Real Accuracy (2 moa or less) with Coated Rifle Bullets at 1800 fps or greater.

[waksupi]

Thought I posted this the other day but I thought I'd give an update. Ended up getting to shoot about 50 of my Lee 312-155s (out of 300 blackout over 14.5gr Lil Gun) the other day at 100yds. Accuracy wasn't were I wanted it to be, was getting about 5"-6" groups. Turns out when I got home and looked at the barrel it was streaked like a sewer pipe, lead from leade to muzzle. I'm pretty sure what happened is I had some of my APP Pink in the mix that had some problems with PC scraping off the driving bands while sizing/seating check. I had recoated some and sorted some that I thought were good (could still see the lead through the driving bands but obvious sheen from PC being there) but I was obviously wrong (had put about 50 of the PBTP Green through the barrel previously and had a pristine barrel so I know they are fine). Need some more testing with this mold (and application of APP Pink).

Also will have a new mold to test soon that just got in today: NOE 309 129gr PT, two cavities are PB and two are GC.

I would call that a very poor boolit design, and doubt you have much luck with it. Stay as close as you can towards the Loverin design for target and hunting, and be in a happy place. You need to reverse your thinking for cast, think heavy, not light.
I don't own a cartridge rifle that will not shoot under 1.5" at 100 yards, at at least 2100 fps. If they won't do it, down the road they go.

[Rushthezeppelin]

I would call that a very poor boolit design, and doubt you have much luck with it. Stay as close as you can towards the Loverin design for target and hunting, and be in a happy place. You need to reverse your thinking for cast, think heavy, not light.
I don't own a cartridge rifle that will not shoot under 1.5" at 100 yards, at at least 2100 fps. If they won't do it, down the road they go.

Hmmm well I can't go much heavier otherwise I drop down below the 1800+ fps (with regards to the 312-155) the OP is looking for. Also not sure if a Loverin design would even feed well in a 300BO AR, especially if I want to try and seat it close to the lands.

Also what exactly is your reasoning for this likely being poor in the accuracy department (I'm assuming you are talking about my new mold)? It is about the same profile as the Barnes black tips made specially for the blackout and those things are tack drivers for alot of people.

[waksupi]

Hmmm well I can't go much heavier otherwise I drop down below the 1800+ fps (with regards to the 312-155) the OP is looking for. Also not sure if a Loverin design would even feed well in a 300BO AR, especially if I want to try and seat it close to the lands.

Also what exactly is your reasoning for this likely being poor in the accuracy department (I'm assuming you are talking about my new mold)? It is about the same profile as the Barnes black tips made specially for the blackout and those things are tack drivers for alot of people.

Cast bullets are a different animal. I don't think you have enough bearing surface.

[Rushthezeppelin]

Cast bullets are a different animal. I don't think you have enough bearing surface.

If you were trying to suggest the bullet wouldn't be stable with the amount of bearing surface it has, a few people have gotten to shoot bullets from this mold in the last 2 days and all have reported very stable bullets and some people are starting to see around 3 MOA so far.

[Rushthezeppelin]

1.5" at 50 yards does not equal 3moa. Patterns are not linear with distance.

Sorry Don. Trying to stay out of this thread till I have something to report. I think it is about time to clean this thread up.

Thought I saw one report of 3" at 100 on 300blktalk, perhaps I was mistaken since I was trolling those threads half asleep last night, my bad. Regardless I think he was trying to imply that the bullet wouldn't be stable (as you were initially thinking as well), which so far seems to not be the case. Not trying to rub it in anyones face, I can understand why this might be a questionable design just looking at it just reporting on prelim results people are seeing.

[brstevns]

Must one use a gas check on a gas check type bullet if the base is being covered with coating? Only trying for 1800-1900 in 30 cal rifle

[brstevns]

If your boolit bearing surface is large enough. I've gone to 1750 (308) with the 31-165C, DT in HF red. The B version doesn't make it. Haven't gotten around to trying for higher, but accuracy @ 100 was about the same as B GC'd @ 2450. Alloy will make some difference. About 100 fps less in the 300BO, present proj. I'll get back to the AR & MG 30/30 later this year.

Using a Lyman 311291 and air cooled WW. Want to use it in a 308 win and a 30-30

[dverna]

1.5" at 50 yards does not equal 3moa. Patterns are not linear with distance.

Sorry Don. Trying to stay out of this thread till I have something to report. I think it is about time to clean this thread up.

xacex,

Thanks. I tried getting permission to edit some of the useless stuff out but could not get a lot of support for the idea. I hope it does not get as bad as some of the 100+ page coating threads but we shall see. With good weather here there will be a lot more results coming. If it gets too cumbersome, one option is to start a new thread with a higher performance threshold and let this one die of natural causes. 2" at 1800 is nothing special with traditional lubes; so, at this point, it looks like coatings will not be an "easy" solution for accurate high velocity cast bullets. Still hopeful the magic bullet (or should I say coating) will be found!

Don Verna

[Love Life]

Don, I will go through and delete as many as my posts off as possible. Hopefully others will do the same (including all those posting groups shot at less than 100 yds).

Done.

[waco]

Hmmm
I couldn't open the attachment.

[bbqncigars]

A recent outing at 100yds with a 535gr Postell boolit in a repro Sharps 1874 Creedmoor tested the same boolit lubed vs. Hi-Tek. The only difference in loads was how the boolit was lubed. Greaser groups averaged 2" with an average speed of 1780fps. Coated groups averaged 4" & 1860fps. The load of 37gr Varget is one this gun likes with greasers. I will experiment to see if the coated boolits shoot better with a different charge.

[supersniper]

Started working with PC'd boolits in the .260.

Using some old IMR-4320 (34gr) at around 2400fps gave me a 1.3" 5-shot group at 100yds using the RCBS 140 SIL GC cast from WW and WD - sized to .266

The "naked" boolits were absolutely horrible as the allow was way too soft - lucky if it hit the paper at 100 - same load as above.

[cs86]

The "naked" boolits were absolutely horrible as the allow was way too soft - lucky if it hit the paper at 100 - same load as above.

When you say "naked" are you meaning that it was traditionally lubed without PC or powder coated without a GC or something else?

[supersniper]

CS86,

Naked boolits were traditionally lubed and sized with a GC.

The PC'd boolits (also GC'd) withstood the higher velocity just fine although I did have to sand the nose down from .258 to .256 in order to get them to chamber.

I will have to get a custom sizing die made for the nose that will get me back to a .256 diameter for chambering and bore riding.

[StromBusa]

Range test with the 1:7 twist BO today was miserable. Shotgun pattern @ 100, leaded terrible. 150 gr WD PCd PB 16 & 17 gr 4227 (guessing ~ 1800-1850 fps, 850#-ft). I'll download it a lot & make one last try. If bad then I'll find a 223 bbl and give it to the GSs. No use to me. As I don't plan on mortaring SS heavies or plinking with 100 gr boolits, the numbers make no sense. It will shoot 168gr Amax 1600 fps ok but that's about all. Why bother. 130ish jacketed bullet @ 2200+ is the only thing that would make sense for a 100 yd hunting rifle. Don't buy a yugo!

good luck, I hope you figure it out, I will be getting my BO out of lockup soon...I hope...

[fastfire]

Gun DPMS AR-10with a 20” Criterion SS barrel 1/12 TW.
Scope, Bushnell 4200 6x24
Boolit; Lee312-155R
HF ESPC red
Alloy; 75%COWW25% Linotype spacers =14 BHN
Sized to .311
Light roll crimp.
COL 2.630
LC 13 brass flash hole deburred,primer pocket uniformed.
Hornady gascheck seated with a seater made by Buckshot, this tightened my groups!
Thanks, Buckshot.
Boolits sortedinto 1/10^th gr. Groups
I have shot very few jword in this barrel(didn’t workup a load).
These two groups10 shots ea. @100yds
The first groupw/cold bore) measured c/c 1.53 my bestso far.
Second groupmeasured 2.50 including the 2 flyers, without flyers 1.41
Powder 36.6gr Varget
2253 fps sd16
I have been shooting 40-60 rds a day working this load up, the groups keep getting better.
PS. I read couple of days ago that if the boolits age 3-4 weeks the groups will be better, I couldn’t wait, these boolits are 3 days old.

[fastfire]

Good shooting. Try annealing the GCs & add some shot to the alloy, drop right from the oven. How do they shoot single loaded?

Gas checks are annealed.
Shooting single I lost the shoulder weld each shot and had to reacquire it each time.
From what I have read here I should get better groups when the boolits age a bit.

[fastfire]

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[StromBusa]

nice work fastfire!

Gun DPMS AR-10with a 20” Criterion SS barrel 1/12 TW.
Scope, Bushnell 4200 6x24
Boolit; Lee312-155R
HF ESPC red
Alloy; 75%COWW25% Linotype spacers =14 BHN
Sized to .311
Light roll crimp.
COL 2.630
LC 13 brass flash hole deburred,primer pocket uniformed.
Hornady gascheck seated with a seater made by Buckshot, this tightened my groups!
Thanks, Buckshot.
Boolits sortedinto 1/10^th gr. Groups
I have shot very few jword in this barrel(didn’t workup a load).
These two groups10 shots ea. @100yds
The first groupw/cold bore) measured c/c 1.53 my bestso far.
Second groupmeasured 2.50 including the 2 flyers, without flyers 1.41
Powder 36.6gr Varget
2253 fps sd16
I have been shooting 40-60 rds a day working this load up, the groups keep getting better.
PS. I read couple of days ago that if the boolits age 3-4 weeks the groups will be better, I couldn’t wait, these boolits are 3 days old.

[leadman]

Went to the range yesterday with my 1960s' era Savage 110 CL 30-06 and some heat treated linotype boolits coated with the Gold 1035 (3 coats), and Hornady gas checks. The boolit was Lee's 30 caliber 200gr RN sized .309". Powder was H1000 and a Winchester large rifle primer. Overall length was 3.19" . Range was 100 yards. 5 shots

Here are the results:
Charge Avg. Velocity Group Size
55 grs 2,354 fps 1.435"
56grs 2,396 fps 1.715"
57grs 2,427 fps 1.646"

Bore was very clean and shiny after shooting. This is the first time I have used this powder and it was amazing how clean the bore was.