Converting a S&W 64-7 to .327 Federal

[Crank]

Greetings,
I have previously posted a thread about a Winchester 1903 that I converted to .25ACP, mostly to annoy collectors and make most people question my sanity. Now, I have located all of the parts and just started the wait to pick up a S&W 64-7 (10 day gun jail). I am usually a terrible one to remember documenting the stuff I do, so I am starting this thread to shame me into keeping a record. This conversion does not have any twisted underlying purpose, it stems from the complete lack of a full/medium size double action revolver for this under-appreciated cartridge. With the only full size DA revolver being the now discontinued GP-100, I finally decided that the only way to scratch this itch was to build it myself. I do not profess to be the first to do this, but merely, that I am the builder and I am doing it slightly different than others.

Ingredients: S&W 64-7 .38spl. from some law enforcement agency (qty. 1).
S&W 648-? .22WMR cylinder (qty. 2, in case I screw up).
????? 7.65mm/.311 barrel blank 5.5" long (qty. 2, for the same reason as above).
Evil squirrels currently taking up residence between my ears.

Tooling: Graziano 14X60 lathe.
Bridgeport 9X42 mill.
Miller TIG welder.
Various chucking reamers.
.327 Federal cylinder reamer (will rent when required).

Once the gun is in hand, I will be fitting the 648 clinder to the 64-7 frame for the tightest lockup, then I will line bore the chambers to the desired pilot size for the cylinder reamer, depending on wait, I may cut the cylinder chambers if the reamer is available. While waiting for the gun to be picked up, I have a spare model 64 barrel that I will be boring out to larger than thread diameter, which will actually turn it into nothing more than an outer sleeve or shroud. It will then be back bored from the muzzle to a larger diameter for a distance of 1-2". One of the blanks will be turned to the correct diameters needed and threads will be cut to fit the frame. The remainder of the barrel blank will be machined to the profile of the inside of the "sleeve", but the section that will seat in the back bored section will be several thousandths oversize for an interference fit. The blank will be chilled and the "sleeve" heated to allow the parts to go together and then become one once the temeratures equalize. I will probably also use sleeve retainer for a permanent fit. The barrel will then be fitted, indexed, cylinder gap set and forcing cone cut. Depending on my level of enthusiasm, most of this work is pretty quick, but timing the order for the rental chamber reamer, may affect my timeline. Once the work is done. I will weld up the caliber markings and have the barrel engraved with the new caliber. Maybe S&W will have an epiphany and finally reintoduce the Model 16 or create a 616, such as Green Frog has built. I love .32's and I only gunsmith anymore to build the hare-brained ideas that I am too cheap to pay someone else for. I have some pictures of the starting steps on the barrel and I will try to post them tonight.

Mark

[376Steyr]

Are you going to proof-test the completed gun to see if it all hangs together? Running .327 pressure in a cylinder that was intended for .22 Magnum would be my biggest concern.

Personally, I'd love to have a factory K-frame with a 6" barrel in .327 for a small game gun, squirrels to coyotes with the right loads.

[felix]

Mod 19s were a dime a dozen back in the heyday of the gun. Sized perfectly for the 327. Sleeve the barrel and cylinder holes. A JES job? ... felix

[Crank]

376Steyr,
Smith and Wesson's cylinders all start out from the same heat treated material and are bored as needed. Unless they suddenly decided to increase their costs by using two different materials, I am still safe, but thanks for the concern.

Felix,
Sleeves for the bore and cylinder holes would be uncomfortably thin, that's why I am doing the barrel this way and boring out a cylinder. No one considered the two/multiple piece barrels made currently by S&W or using the Dan Wesson designs as insufficiently strong, I am just doing it without a barrel nut.

Mark

[Crank]

felix,
I'm curious, what is a JES job?
Thanks

Mark

[3leggedturtle]

Well I hope to see a range report soon. Then you'll need to build a companion rifle or carbine for it. BTW JES also doesn't do .401 or .402 rebores. Wanted to send him a Handi to be r+r'ed to .38WCF

[Green Frog]

This topic has come up several times of late. I actually believe that a K-frame 327 S&W is an idea whose time has come, but since the bean counters at S&W haven't figured that out yet, I did it myself. I had Project 616 out at the range today and I'm still glad I did it! Follow my trials and tribulations here;

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-rev...ect-616-a.html

Maybe you can save some time and avoid some pitfalls.

Froggie

PS BTW, does the cylinder from the gun you are using have a normal looking extractor star or is it sort of an odd rectangle like that found on the Model 617?

[Crank]

Froggie,
It looks pretty normal in the star area, the cut for the extractor is a bit different, but so is the 64-7.

3leggedturtle,
Contact Clearwater Re-boring, he re-bored a wasted 32-20 1885 barrel to .400 with a 1:16 twist for me and I chambered it in 38-40. It is way more accurate than I can do it justice, his work is great, but it took about eight months turnaround. Well worth the wait, but don't expect it the week after you send it.

Mark

[Mk42gunner]

Sounds like it will be a decent project. The only thing I might do differently is to weld up the caliber markings before installing the liner.

Robert

[taco650]

Sounds like it will be a decent project. The only thing I might do differently is to weld up the caliber markings before installing the liner.

Robert

Agreed. Welding after may cause distortion that would interfere with assembly.

[Crank]

MK42 (5" type?),
I will be using TIG and will have an extremely small HAZ (heat affected zone), I won't even discolor the inside of the barrel. Been there, done that. I just have to drag everything out to set up the welder and I will knock out several odd jobs at one time.
Here are some of the barrel:











Mark

[JHeath]

Are you this way about everything, or just guns?

I'm wondering if you drive a Citroen converted with a mid-engine 289, and live in a former church that you re-located over an abandoned missile silo.

If your guns are any indication, you're slamming those lifestyle choices right out of the park.

[Crank]

Jheath,
Now wait a minute! There is no reason to belittle an innocent 2CV. And as soon as I can get the roof mounted inter-cooler in a good location that won't tear through the fabric, I will have that GMC two stroke diesel running like a top. The Hari Krishna's were unwilling to alter the harmonious balance of the cosmic fields that intersected at the site and alas, the missile silo was a bust, my wife insisted on windows. So I tenuously pose as another member of society, with only my firearms as a means of expression. Did I also mention the evil squirrels?

Mark

[Crank]

JHeath,
I fell asleep laughing and I am still chuckling about your post this morning. The sad fact is, you have an uncanny insight into my natural desire to deviate from the mainstream. A lack of being independantly wealthy and the need to keep my wife from killing me, guides me down a humbler path. I have been gunsmithing over 25 years and I enjoy the road less travelled. My day job, troubleshooting and fixing cannons, provides a steady income and as I said, I do gunsmithing mostly for myself now. Of all the sites that I am a member of, this one has got to be one of the most fun to interact with. There is a great wealth of knowledge and cameraderie here and I hope to keep involved. Okay, with that said, now back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Mark

[JHeath]

!!!!

FWIW, I built designed, built, and operated acrobatic rigging for [famous Montreal circus]. I built a lot of mechanisms to fling attractive young women in leotards, or to dangle clowns, etc. That's "normal" for me, although I am transitioning into slightly more conventional industry.

One of my former employees was even written up by HR for "accidentally" farting on a clown. How's that for a reprimand to brag about?

But to get away from the humdrum, I come here to see what Crank is building today.

My (French-Canadian) wife is the same way about windows. Must be a chick thing.

[Mk42gunner]

MK42 (5" type?)...
Mark

Yes sir. Both Mod 9 and 10. There is just something fun when you light off 20 pounds of powder with each shot. Been a lot of years though.

It is really neat to watch a BL&P that you fired from OMC skip across the water six or seven times.

Robert

[Crank]

MK42,
I work on everthing from the 25MM M242 through the MK45 5". My bread and butter is the MK75 76MM and the MK44 30MM. All of those hydraulics on the 5" keep me learning! One of the other techs I work with has 40 years under his belt and has worked on everything up to the 16", I will regret when he retires this year, because he is such a wealth of knowledge.

JHeath,
Nothing beats a job where no two days are alike. Yesterday I was rebuilding and re-installing a valve block on the cradle of a 5" gun and today we were using a sledgehammer to set the headspace on a 76MM cannon (not joking, thats how it's done). I must admit that I can't quite get the mental image of the clown incident out of my head.

Mark

[Mk42gunner]

I'd get a job at SIMA if it weren't for the ~1700 mile commute.

I truly loathed the batteries for the 25mm. I thought they should have used a power supply instead.

Robert

[taco650]

Getting off topic boys with all the cannon speak LOL! Crank, don't you have that thing done yet?

[Crank]

taco,
If you weren't a squid, you wouldn't understand . I was going to try to get the reaming done on the barrel tonight, but a couple of friends descended on my garage and beer ensued. I should have the "shroud" finished this weekend and I will start profiling the barrel blank. I will warn any readers that I suffer from the firearms version of ADHD and often wind up with more irons in the fire than any sane person would. I am trying to finalize several of my long term projects while diving into new endeavors as they strike my fancy. I promise to take more picture to reassure you that I am staying focused. Squirrel!

MK42,
You dated yourself by saying SIMA, it is now SWRMC (Southwest Regional Maintenance Center) and the commute would be a slight inconvenience.

Mark