Test 6 of Greg-Turbo-Tommygirl-FH-SuperBlazing-Dixie-Hawglips-Hogtamer-bikerbeans-inspired loads in NEF USH: 12ga and 20ga loads
Today i'll just post a look at the test load line up, and will get out to shoot them in a few days. Been saving them up all winter, and might have another one or so to add depending on how some components roll in.
Take a look and comment, etc. Enjoy!
C-
Last edited by cpileri; 04-23-2014 at 06:51 PM.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
Test 6 of Greg-Turbo-Tommygirl-FH-SuperBlazing-Dixie-Hawglips-Hogtamer-bikerbeans-inspired loads in NEF USH: 12ga and 20ga loads
I really should entitle this thread as above, since I took so much from these folks. I don’t think the title bar will allow me all those characters, though. In any case, if you gave me direct info or inspiration in any form, THANK YOU!
Also, I added a new characteristic for the 12ga loads, Power Category. Basically, in the interest of safety I will detail the pressure and velocity if known and categorize the load as:
“normal” (safe in all MODERN shotguns in good working condition, under 13.5kpsi w typical shotgun pressure curve),
“Blazing” (safe in modern shotguns in good working order with muzzle thickness minimum .91”, under 13.5kpsi but longer pressure curve),
“barely From H_ll” (safe in USH and other shotguns with breech 1.2” diameter and muzzle minimum 1” diameter in good working condition. From 13.5-16.5kpsi AND longer pressure curve),
and
“FH” or “from H_ll” (safe only in highly modified Mauser/rolling block mega-strong actions w custom heavy barrels etc as in ‘you would know if you have one’-strength guns. From 16.5kpsi up to 25kpsi and UPWARDS. Don’t expect too many of these).
Date: 01 May 2014
Elevation: 764ft
Temp: 57-75 degF
Wind: 0-10 mph N
Humidity: 33 %
Platform:
12ga:
NEF/H&R Ultra Slug Hunter, Bore: .731, lands .721”; chamber reamed to 3.5”, 24” fully rifled bbl, forcing cone polished and smoothly blends w beginning of rifling, (chamber cast pics available) stock and forearm weighted: balance point ~1inch forward of trigger guard, total weight 12+lbs w/ scope, hammer w/ offset spur installed
with Scope: el cheapo BSA 1x25 red dot w 3 MOA dot (have Bushnell TRS-25 to install, but haven’t yet)
So, keep in mind, I am shooting using a cheapie scope, with a red dot on an orange target, on a bright Texas day. So I cant even see the dot once it is over the orange tape. A better scope set up, and accuracy might be even better.
Notes: this weighted, heavy, gun was fired from seated “double gun” position (hand under forearm and resting hand/wrist on stand, gun to shoulder, body leaning in; pulling snugly both down and into shoulder. No shooting jacket nor shoulder pad though) Buttstock has really squishy pad on it (*). As before, muzzle flipped a lot and stock slipped down off shoulder w each shot of heavy loads; but still absolutely no discomfort at all.
(*)this pad: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Last edited by cpileri; 05-01-2014 at 05:18 PM.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
20ga: NEW (to me) 20ga!!!!
one regular ol’gun- very un-special:
Stevens Model 94, series K 3” chamber, smoothebore, 0.6225" bore cylinder (backbored out the choke), 28” bbl measuring 1.151” at breech and 0.768” at muzzle. Did install open iron sights on it front and rear.
Or, the new one:
H&R 20ga Ultra Slug Hunter Compact; 3” chamber (cast steel receiver, not the rifle one-357mag/44mag and shotgun only), HEAVY barrel: fully rifled bore slugging to .622 groove/.618” lands EXCEPT to about 1” from the muzzle where there is a tightness/constriction that I did not measure as I intend to lap through it over time and will be sizing my slug loads to the major/minor barrel dimensions listed. 22”bbl measuring a full 1” at muzzle, no sights. Optic mounted is a simple BSA 3-9x40.
Whether I test them in the 12ga USH (rifled), or in which 20ga, will be noted in the text.
Target distance: mostly 25yds (laser verified) unless otherwise specified.
Chamber cast note: used Cerrosafe which, for anyone who doesn’t know, an alloy of 42.5% Bismuth, 8.5% cadmium, 37.7% lead, 11.3% Tin which melts somewhere btw 158-190degF and then shrinks and then expands again over time; like this:
2 minutes - .0004"
6 minutes - .0007"
30 minutes - .0009"
1 hour +/- .0000"
2 hours + .0016"
5 hours + .0018"
7 hours + .0019"
10 hours + .0019"
24 hours + .0022"
96 hours + .0025"
200 hours + .0025"
500 hours + .0025"
Took all measurements at approx the . 60 . minute mark, of course.
Turns out forcing cone has a steeper “cone part’ and then a leading “pilot area” just before the rifling begins.
Chamber AOL (from base of rim/breechface to rifling): 112 mm
Chamber length (from base of rim to beginning of forcing cone: 96mm (just shy of 3.75 inches).
Steep “Cone part” of forcing cone: 7mm
“Pilot area” of forcing cone: 9mm
Here are the pics of the chamber cast:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...=1#post2338792
Next batch of loads similar to above, plus extra filler wads as required to make the 3.5” length, but in 3.5” RMC brass cases where possible, with OAL to engage rifling as described here:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...=1#post2330155
Last edited by cpileri; 05-01-2014 at 08:31 PM.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
12ga Loads:
Load: 12ga 3.5” Hubel sabot in brass
Power Category: FH
Velocity and pressure: ?unknown? (but a 3.5” fed hull w 209A and 54gr Steel pushes 1&1/8oz steel shot at 1800fps/12.4kpsi)
Hull: 3.5” Rocky Mtn Ctg brass
Primer: 209-A
Powder & Charge: 55gr A.Steel
Wad column: x12x over powder, then in order: ¼”cork, 1/8”nitro,1/2”fiber, 1/8”nitro, ½’ fiber, 1/8”nitro, ¼’cork, 1/8”nitro under sabot
Load: Hubel Sabot loaded w 440gr lead .578 minie ball, dusted w hexagonal Boron nitride (hBN), seated where abt half of sabot is beyond the casemouth.
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: none
Notes: These are new brass hulls, since the old ones had cracks in them see here:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...ing&highlight=
To their credit, RMC sent new ones as replacement w no hassle. This test fire was not just a test of this load in accuracy dept, but also to see if these hulls are problematic. RMC thinks it’s the chamber, whereas I think it was the bar stock of the old hulls. Hopefully, this firing will tell us something. Looking for accuracy w the 3.5” chamber, hoping matching hull length will help w that. These sabot/slugs are a really tight hull fit in the RMC brass, no crimping needed. In fact, even though its difficult, load the slug into the sabot first, then tap into hull. Otherwise I had a tough time getting the minie ball to seat into bottom of sabot. Also note that the interior dimensions of the case were so tight that as I pushed the X12X down over the powder, it created a seal such that it compressed the trapped air and sprang back up! No kidding! I had to seat it and hold it and jiggle it until I felt the air release. THAT is a tight overpowder seal. What I don’t know is if it sat on my desk waiting to be fired and the remaining air expanded and pushed up a bit off the powder (it probably did); wich is a random variable that I am not sure how to control. Any attempt to make a release hold while seating the X12X might allow blowby during firing. Any ideas?
Load: 12ga 3.5” Hubel w Modern Minie in Plastic
Power Category: FH
Velocity and pressure: unknown
Hull: fed 3.5”
Primer: 209-A
Powder & Charge: Alliant Steel 53gr
Wad column: X12X over powder,NC,1/8cork,1/4Felt,1/8cork,NC under slug
Load: Hubel Sabot loaded w 464gr lead .576 MODERN minie ball, all dusted w hexagonal Boron nitride (hBN)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll (poorly, it fit well but the crimp is all smooshed down not neatly rolled)
Notes: Hogtamer’s Modern minie’s as seen here:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...=1#post2716662
These slugs bulge the tops of the Hubel Sabot petals outwards more than the more spitzer pointed traditional minie balls, so they were a squeeze fit onto the hull. Thus, the hulls were a tight push fit into the chamber of the USH and did not spontaneously eject (when unloading Unfired hulls, just to check fit) and had to be tapped out w a rod. Note: i didnt test this one, thebulge scared me off. If I try the modern minie, it will be w a "cored out" Hubel Sabot.
Load: 12ga Greg 1043 in 3.5” brass
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: 1050fps/10.2Kpsi
Hull: RMC 3.5” brass
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 54gr IMR 4227
Wad column: x12x over powder, then in order: ¼”cork, 1/8nitro, ½ fiber, 1/8nitro, 1/2fiber,3x1/8”nitro under slug
Load: 1043gr hardcast lead slug, alox lubed, rolled in hBN
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: none
Notes: this is not a new load, except the change to 3.5” brass hull. In these new hulls, I tapped the slugs in and they fit snugly w no crimp, glue, etc whatsoever.
Load: 12ga Greg 880 in 3.5’ brass
Power Category: Barely From H_ll (*)
Velocity and pressure: 47gr Lil’Gun= 1320fps/13.3Kpsi, 70gr 4227=1419fps/14.2Kpsi, 63gr 4759=1500fps/15.2Kpsi
Hull: RMC 3.5” brass
Primer: Fed 209-A
Powder & Charge: 60gr 4759
Wad column: x12x over powder, then in order: ¼”cork, 1/8nitro, ½ fiber, 1/8nitro, 1/2fiber,1/8cork,3x1/8”nitro under slug
Load: 880gr HC lead slug, lubed w LBT soft blue
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: none
Notes: My most accurate load in plastic was this lug and 60gr of powder, so just checking how it does in 3.5” brass. (*) A “normal” load w this slug and components would be 28.5gr Longshot= 1054fps/8.3Kpsi.
OK, here they are all together.
Looks like the winner here is the 1043gr load. I was getting kind of punch drunk by the time I got to these (despite posting them first in the thread, i shot them last), but I think they managed to perform- or at least to out perform me.
The brass did not split! yay. but they did expand, and will post that pic too.
I did recover some components from the Hubel Sabot loads, which flew low and didnt seem consistent. maybe the twist was too much seating them into the rifling as they one recoivered sabot was twisted badly, and the other was shredded and lost all 4 petals. Did nto recover the third. Any ideas/analysis?
and recovered components
Notice esp the measured "ring" of expansion on the brass. it measures 0.8115" where the new, unfired hull measures 0.802". The Hubel Sabot/Steel hulls have the worst ring, and the 1043gr loads the least at 0.808". So my chamber may be a bit generous. The hull sdid still fall right out of the chamber.
Last edited by cpileri; 05-01-2014 at 08:35 PM.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
20ga Loads: Still seeking the elusive “accurate slug in a non-slug gun” load for my Savage 20 (done w the H&R). These are a variety of round balls w full length Teflon wraps around the wad column, with one load using the DGS slug in for spice. Best way is to post a picture, so here it is: (let me know if you cant see it)
Last edited by cpileri; 04-23-2014 at 06:48 PM.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
I plan to use the Savage for 20ga loads A-E, and the “new’ 20ga USH for USH 1-5. The Savage shoots high. And is not really intended as a slug gun. I filed the notch deeper in the rear sight to lower POI as described in old tests. We’ll see how it goes.
So loads A and B are basically 20ga round ball w full length mylar wraps filled w stuff under the ball; while loads D and E are round ball loads in a wad supported w stuff. Basically…
Savage test loads:
Load: 20ga A
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown (*), about 1200fps.
Hull: Fio 3”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 14gr Green Dot
Wad column: OBT20 over powder, then 1/8” NC, then insert mylar wrap (rubbed in hBN powder) and into mylar wrap place: ¼”felt,1/8”NC,1/4”cork, 3x1/8 hard card wads, 1/8”NC, 1.5ccMalt-o-meal filler to support the round ball.
Load: .570 lead round ball (~279gr)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll
Notes: (*) 14gr green Dot is my low-and-easy load for development purposes, as described here:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...ded&highlight=
My thinking was the very small mylar strip on previous test loads did nothing but get distorted under stresses of firing and setback. So I encased the whole column in it this time. Had success malt-o-meal in 12ga RB loads, so I am combining techniques here. Why not? right?
Load: 20ga B and B+
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown , about 1200fps.
Hull: Fio 3”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 14gr Green Dot
Wad column: OBT20 over powder, then 1/8” NC, then insert mylar wrap (rubbed in hBN powder) and into mylar wrap place: ¼”felt,1/8”NC,1/4”cork, 3x1/8 hard card wads, 1/8”NC, 1.5cc PR Teflon buffer filler to support the round ball.
Load: .570 lead round ball (~279gr)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll
Notes: “B”-load is the same as “A” above but using Precision Reloading’s Teflon buffer instead of Malt-o-meal. A “B+” load included added 1” circle of newspaper over the powder, yes UNDER the x20x, to prevent powder migration.
Load: 20ga C
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown, but 22gr Steel pushes 1oz lead shot at 1255fps/9.9kpsi, and 400gr steel shot at 1350fps/10kpsi
Hull: Fio 3”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 22gr Steel
Wad column: OBT20 over powder, then factory wad as attached
Load: 7/8oz DGS slug
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: fold
Notes: load “C” is the DGS (Gualandi) slug that although shooting way high last time, did group tightly. So it has returned in this series. This time its lubed w 3 coatings of CRC heavy-Duty Corrosion Inhibitor and edges rolled in hBN. This was by far the winner today! Need to bring it down, or else change sights, or else forget this Savage as a sly gun. bu this si the load I would use if I had to employ it as a slug gun.
Load: 20ga D
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown , about 1200fps.
Hull: Fio 3”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 14gr Green Dot
Wad column: OBT20 over powder(*), then 32ga hard card wad w hole in middle to accommodate nubbin on bottom of CSD wad and glued this card to the bottom of CSD wad , then inside the CSD wad place: drop of glue, 1/8” hard card, 2x1/4” hard card, and 1.5ccMalt-o-meal filler to support the round ball.
Load: .570 lead round ball (~279gr)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll
Notes: This is back to the RB trials. This one in a CSD wad w MOM filler. (*)also added a 1” circle of newspaper over the powder, yes UNDER the x20x, to prevent powder migration.
Load: 20ga E
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown , about 1200fps.
Hull: Fio 3”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 14gr Green Dot
Wad column: OBT20 over powder(*), then 32ga hard card wad w hole in middle to accommodate nubbin on bottom of CSD wad and glued this card to the bottom of CSD wad , then inside the CSD wad place: drop of glue, 1/8” hard card, 2x1/4” hard card, and 1.5ccMalt-o-meal filler to support the round ball.
Load: .570 lead round ball (~279gr)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll
Notes: Load E is same as D but w PR Teflon filler instead of Malt-o-Meal. (*)also added a 1” circle of newspaper over the powder, yes UNDER the x20x, to prevent powder migration.
loads D and E didnt do so well. I have the pics but I'll save the bandwidth.
Last edited by cpileri; 05-01-2014 at 06:02 PM.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
20ga USH test loads:
Notes: the CSD and Commander wad loads really didn’t fit in 2.75”hulls (the DGS and Thugs did), though the commander wad fold crimped OK, there is still some petal opening. Next time, if any loads show promise, I will cut down the CSD wad by at least ¼’ and the commander so that I am only using the wad cup then build it up w X20X and fiber wads.
Load: 20USH-1 (DGS)
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown, but 1&1/4oz lead shot w 22gr Blue Dot gives 1140fps/10.4kpsi
Hull: Fio 2.75”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 22gr Blue Dot
Wad column: factory 20ga DGS wad w 1” newspaper under gas seal to prevent powder migration.
Load: factory 20ga DGS slug (7/8oz, .623 diameter)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll x1, fold x2
Notes: the 22gr Blue Dot load for the Thus slug and DGS slug is pretty light for these slugs. Other published loads for the DGS include 29gr Longshot (1650fps/11.5kpsi), and extrapolated loads are many in safe pressure territory. The first slug tried a roll crimp, which failed to roll all the way hanging up on the pointy nose of the slug. Need a overshot disc if roll crimping these w this combo. I fold crimped the others. NOTE: Didnt test today, maybe next time.
Load: 20USH-2 (Thug)
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown, but 1&1/4oz lead shot w 22gr Blue Dot gives 1140fps/10.4kpsi
Hull: Fio 2.75”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 22gr Blue Dot
Wad column: factory 20ga Thug wad w 1” newspaper under gas seal to prevent powder migration.
Load: factory 20ga Thug slug (7/8oz, .622 diameter)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll
Notes: other published loads for this slug include 20gr PB (1310fps/9.5kpsi), 22gr Herco (1345/9.3). these roll crimped easily. NOTE: Didnt test today, maybe next time.
Load: 20USH-3 (57-cal slug in CSD)
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown, but 1&1/4oz lead shot w 22gr Blue Dot gives 1140fps/10.4kpsi
Hull: Fio 3”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 22gr Blue Dot
Wad column: OBT20 , 32ga 1/8” card w hole punched in middle (to allow the little nubbin in gas seal of the wad) glued up under the gas seal of the wad, CSD wad (unslit), then INSIDE the wad: drop of glue then 3x1/4” cards plus 1x1/8” card, then slug. Note allowed all glue to dry thoroughly before inserting into hull, since this glue (‘amazing Goop’) gives off nasty fumes and don’t want to know what those fumes do to powder nor in a combustion sequence.
Load: 57-cal lead round nose slug, 450gr (diameter in wad .622)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp:
Notes: NOTE: Didnt test today, maybe next time.
Load: 20USH-4 (57cal slug in Commander)
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown, but 1&1/4oz lead shot w 22gr Blue Dot gives 1140fps/10.4kpsi
Hull: Fio 3”
Primer: Fio 616
Powder & Charge: 22gr Blue Dot
Wad column: OBT20 , 32ga 1/8” card w hole punched in middle (to allow the little nubbin in gas seal of the wad) glued up under the gas seal of the wad, Commander wad (careful not to break the connections between the petals), then INSIDE the wad: drop of glue then 1x1/8” card, then slug. Note allowed all glue to dry thoroughly before inserting into hull, since this glue (‘amazing Goop’) gives off nasty fumes and don’t want to know what those fumes do to powder nor in a combustion sequence.
Load: 57-cal lead round nose slug, 450gr (diameter in wad .624)
Overshot (if any) & Crimp:
Notes: NOTE: Didnt test today, maybe next time.
Load: 20gaTurbo-1
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown (est
Hull: 3”fio
Primer: fio616
Powder & Charge: 20gr Steel
Wad column: OBT20 , hard card wads to height
Load: 1-oz .625 hardcast lead slug lubed w LBT soft blue
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: mixed fold and roll
Notes: these heavy fullbore slugs are made by Turbo1889, and were generously donated by bikerbeans. I loaded them w extrapolated data and some that came out of load data turbo worked out for these. These ll shot well, all Turbos slugs I mean. This load was very comfortable on the shoulder as you might imagine.
Load: 20gaTurbo-2
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown (est
Hull: 3”fio
Primer: fio616
Powder & Charge: 30gr Blue Dot
Wad column: OBT20 , hard card wads to height
Load: 1-oz .625 hardcast lead slug lubed w LBT soft blue
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: mixed fold and roll
Notes: these heavy fullbore slugs are made by Turbo1889, and were generously donated by bikerbeans. I loaded them w extrapolated data and some that came out of load data turbo worked out for these.
Load: 20gaTurbo-3
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown (est Ajay got abt 1600fps w 56gr 4759 and 450-460gr slugs)
Hull: 3”fio
Primer: fio616
Powder & Charge: 50gr 4759
Wad column: OBT20 , hard card wads to height
Load: 1-oz .625 hardcast lead slug lubed w LBT soft blue
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: mixed fold and roll
Notes: these heavy fullbore slugs are made by Turbo1889, and were generously donated by bikerbeans. I loaded them w extrapolated data and some that came out of load data turbo worked out for these.
Here is 2 and 3 together, with the 4759 load beig my favorite of these all day. See notes on Re-17 loads to see why.
Load: 20gaTurbo-4
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown (est
Hull: 3”fio
Primer: fio616
Powder & Charge: 75gr Reloader-17
Wad column: OBT20 , 1xfelt wad, hard card wad under slug
Load: 1-oz .625 hardcast lead slug lubed w LBT soft blue
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: mixed fold and roll
Notes: these heavy fullbore slugs are made by Turbo1889, and were generously donated by bikerbeans. I loaded them w extrapolated data and some that came out of load data turbo worked out for these. One load I branched out on was the Re-17 loads; at first I didn’t have any federal20S-1 wads to use, as suggested, but Ed Hubel thinks Re-17 will ignite OK in a 20ga w a good heavy slug and crimp.
Load: 20gaTurbo-5
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: unknown (est
Hull: 3”fio
Primer: fio616
Powder & Charge: 75gr Reloader-17
Wad column: 20S-1, hard card wad under slug
Load: 1-oz .625 hardcast lead slug lubed w LBT soft blue
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll
Notes: these heavy fullbore slugs are made by Turbo1889, and were generously donated by bikerbeans. I loaded them w extrapolated data and some that came out of load data turbo worked out for these.
here are the re-17 loads. I really had to concentrate on these, thinking they would really kick. after the first one, I thought it wasnt so bad- well, the reason was the unburned powder. lots of it. but the outer coating burned off, so that each granule looked really orange in color. If I can get better compression maybe these will burn better. Still, they were no squibs, nor powder puff loads at all. the results:
And here’s a load from an old post by James “Dixie” Gates, that I GOTTA try when I find some 500gr .625 slugs:
Load: 20gaDixie-1
Power Category: normal
Velocity and pressure: Mr. Gates states “1425 fps and ‘pressure tested at Ballistics lab” but pressure not specifically
Hull: 3” Ched
Primer: ?? Ched??
Powder & Charge: 34gr Blue Dot
Wad column: OB20, hard card, ½” cork, hard card wad under slug
Load: 500gr .625 hardcast lead slug
Overshot (if any) & Crimp: roll
Notes: as seen here:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...l=1#post525387
Next plan/great idea/failure waiting to happen: will buy a .52 round ball mold and send to a pal who casts well, and see if I can do a 20ga Tri-ball load in multi-metal wads! 52cal lead round balls weigh 212gr if pure lead, less if alloy which these will be in order to meet the 15-16 BHN hardness minimum requirement. I have some 1&1/2oz and even 1&5/8oz shot load data for 20ga, so that will be my starting point. (Fio3”, 28gr Lil’Gun, 1&5/8oz, VP92, 1098fps/10.6kpsi) Stay tuned…
Last edited by cpileri; 05-01-2014 at 06:15 PM.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
Well, drats! Didn't think about that modern minie's blunt nose not fitting the sabot....looks like another mold to buy. Those modern minies oughta fit a trap commander 20 ga wad though....I'm sure I read that in AJ's or Ed's thread somewhere back a ways. Carl, what kind of accuracy did you get with the old style minies and Ed's sabots out of a rifled gun??
they do fit the commander wads well. i may load some and add them to the 20ga list later.
i can always take a drill or file to the hubel sabot if the modern minies dont fly straight as-is.
as for hubel w minie ball in rifled 12ga, see:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?216358-TEST-5-of-Hubel-Blazing-Dixie-Greg-FH-inspired-loads-12-and-20ga-w-pics!!!&p=2430453&viewfull=1#post2430453
and
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?210449-Tes4-Hubel-SuperBlazing-Dixie-Inspired-loads&p=2353141&viewfull=1#post2353141
C-
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
C-,
You have been busy while I have been a sleep at the wheel all winter. At the beginning of the year, I drifted off to the land of Marlin LGs in preparation for Ohio's first CF rifle deer hunt this fall. Your posts did get me back to loading slugs today, 24ga and 10ga, and hopefully next week will get to launch a few of them. BTW, you may get a few more "freebies" in the near future as I am seriously thinking of selling my 12 and 20ga slug guns. I don't really need 7 or 8 (maybe it is ten, dang CRS) dedicated slug guns now that I can hunt whitetails with a rifle. But I really, really have a hard time ever selling a gun even though I tell my wife I sell one every time another rifle follows me home.
Good luck with your load workups.
BB
BB, shoot me a pm if when you're looking to move any of those slug guns.....Cpileri can have the 10 ga!
Haha. Like I need another caliber to invest in!
I am looking foward to seeing the 'for sale' listing, though.
C-
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
Also, at RMc's suggestion, i am going to include expansion measurements for my loads- esp since I am not sending them off for pressure testing first.
Described here;
www.shootersforum.com/shotguns-shotgunning-shotshell-reloading/2820-pressure-testing-shotshells.html
except for the Rocky mtn all brass hulls, which i will measure... not sure, probably in a few places and report which expanded the most.
I plan to compare them w some factory loads as well; all both beore and after firing, of course.
C-
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
I also was really shocked at the superb accuracy of the Brenneke SIlver 3" actory loads- best of the day. SOmuch so that I think I may just buy a bunch and all it even. I took the load out to 50 yards with this target, and will go to 100 next time out.
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
I also fired a bunch of factory loads which all also shot well.
For your amusement:
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
regarding the upside down post above (and sorry about that, my computer was giving me fits); they are:
left: remington slugger 5/8oz,
middle 3" brenneke silver then fed truball. note that the brenneke slivers made ONE HOLE w 3 slugs, and the other hole is an errant wad. thats why I took these out to longer range.
right pic is Ddupleks Dupo 20 and Brenneke rottweil.
A fun day! Please comment!
C-
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
Here are some recovered compoenets from the 20ga loads A-D, note D target wasnt posted because I didnt think it shot well enough to bother; but I drew a pic of the target next to the load picture in this photo.
These components dont tell too much of a story, though- except for maybe the shredded mylar wraps.
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
And here are some from the 1oz "Turbo slug loads" and the factory loads.
The 100yd tests will be w a couple of these, and the Brenneke 3" magnums; for accuracy!
____________
"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
So in summary:
12ga:
-main concern is the "ring" expansion in post 4
- best accuracy was 880gr Greg slug in 3"
-best accuracy was 1043gr Greg slug in 3.5"
20ga:
-in smoothbore, best accuracy was load A, with Gualandi Slug in close second
- in NEF: will run a tie breaker btw: brenneke 3" magnum vs Turbo 1oz loads w 4759 and the built up wad column Re-17 loads.
Any comments on the ring expansion?
C-
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
You know what, i measure my chamber cast referenced in the link posted, and agt that spot it measures 0.815"; so it expanded, but not even to the max chamber size.
Not to say it didnt get there, then spring back-brass being ductile.
Now, cant explain the ring, maybe its signifigantly thicker interiorly and that line represents a change on the brass thickness and therefore the ring?
C-
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"...the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions." In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us. This book is about the possibility that Huxley, not Orwell, was right.” -N.Postman
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