Under Gunned?

[GabbyM]

Those hollow pure lead Foster shotgun slugs are poor penetrators. I shot my first deer with one when I was fourteen. Next year I had a proper cap lock muzzle loading rifle.

[rodwha]

At 800 fps or below pure lead won't really expand will it? I've seen an old military video where they used several guns/ammo including an 1860 and a ball at 600 and something fps and shot gel with a bone and it didn't look deformed at all in the slow motion.

I wouldn't be able to ram a hard cast with the loading lever though anyway.

It might be possible to get some WW's to harden it up a bit.

[tacklebury]

In my ROA, I often shot 255 gr. Hard Cast bullets over 30 to 35 gr. FFFg powder if memory serves. Was pretty accurate and felt much like a .45 Colt for recoil. 8) It can be a little fun to get them levered down. One option is to use a loading stand and remove the cylinder and use the stand to load it up for you.

Similar to https://www.traditionsfirearms.com/p...lver-cylinders

[rodwha]

When you say hard cast do you mean the very hard stuff typically sold commercially which often has a BHN of over 16 or so?

[rodwha]

I know that Kaido states his bullets are 7-11 BHN and those aren't too bad in my Ruger.

It does give me the thought that I ought to look into collecting WW's for casting these, and using pure lead for the others and RB's/REALs.

[tacklebury]

Correct, specifically, Oregon trail lazer Cast 255 gr. RNFP with smokeless lube. I ended up selling the gun to my buddy, but after seeing how well they worked, my plan was to melt off the smokeless lube and re-lube em with SPG. Just sold it to buy something else that was calling before I did that. I still load the Oregon trail bullets in my .45 colt. The BP version .45 colt just seemed superfluous with my Blackhawk. I wasn't using it to hunt directly, only back-up on horribly dangerous eastern whitetails. I decided my .50 cal Kentucky or .45 Cal colonial would be good enough for finishing if needed. 8)

[BrassMagnet]

Correct, specifically, Oregon trail lazer Cast 255 gr. RNFP with smokeless lube. I ended up selling the gun to my buddy, but after seeing how well they worked, my plan was to melt off the smokeless lube and re-lube em with SPG. Just sold it to buy something else that was calling before I did that. I still load the Oregon trail bullets in my .45 colt. The BP version .45 colt just seemed superfluous with my Blackhawk. I wasn't using it to hunt directly, only back-up on horribly dangerous eastern whitetails. I decided my .50 cal Kentucky or .45 Cal colonial would be good enough for finishing if needed. 8)

If those eastern whitetails are half as tough as Colorado mule deer I can understand that.
My first buck turned into a wrestling match. I didn't have time to draw either pistol, it was just time to hang on for dear life or get perforated. I'm sure glad it was a little spike. I would have lost to a two year old. I yelled for help and my little brother came running. It didn't take him long to get there with a knife, it just seemed to take forever because I knew I was going to lose!

[tacklebury]

I don't let them get that close. I had a friend who was inexperienced and wanted to bow hunt. I told him, "if you get one down, stay back a bit and poke it's eye with an arrow tip.". He figured a knife would be just as good and when the blade hit it's eye, it stood up and beat him pretty bad. Was about an 100 pound doe, but broke 7 of his ribs and lacerated his head and face several places. He just said he wished he had listened better. Gave up hunting after that though. 8(

[horsesoldier]

Try wrestling an elk. I got kicked by a younger cow when I was 15.Sure smarts!

[tacklebury]

Ouch. That's one big critter!!

[725]

rodwha-
To answer your question, it was an onery 200lb + pig, shot at about 20 yards. Never recovered the roundball as it was a side shot placement right at the point where the shoulder begins. In and out. He spun around and flopped a little and died probably 5 yards from where he was shot. The wound was impressive. Basic entry hole but a nice cone of damage leading to golf ball + size exit. I've fooled around with almost every conical I could get my hands on. Still use them, but I will never feel undergunned with a pure lead roundball. As a matter of fact, I find myself using roundball more and more.

[Omnivore]

^^^^ In other words; shot placement is everything. We all know the stories of a man or beast absorbing a BUNCH of shots and still being able to keep going. Then there are the one shot stops. The difference between the two is placement of the bullet with regard to anatomy. Caliber or bullet design? Alloy? Within reason, now you're splitting hairs, Young Grasshopper.

Your original question then is; given proper shot placement, would this range of loads be within reason?

Yes, certainly. Look; you can completely eviscerate that pig with a grenade, and if it's central nervous system and blood flow are still functioning, it can still kill you. Put a 22 short in its ear and it'll drop like a sack of rocks.

[rodwha]

725: Ever use FN styled bullets?

Omnivore: I've never been in a situation where I had to react fast and shoot well or be chewed on, so I can only hope that I'd do well enough. Actually lets just hope the first shot is plenty, and there is no tracking necessary!

As I found that Accurate Molds has a ~5 week turnaround time asked, if it wasn't too late, if I could have the 285C modified so that the cast boolit would drop at 285 grns with pure lead, and he said it does as is.

[OverMax]

Hunting big pigs with a pistol is quite similar to bringing a knife to a gun fight. I could be wrong. As I don't have any experience hunting wild swine. But I have seen a rather big pair of nasty looking teeth on a wall mounted one once. That leads me to believe I'm right in my thinking perhaps.

[rodwha]

There are many who do hunt hogs with handguns, and they do well, though they all seem to recommend a magnum with a very heavy hard cast.

I don't know that I wouldn't do it were I capable of great accuracy with my handgun. As it stands I doubt my ability to keep all 6 shots within my 4" circle. A flier seems to ruin it often enough.

My intentions are to shoot it with my .50 cal rifle. I'd use my pistol if it wasn't put down and i had to go find it. I'd certainly give it 30 mins to bleed, maybe longer if it's huge!

[rodwha]

Indeed!

But some of the places I've hunted are too thick for even this somewhat compact rifle, though VA likely won't be anything like this scrub brushy place…

I do like the idea of a more handy weapon and a few more shots at the ready.

[Captain*Kirk]

I would not trust my life (or legs) to any muzzleloader if I had an alternative. Wild hogs can be vicious when wounded an I wouldn't want any more variables in the situation then there already are. .44 magnum would be my take on it. Save the '58 for something without tusks.

[rodwha]

ROA. And I'd like to get a Classic Ballistix cylinder which would bring it's performance to about that of a .44 Mag. Maybe I ought to look into having my stock chambers deepened…

My ROA has been 100% reliable after finding proper fitting caps, and ensuring they have the priming compound inside.

There are several guys who hog hunt with their percussion guns too.

[Alan]

I would have no qualms at all with popping a big hog with my .72 Gibbs. 540-ish grains cast of range scrap, that PRB will do anything needed. But I will have a .44 Maggie, or my JR 500 S&W on my belt.

[rodwha]

So you don't think this bullet and speed is sufficient?

I've wondered this as I always thought a .41 Mag or 10mm was about minimal, though I often carried a 1911 with 230 grn +P's, and this would give a much heavier bullet with slightly more power.

And what really made me consider such was the original .45 Colt was considered a great thing to have, though it was also the biggest thing in it's day that I'm aware of so it naturally was considered great.

But reading of field experience with 240-255 grn bullets from percussion pistols slightly exceeding the velocity of a .45 Colt (not cowboy loads) and penetrating nose to tail through an adult made me feel such a thing was quite plausible. And be more sure I increased the weight, gave it a wider meplat, and did what I could to shorten the OAL by increasing the driving bands and making the lube groove more shallow as I don't really believe a pistol barrel needs as much as many do, and hunting and a range session yield different results anyway.

But I do prefer to hear from those who believe it not so good and why since this is a speculation and theory for me. I've been considering what can be done to quantify it's usefulness before finding myself with gnarly gashes! Enough Knox gel is over $80 and I'm not even sure my range would allow it.