Loading Question - MH 577/450

[skeettx]

No fillers, powder is positioned at the base before loading

[Bad Ass Wallace]

This group fired at 200yards with the Queen Victoria rifle competition (7 rounds best 5 to count)

[rollmyown]

No fillers, powder is positioned at the base before loading

Do you mean tip your rifle muzzle up before firing?

[rollmyown]

This group fired at 200yards with the Queen Victoria rifle competition (7 rounds best 5 to count)

Outstanding group for 200M mate, I like the best five count rule!

[skeettx]

No, do not lift the rifle up, tap the base of the cartridge on the bench,
then load, then shoot, provides consistency.
In my 308 cast bullets, I do just the opposite, I position the powder behind
the bullet.

Just whatever works
Mike

[sthwestvictoria]

This is an interesting thread with some strain gauge pressure testing of smokeless and BP in the Martini-Henry:
First Goex:

Then 4198:

and 2400, Blue Dot

And Trail Boss - quite a heroic load of it however:


The original forum posts are here:
http://britishmilitariaforums.yuku.c...es#reply-18955
http://britishmilitariaforums.yuku.c...es#reply-18885

They are old threads from 2007 and the chap with the pressure testing gear (user Southernfi) suggests he is going to re-shoot some and shoot some more loads. Unfortunately the other posters seem to get on their hobby horses and run him down and that user made no more pressure related posts. Has any one else come any other similar pressure testing with the MH? I was suprised about the low pressure results using 4198 - it may be that smokeless is actually kinder to old BP firearms than BP!?!?!

[rollmyown]

Interesting graphs and information, thanks for posting.

[sthwestvictoria]

It is very interesting - actually seeing what is going on with these various loads. The caveat is this is not true copper crusher cup or piezo pressure barrel data - this device uses a strain gauge on the outside of the chamber barrel and measures barrel chamber stretching to arrive at a pressure result (same as the Oehler 43 pressure recorder). This is a picture of the strain gauge stuck across the chamber of a Schultz & Larsen RPLT 42:

And this is the link to the company that makes the strain gauge and interpretive software, $579 for the set up:
http://www.shootingsoftware.com/pressure.htm
It would be something fun for a club to purchase to use.

[Southernfi]

I was looking at the site today and saw my old post about Martini Henry pressures here. I eventually settled on using 34.5 grains of SR4759 with the 480 grain bullet. I don't have the graph any more and haven't run the program in years, but that load pretty much overlayed the BP curve the best. I did get a better downside curve due to more effeciency in the powdeer burn that resulted in about 200 fps more velocity than with BP. I have shot a lot of rounds with this load and it requires no filler and I have had no bad signs in my rifles.

[sthwestvictoria]

I was looking at the site today and saw my old post about Martini Henry pressures here.

Welcome to the site - what a serendipitous meeting! Thank you for providing the data, so useful to actually see what is going on rather than run on conjecture.
Are you still shooting the Martini-Henry?

I eventually settled on using 34.5 grains of SR4759 with the 480 grain bullet. I don't have the graph any more and haven't run the program in years, but that load pretty much overlayed the BP curve the best. I did get a better downside curve due to more effeciency in the powdeer burn that resulted in about 200 fps more velocity than with BP. I have shot a lot of rounds with this load and it requires no filler and I have had no bad signs in my rifles.

That is very interesting and particularly the opportunity to avoid using fillers. Some people suggest using a magnum primer to get the ignition right into the large case - did you have to do this with SR4759?
The use of SR4759 fits in with other pressure testing work (albeit in the 45-70) that is displayed in this thread from the PacoKelly forum (scroll to bottom for pressure traces):
http://www.levergunscommunity.org/vi...7368f5e3bb6294
Unfortunately there was a post here somewhere that SR4759 was going to be discontinued? Certainly doesn't seem available here in Australia.

[Southernfi]

Still shooting the Martini, it's one of my favorite rifles. I've always used regular large pistol primers in the reformed Magtech cases with no problem. I recently installed a William Malcomb scope on one of my MKII's. I haven't zeroed it in yet, but I hope to make a decent long range shooter out of it.

[6mm win lee]

I was looking at the site today and saw my old post about Martini Henry pressures here. I eventually settled on using 34.5 grains of SR4759 with the 480 grain bullet. I don't have the graph any more and haven't run the program in years, but that load pretty much overlayed the BP curve the best. I did get a better downside curve due to more effeciency in the powdeer burn that resulted in about 200 fps more velocity than with BP. I have shot a lot of rounds with this load and it requires no filler and I have had no bad signs in my rifles.

Welcome to the site, sir. I have started to get an interest in the MartiniHenry. Your charts are interesting and look very useful.

Six

[Buckshot]

.............I have a MkIV Martini - Henry 577-450, and did try BP in it once I settled on a smokless load of 38.0grs IMR3031, Dacron, card wad under the slug. I used the Lee 457 - 405-F as cast of pure lead, and patched with 20 lb bond for .472" over the dried patch.



Here are 60 rounds in Bertram cases of the above load. They are quite accurate. Velocity is about 1250 fps. I used to shoot it in our club's 200 meter silhouette side match. No problems fetching the 200 meter ram.


My efforts with BP were not so much fun and much less productive In this instance I used the Lee 450gr slug as cast of pure lead and patched as above for the same .472" OD. It's been quite a few years ago now but IIRC I had 110grs of Elephant 2 FG in the Bertram cases which reached right to the base of the neck when compressed. I had a stack of cardwads and two 1/8" thick grease cookies stacked in there together too. I fired them off the bench and by the 2nd or 3rd shot the whole left side of the rifle was covered in slobber. After about 7 rounds I was starting to ask other people up and down the line if they'd like to try it. I got a few takers but no repeats. With less then 10 rounds left to empty out I was trying to PAY people to shoot them! By the end of the range session, and by shooting one or two every hour or so I finally managed to get rid of them all.

....................Buckshot

[Hooker53]

Hey Rollmyown. I been watching hoping Stephan or another Unique loader would give up there secrets here But. Lol. Stephan did say 11 grains but I'm wondering about the wadding or stuffing he used. Can someone help me and Rollmyown on this?? Thanks
Roy.

[zuke]

I've been using 15gr of 700X held in place with 2 square's of toilet paper tamped one after the other.

[Hooker53]

That sounds easy enough Zuke. I'll add 700X to my buy list. Anyone out there have a good Blue Dot load and how you wadded it?

[enfield]

from "cyber shooters" ? blue dot 27 gr, 400 gr bullet 1400 fps. blue dot 22 gr, 475 gr bullet, 1220 fps. 4759 27 gr 400 gr bullet 1172 fps. 25 gr 4759 , 475 gr bullet , 1109 fps. . no mention of wads or fillers, I would not use any c.o.w or corn meal or such thing as they form a solid plug that could be dangerous.

[zuke]

That sounds easy enough Zuke. I'll add 700X to my buy list. Anyone out there have a good Blue Dot load and how you wadded it?

I picked up 14 lbs of it cheap ($40) so I'm getting creative with it.

[Tackleberry41]

How would something like solo 1000 compare in use to 700x? I bought a keg of it for cheap and have been trying to find uses for it, well besides 9mm, 38 spcl, and subsonic loads in 45-70 and 30-30.

I never had good luck with 4198, mostly hang fires, a big wad of somewhat scorched powder, and the bullet just barely out of the case. Trailboss does a good job, but I dont use as much as some do, pressure chart above was with 26.5, im only running 22gr. I use rubber spacers under the powder, wedged down into the bottom of the case, a plumbing washer for sinks has a hole in the middle for the primer flash, a little bigger and it will go around the primer tower in magtech cases, 2 gets you level with the flash hole.

[zuke]

Never heard of Solo 1000. Where is it on a burn rate chart? if it's equal to of slower then go ahead and use it, but start low