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Thread: Fun with the 8x58R in a Swedish RB

  1. #21
    Boolit Buddy Andy_P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy_P View Post
    After some playing, I have determined that there's another option for making 8X58RD, even though 8X56 Hungarian remains a fine solution (albeit it's difficult to find).

    338 Win Mag.

    Remove the belt and a few thou from the base as required (to 0.500" - a "no-bulge" diameter), but don't touch the rim. Anneal, F/L size and trim to length and anneal again - done. The rim diameter is small, but the extractor usually catches it. The rim is also thinner than spec as is 8X56R Hungarian, but there are commonly-used techniques to compensate for that - the rim can be shimmed from behind with an o-ring, or the cast bullet can be engaged with the rifling, either of which pushes the base against the breech. After fireforming, most of us neck-size so the shoulder will maintain headspace, or the o-ring or loading method (bullet against rifling) can be maintained.

    338 is my first choice among belted magnums, but so would any belted magnum, but 338 Win Mag is close to correct final length, as are 7mm Rem Mag and 264 Rem Mag - the others are all longer. The neck of the 8X58RD is below the neck of any belted magnums, so final neck thickness is the same for all (on the thick side), except that 338 gives the best start to the sizing process.
    Some pics:

    338 Win Mag, sized in 8X58RD die, final length (made from 45-90 is shown)

    Click image for larger version. 

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    8X58RD from: 45-90; 338 Win Mag; and 8X56R

    Click image for larger version. 

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    If you must have an exact replica, then use 45-90, but it's a lot of work.

    If you want it easy and fast, then 8X56R is the way to go (but brass is scarce).

    If neither of the above are feasible for you, then use a belted magnum.

    If all else fails, then you're stuck with Bertram.
    Last edited by Andy_P; 06-13-2016 at 05:50 AM.

  2. #22
    Boolit Mold Teutonius's Avatar
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    Hello friends of 8x58 RD.
    I am the proud owner of a rolling block in this caliber. There is a Swedish gun, model 1872 - 95. The cartridge cases are transformed from 45-90. This only needs to be shortened.
    The best result I get with a lead bullet (210 grain, with gascheck) and 21.3 grain Vithavuori N 120 (pressure is about 12000 psi., velocity is about 1510 fps.). Greased lead bullet in .325. Gascheck made ​​of copper with the Gas-Check-Maker from Patmarlins. Unfortunately, I do not know how to upload images. The best group is 2.6 inches at 100 meter distance.

    Greetings
    Teutonius

  3. #23
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Is .45-70 too short for this round? 2.6" isn't bad for a really old girl like that one.

    Bill
    If it was easy, anybody could do it.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtGun44 View Post
    Is .45-70 too short for this round? 2.6" isn't bad for a really old girl like that one.

    Bill
    Remember that they have loooooong throats!
    So a medium boolit in a short neck = not so good.
    I use a 8mm MAX and seat only 7,3mm~.286" for my M67/89 Swedish Rolling Block.
    As you can see there is not much boolit to seat in that short neck.

    Last edited by Skunkworks; 09-18-2013 at 07:02 AM.

  5. #25
    Boolit Mold Teutonius's Avatar
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    I hope that this time it works with the image.
    Distance 100 meter, with peep sight.
    And yes, 45-70 cartridges are too short.
    In fact, this old gun shoots well.

    Greetings
    Teutonius

    Attachment 82107

  6. #26
    Boolit Mold Teutonius's Avatar
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    I try it once more.

    Distance 100 meter, with peep sight.
    And yes, 45-70 cartridges are too short.
    In fact, this old gun shoots well.

    Greetings
    Teutonius




    Click image for larger version. 

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  7. #27
    Boolit Master enfield's Avatar
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    8x58r rolling block . 17 gr 4759 with Lee .329 boolit gas checked gave me 4 shots in 3/4 " with a peep sight ( 5th shot made the group 1.5 " grrrr ). I may try to increase powder a bit but not sure about going up to 20 or more grains.

    hey, watch where ya point that thing!

  8. #28
    Boolit Buddy Andy_P's Avatar
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    I think that 20.0 grs of SR4759 with the Lee boolit that weights about 205 grs is still moderate, and 22.0 is not unreasonable. I go as high as 20.0 grs of SR4759 with the MidSouth "Maximum", which weighs 250 grs for about 1500 fps.

  9. #29
    Boolit Master enfield's Avatar
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    that's good to know, I'm considering the NOE 8mm but I found the .329 Lee shot so much better than the .325 ( as cast size) Lee boolit that I'm not sure if the .326 will be enough. any experience with that one ?

    hey, watch where ya point that thing!

  10. #30
    Boolit Buddy

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    I got a 67/89 in 8x58R about a year ago. I actually found some 45-100 locally and started forming up cases this afternoon. I have some Graf 8x56 cases from years ago, but I'm saving those for my M95's. Just gotta come up with an efficient way to reduce those 45-100 rims... Good info in this thread!
    If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.

    Thomas Jefferson

  11. #31
    Boolit Buddy

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    Well after I got about 20 of these formed up I tried them in the RB. They fit just fine, so it appears that reducing the rim won't be necessary.
    If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.

    Thomas Jefferson

  12. #32
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Teutonius, that is some good shooting there.
    I have reformed 45-70 and with the Lee Karabiner 235gr boolit they work fine. Don't work very well with the Lyman 160gr Loverin though.
    For those I use some longer cases I bought from a member here.
    I'll have to get my Swedish RB out for some exercise soon. Haven't shot it in about a year. Probably should take the Pedersoli Creedmore in 40-65 along also.

  13. #33
    Boolit Master
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    This darned thread worked its spell on me, and I have a 67/89 incoming. Will likely order the CH4D dies, and Grafs 8X56 brass. Have an NOE .325/205 mold, so will try that before ordering the Lee .329. You guys are all terrible enablers, you know.
    Teutonius, fabulous target at 100 meters!

  14. #34
    Boolit Buddy

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    Has anybody found a good way to minimize the sizing of the neck to conserve brass?
    Last edited by craig61a; 03-22-2015 at 06:15 AM.
    If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.

    Thomas Jefferson

  15. #35
    Boolit Master enfield's Avatar
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    use a 8x57 Lee neck sizing collet die. it works good on my 8x56 brass and you can adjust it to how much you need it. I had to order it in pieces because they don't seem to sell it separate from a whole die set and I don't have a 8x57 rifle.

    hey, watch where ya point that thing!

  16. #36
    Boolit Buddy

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    Yeah I've done that. I use a 1/2" washer around the case since the case oal is about .050" longer than the 8x57. I plan on getting a .324 mandrel for sizing. I'm running .325 boolits in it. The cases mouths blow out to approximately .337". I guess short of cutting a new custom chamber there's not much that can be done.
    If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.

    Thomas Jefferson

  17. #37
    Boolit Master enfield's Avatar
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    By the way, the NOE 326471 boolit shoots o.k but the larger .329 LEE boolit shoots better ( so far with limited testing )

    hey, watch where ya point that thing!

  18. #38
    Boolit Buddy

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    I have the NOE 326471, but haven't shot it out of my rollers. I have used the Lee Max and it shoots very well. Also have Accurate 326220B which I haven't shot either. Also have a clone of the 8x56 Frankenboolit which drops .335". I usually run Wheel Weight. Now I have heard of of people running a boolit that is just over the case size of the case mouth, but since the groove on the rollers is right at .323" I'm concerned there might be a little too much pressure. I guess I'll have to do a little more research.
    If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.

    Thomas Jefferson

  19. #39
    Boolit Buddy Andy_P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by enfield View Post
    use a 8x57 Lee neck sizing collet die. it works good on my 8x56 brass and you can adjust it to how much you need it. I had to order it in pieces because they don't seem to sell it separate from a whole die set and I don't have a 8x57 rifle.
    You don't own a rifle in 8X57!

    Now that the shock has passed, I can state that I bought a 325 WSM F/L die a few years back and use it to neck size all of my 8mm's, but depending on the brass some necks come up loose - those whose specs on neck thickness differ from the 325 WSM.
    Last edited by Andy_P; 03-21-2021 at 01:32 PM.

  20. #40
    Boolit Master enfield's Avatar
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    I know, I know, I do have a 8x57 barrel but none of my Mausers are as modern as the K98 ( 1871, 71/84 ,1891, 1896 ) you guys and your new fangled stuff.

    hey, watch where ya point that thing!

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check