring. Do you know what happens to any sort of wax made by honeybees at 515F? Does "POOF----no eybrows" give you a meaningful enough description? Perhaps the Navy has some bionic bees that sup at oil well heads.

Gear

[geargnasher]

Ah thanks so much! I had actually read both of those posts and most of the replies, but the definitions of 'lube purging' and 'consistency' were not clear enough for my mechanist head. Even now, I see no hypothesis for why the lube builds but then suddenly purges, so I will toss one out: the wave equation. The lube stuck to the barrel becomes effectively liquid during bullet passage but then cools rapidly and stays for the next bullet. As the deposition depth builds, so do the surface waves created ahead of the bullet. Eventually, the resonant point is approached and the wave breaks and all the wax becomes involved and pushed in a bow wave ahead of the bullet. Why is the shot always high??? Longer barrel time for the purging shot is my guess. It's difficult to tell with chrono data. I can see only that the nature of the exit of the bullet from the barrel is affected, with most of the old grease on the bottom of the barrel and deflecting the bullet at exit. Sounds sketchy but could be true.

This explanation begs the question, why didn't the packing scrape out the excess lube with every shot? I don't see much in the way of purge flyers when using fillers behind the bullets. The circa revolutionary war cannonry guide I read somewhere said that was one of the functions of the hay put ahead and behind every shot. Could it be that the popular use of Dacron has so little volume and stiffness that it rides right over the lube? I dont see the lube buildup problems even after 40 shots or more using Lee Alox and grits or toilet paper filler. Dry barrel...I motor oil lube it for fear of rust. I do see 5-15 chunks of grits in the barrel when looking down it, all within 6 inches of the chamber end. I brush that out before re-oiling so it wont get stuck in the oil.

Just stirring the lube, pardon my curiosity and critique.. shoot me down if I am all wet..with lube buildup...

We know what to do to fix it, but none of us have yet taken a ride down the bore with the bullet to actually see yet, wouldn't it be nice.

Gear

[Elkins45]

Sorry I tore off the scab...

[stephen m weiss]

That would be one heck of a ride!!

Hmm, by longer barrel time, you must mean lower velocity due to pushing more lube. Now.. I weigh my bullets which are prolly too heavy on Lee Alox and cant see an average weight difference from the lube. It's like 12x less dense than lead, and really really thin, on the order of .001 thick. That would mean for a 30 cal at 1 inch long, .001 in^3, or .02 grains. Even if all the lube from 5 bullets stayed in the barrel, that would be .1 grain pushed by the purge bullet. That .1 grain heavy bullet would go slower by less than (150.1/150)^.5-1=.03% Heavier bullets actually pick up more energy but I used a constant energy conversion. For a 100 yard distant target and a 1500fps bullet, if it goes .03% faster, it hits .43 inches high. Are these groups really that tight? Or do you use much more lube than the .001 thickness I estimate? Arent the variations in bullet weight larger than .1 grain? Mine are WAY larger I must admit. Workin on that....

Please pardon, I am not trying to pull you over a barrel, even a heavily lubed one... I sure cant help much on the chemistry, but perhaps I can help a tad on the mechanics.

I just had an idea. Sometimes in machinery, when impurities build up in flow paths, we use a coating the impurity just hates to stick to. Like silicone rubber in shower nozzles. Just use an ice coating on the barrel! Oil hates sticking to ice! Or, well just use a coating on the barrel that is polar like ice. The solidifying lube would bead and get blasted out with every shot. Now, how to do that without rusting the heck outta the barrel? Outta my league again....

[geargnasher]

Sorry I tore off the scab...

No scab, it's just human nature to stick to what you have long believed about something even in the face of having it repeatedly and scientifically proven otherwise by someone else. The man who sold the wax to a great number of members here over ten years ago bought it at auction as "beeswax", divvied up and sold very reasonably as such, and it does resemble highly refined beeswax and in fact makes excellent bullet lube. It has made (LITERALLY!) tons of bullet lube of all sorts and was even used by a commercial lube vendor for years until the purchase was exhausted. You wouldn't know it wasn't beeswax except by testing the specific gravity with alcohol and water, determining the self-ignition point, and how it smells when it smokes.

The reason for all the exhaustive efforts by me to duplicate Starmetal's lube is that it has some unique properties, not the least valuable of which is the incredible boundary separation characteristics it has. Similar to Felix lube (due to the beeswax and especially lanolin content of Felix lube), Starmetal lube is an extremely effective deep draw lubricant that helps bullets swage through rifle throats without losing any metal. Starmetal lube also has the unique property of virtually disappearing when fired, leaving no significant lube star, little smoke, and not much behind in the bore. You might notice some of the lube on fired case mouths, undamaged and unburned. It isn't slippery, and leaves the bore condition consistent from one shot to the next in any weather I've shot in, it doesn't melt, weep oil, or run in extremely hot storage conditions. I finally determined that all of these properties are due to the interaction between microcrystalline waxes (branched molecules) and paraffin oils (unbranched carbon chains). Also the massive size and comparatively high melt point of the sodium stearate molecule (which is 100 times larger than a lithium stearate molecule and melts at something like 150F higher), together with the high concentration of it (30+%) matrixed throughout the finished lube by melting all components together at sodium stearate's physical melt point makes a robust grease that can withstand a lot of abuse. The small castor oil content, added at about the same ratio as a model airplane engine's nitromethane fuel would need, is sufficient as a boundary lubricant for extremely high pressure and velocity near the end of the barrel. It does the various jobs from metal swaging lube to high velocity boundary lube and everything in between and does it the same way every time. And it barely smokes. Yep, I like it, that's why I'm experimenting with wax and oil components so much to see what each one does to the lube's performance and what really makes it tick.


Gear

[geargnasher]

Stephen, Castor bean oil has some unique properties when applied to hot metal. Polarity is one of the reasons it does what it does.

Longer barrel time does not mean lower velocity, necessarily. It means more muzzle rise before the shot exits. A bullet can still whiz up to the same velocity of one having less barrel time at muzzle exit and chronograph the same but hit higher. Sort of a slingshot effect due to lube drag.

Gear

[45 2.1]

I wasn't basing my assessment on speculative research, but on actual testing of the wax. You should do the same before attempting to discredit what I say. Do you think I just make this stuff up as if what I write is of no consequence to anyone? Gear

I don't need to speculate, I read the specifications on it. That told me what to expect without trial and error.

I wasted a lot of time and money trying to make his lube with three different grades of actual beeswax. He said that it was burnt because he hadn't learned how to cook it correctly, but in fact it was just that he used the different type of wax that can take the heat. Once he gave me a chunk of that Navy wax and I tested it, that little mystery was solved.
Gear

As you have both said, neither of you used the correct procedure from the git-go.

The Navy wax is made from petroleum wax which can stand at least 515F by itself for an extended period of time without even discoloring. Do you know what happens to any sort of wax made by honeybees at 515F? Does "POOF----no eybrows" give you a meaningful enough description? Gear

I'm well aware of a lot of things, including flash points of materials...... and how to combine materials with highly different flash points without damaging either material. Chemistry classes and other material classes teach things like that. The problem you seem to be having is raising the combination temperature too high. Think about it.................. and change what you're doing.