Frank Wesson .38RF to CF conversion

[Crank]

Hello,
I didn't want to hijack my .327 K-frame conversion thread, so I will start another thread for one of my other hare-brained projects. I have a Frank Wesson in .38RF with a fair bore and got to doing some comparison. A shortened .38 Special case fits in and the bore slugs at about .360, so I started looking at what it would take to make it a centerfire. It turns out that it has a dovetailed recoil plate fixed to the breech, so I decided to make a new one for centerfire and incorporate a filler to eliminate the large gap in the center of the receiver for the rimfire hammer. Here is what I did last night.

















To avoid catching flak over it, I will warn everyone that this was a spur of the moment project during the downtime with my .327 and I can't predict when any progress may happen. Although, all that is needed is to final shape the firing pin hole and convert the hammer to centerfire, so something could happen at any time.

Mark

P.S. I know the firing pin hole looks off center, but that is the actual centerline of the hammer and the original recoil plate was not centered to begin with.

[uscra112]

So, it can be put back to original configuration then?

[taco650]

Were the two holes covered up by the center fire recoil plate of any significance?

[Crank]

uscra,
Probably, but why? collector following of the Wesson tip up is lukewarm, so I doubt there will be much in the way of wailing and gnashing of teeth. Face it, people that truly appreciate single shots, want to shoot them. This way it gets to stay in service.

taco,
Those are 2 threaded holes that were for blind screws (flush w/no slot) that held the recoil plate. I chose not to reuse them for my plate, as I feel friction will hold it like a dovetailed sight would.

Mark

[Green Frog]

Standing by with bated breath for further installments. I have to agree with your sentiments about the desirability of making this relic shootable, but I'm sure you will hear from the nay sayers as well. BTW, I assume you have doped out the mechanics of the bullet situation... it was an externally lubed, heeled bullet. You may end up needing a custom bullet mould or else rechambering to an over-diameter case you would have to make by blowing out your cases (or something?) Keep those reports on this and your 327 coming... maybe our virtual support will help keep you on task!

Regards,
Froggie

[Crank]

Froggie,
Thanks for the support, I am "THAT GUY!" when it comes to irritating "collectors" and my hide won't even twitch as they try to burn me at the stake. Unless a firearm is in pristine condition for its age and/or has a legitimate historical value, it is just another tool from a bygone era to be enjoyed. I think the bullet/case situation won't be too big of a problem, since a bullet sized or cast at about .360 will fit the bore and a shortened .38Spl. case fits the chamber, who says they have to be loaded together. If pushing a bullet into the bore first and then loading a case with powder worked for Harry Pope, why not me? I have already considered making a breech seater for my .33-47 Hepburn, so I would have to figure out a way to make one to work on the Wesson. However, I can do some digging for an alternative case and punch the chamber a few thousandths if necessary. I will stay on track for the .327, since I have a friend bringing some reamers for the cylinder this weekend. Then I will revisit this one.

Mark

[John Taylor]

You could open the chamber up to 38 S&W and not need to use a healed boolet. I lined my 32 rim fire to 22LR and only had to modify the extractor. Got some flack from a few people but the gun was useless with a rotten bore. If it were done 100 years ago it would be a collectible but because it was done this year all collectible value is gone, don't make sense.

[taco650]

Unless a firearm is in pristine condition for its age and/or has a legitimate historical value, it is just another tool from a bygone era to be enjoyed. Mark

I love firearms but I agree with Marks sentiments COMPLETELY! I don't own many guns but they do get shot regularly and all but two could be sold to buy something else.

One of those two is a Ruger M77 30-06 w/ factory iron sights, the old tang safety model. Its nothing unusual but it was the first rifle I ever bought. Bought it new when I was 16 and I had to work for every cent because my dad wouldn't help with the $$. Don't cuss him for it. He loved me enough to let me work for it and that was a very valuable life lesson. The other gun is my dad's 1928 Model 94 in "30WCF" and I'll keep that just because it was his. Shot my first deer with it too

Hey Mark, hurry up with these installments will ya? Nobody wants to read about me.

[texassako]

Face it, people that truly appreciate single shots, want to shoot them. This way it gets to stay in service.

Interesting conversion, but you could have always gone with converted brass. Pretty easy to fill the primer hole and drill an offset hole for a .22 blank for a primer.

[Crank]

John,
Right on track. I was kicking that around as a possible, but I will want to look at chamber length. I would prefer to avoid the bullet having too large of a jump to the rifling. I will probably do a chamber cast for an accurate assessment.

taco,
Amen! I totally agree that some guns are special and sometimes only to the guy that owns them. I am not a sentimental type, but I have one of them. An occasional customer/friend gave me a Ruger Hawkeye that was significantly damaged in a fire, he refused to accept payment since it may be unsafe. I replaced all of the springs and gave it a check for hardness and took it out for a test fire, all went well and I relayed my results to him. Fast forward a couple of months and I was getting back to the states after a couple of trips to Panama fixing a frigate that wouldn't go boom. I had a voicemail from his wife saying she needed to talk to me. I called thinking she wanted to have me do some work. When I called, she was so relieved that she found my number, but it was to let me know that he had been killed in a motorcycle wreck over two months earlier. They thought his cell phone was lost, but it was returned to her after the M.E. finished. She told me the date he passed and it was about two days after I talked with him. That was a rough night, but his memory lives on every time I pick that gun up.

texassako,
You are absolutely right, but I mess with enough brass, that converting it seemed more practical for me or a future caretaker.

Mark

[Navy Shooter]

John,
Right on track. I was kicking that around as a possible, but I will want to look at chamber length. I would prefer to avoid the bullet having too large of a jump to the rifling. I will probably do a chamber cast for an accurate assessment...

Mark

Thought I read on this board that a 357 Magnum was an exact fit for this. Someone else then said it was a 357 Max. Would appreciate hearing if either of those is true.

[Crank]

Navy,
The cartridge you are thinking of is the .38XL, this is a much shorter case with a heeled bullet, more like the size of a .38 spl. shortened.

Mark

[Navy Shooter]

Thanks Mark, I hadn't checked the boards, and so missed this.

I just 'ordered' a type 2 Frank Wesson by auction last week, supposedly in 38 caliber. Are the 38's chambered in 38 Long then? If so, would re-chambering to 38-55 be a possibility? It would be somewhat period correct, and was supposed to be an accurate load. It looks to me like the long would fit inside the profile of the 38-55. Not necessarily suggesting this for you, but wondering if you thought it would work, pressure wise. I haven't shot for very long, and am new to this.

Thanks,
Navy

[MT Chambers]

Crank: I don't think anyone will bother you, you look an awful lot like Rasputin the "Mad Monk".

[Crank]

Navy,
Bullet diameters are quite a bit different and this type of action is not well suited for that much of a cartridge (even in black powder).

MT,
I am deeply troubled, my photographer said it was my best angle.

Mark

[Navy Shooter]

Here's a picture of how Wesson did it in his later patent. Can be viewed at http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/PTO/patimg.htm, patent number 125640.

[Green Lizzard]

i have one that was 44rf i relined and chambered for 32-20 left the slotted breech as is, have only shot black powder and eq smokeless loads, but it seem to do ok

[Navy Shooter]

Wondering if you've had any more time with the Wesson. Froggie said he was waiting with bad breath or something...

Also, you mentioned that the firing pin seemed off-center, but was centered with the hammer. Is the firing pin centered enough for a centerfire? I'm assuming for the rimfire version, they really don't care if it hits at 12 o'clock, or 10 o'clock or something. Since he made these in .22 to .44, maybe there was a manufacturing advantage to having them off center, for multiple calibers.

Navy

[Crank]

No work on this one, it is splattered across my work bench and will be on the back burner for a bit. The firing pin plate was not centered, but the hammer nose was dead center.

Mark

[woodbutcher]

Now this sounds interesting.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo