I think I'm getting the airgun bug

[Ohio Rusty]

I was given a .177 caliber Feinwerkbau 124 airgun with a broken stock. I fixed the stock and have been shooting it a little, but to hit anything, I need a scope. I've been doing some searching of airgun info, and there is a whole world of airgunners out there. Some of these guys hunt game sized animals with them up to the size of a coyote !! One shot kills on game animals out to 40, 50 even 60 yards. This is getting more interesting as I learn more about the potential of todays pellet spitters. I think I need to save my pennines and look at a magnum .22 air rifle next year. Any excuse to get out and shoot more ....... I'll use this .177 in the basement this year to help break the winter doldrums.
Ohio Rusty

[scrapcan]

do a search on large bore airguns. You will be amazed at what people are doing with precharged variety. I think there is a website with custom made airguns for african safari. I have the link but it is at home. You should also read about hte airgun that lewis and clark had with them on their big trip. they shot deer with it as reflected in their journals. There was a great airgun expo at the Cody Firearms museum in Cody, Wyoming a few years ago. I am glad I spent the day in that section (I alwyas do even thought the natural history section is very good also).

[Powderpacker]

Air guns are a great way to get in some indoor trigger time. The mid-price range hand guns like Gamo, Webly, etc. are a lot of fun and very accurate. I also use mine for outdoor pest removal. The IZH-46 is in about the same price range and it is what the Russians used for Olympic air handgun competion a few years back. It's larger than most of the other air handguns and a little quirky to operate but it's extremely accurate and also a lot of fun to shoot.

[GSM]

Both the air rifle and air pistols will give a good (sometimes unpleasant) lesson in follow through - great for reinforcing fundamentals that seem to be forgotten after shooting for a few years.

The IZH 46 is very difficult to be topped for the money. It is built like a T-34 tank and just as accurate as the pre-charged pistols.

[utk]

I think shooting anything bigger than, say a mouse, is unethical. Too little power for a sure kill, IMHO.

[Springfield]

utk: I thought so to, but I have sold some of my BP bullets to air rifle hunters and they shoot things as large as a Ram with them with no problem. Go to some of the air gun hunting sites and you might be surprised, I know I was.

[corvette8n]

Rusty:
I have a Gamo shadow 1000 with a 4x BSA airgun scope, with 8.4gr pellets I get thru and thru's on squirrels and garden hoses(don't ask me how I know this)
So far I have keep 14 squirrels and 7 chipmonks out of the bird feeder.

[utk]

Ok Springfield, I was thinking of hunting with .177 or .22 and their light 7-15 grs pellets.
Of course there are "bigger guns" that are more powerful. Here in Sweden .22LR is required as a minimum except for rats etc where now a .22 cal airrifle with at least 591 fps (180 meters per second) is permitted.

[corvette8n]

watch the 1st and 3rd videos.
personally I won't shoot anything bigger than a grey squirrel.

http://www.gamousa.com/Catalog.aspx?Action=Videos

[9.3X62AL]

Funny how this thread came up right now. I did some shooting of my RWS-52 air rifle last week at the Burrito Shoot, and its accuracy at 25 yards--and my aging eyesight at 50 yards--have prompted me to seriously explore the acquisition of a scope mount and spring-piston-proof scope to extend the rifle's capabilities.

The -52 is 25 caliber, and the rifle LOVES the Beeman Crow Magnum pellets. These weigh about 26.5 grains, and achieve 780 FPS from this platform. They outclass the 22 LR Colibri rounds significantly at backyard ground squirrel engagement distances (to 40 yards or so). The Colibri requires a head shot on the rats for a guaranteed whack, but the 25 airgun will create a DRT effect with a center-mass hit. I also have a RWS-45 rifle in .177 caliber, and its effects on critters isn't up to the 25's capabilities. 8.0-9.0 grains at 900 FPS won't do for ground squirrels unless a head shot with pointed pellets is employed.

A few years ago, California began allowing the use of air guns for the taking of resident small game and resident game birds. The requirements are .20 caliber minimum, which pretty much eliminates air pistols--very few are made in calibers other than .177". The 25 caliber might be a bit much for most airgun hunting--but excess in the pursuit of rat assassination is no vice. (Apologies to our Founding Fathers). The best "compromise" for diameter--velocity retention--and velocity potential from a given platform seems to be the 22 caliber for hunting. I saw a RWS-48 at Bass Pro last week in 22 caliber, and almost grabbed it. That rifle will give 900 FPS to the 20-22 grain pellets in that caliber. They might shoot a little flatter than my 25, not sure about that. I have taken jackrabbits at 20-25 yards with the 25, and they are lights-out with center-mass or head hits. Head shots usually go through-and-through, center-mass hits usually are contained.

I would welcome any commentary on experiences with airgun scopes. I do know that high-powered spring-piston airguns can destroy centerfire scopes in short order, and would like to avoid that occurrence if possible.

[Scrounger]

I go hot and cold on the air rifle thing. I have a nice RWS Model 48 in .177, RWS Mount and New BSA Air Rifle Scope, but I have had it up for sale for 2 years so I guess the bottom line on it is definitely cold. Every now and then I get the urge to use it but I still prefer real guns...

[Mk42gunner]

Al,

From what I understand it is the 'double recoil' of the spring piston guns that destroys scopes; because in a lot of centerfire scopes the lenses are only braced for recoil in one direction. I would check the construction details of a scope before I put it on a spring gun.

Your 25 cal seems almost as powerful as a 22 short hollow point, so I can see why it works out to 25 yards. I have killed a lot of squirrels, (and more than a few treed or trapped racoons) with those.

Robert

[Larry Gibson]

Please note: This is not a flame or intended to start a pissing match to which some (not you 9.3x62AL) might construe it as. It is merely to add to the topic of conversation and provide information based on my years of experience with air rifles. My intention is only to further the discussion.

9.3x62AL

Not to denegrate the power of said air rifles but the velocities you quote are for the lightest pellets of those calibers. The power of a springer air rifle remains constant so the lighter the pellet the faster it goes and of course the heavier pellets go slower.

I've had a .22 cal M54 for some years and have shot several M48s and M52s. My shooting also included chronographing. Currently I've also a Webly .117 and a Beeman R9 .20. The .22 cal M54 is the same action as the 48/52 but has the recoiless feature added. Published velocity is 900+ fps but that is attainable with the lightest pellets. The 14.3 gr Crosman Premiers run right at 800 fps (ran 830 fps with the first spring). Quality domed pellets and are the best all around pellets as they hold accuracy to a much greater distance than other pellets. They also kill just about as well as most any pelllet. Crow magnums weigh 18.2 gr and run 660 fps. They are very good killers but lose accuracy past 35 -40 yards due to the 1-14.5" twist. A really good killer on short range jack rabbits out to 35 yards was the old Vortex Lamprey which had a massive HP. It to lost accuracy past that. The Crosman Premiers will shoot consistantly under 1" at 50 yards and right at 2" at 90 yards. I've not chronographed the .25 M48/52 but I'm sure your velocities with the best .25 pellets will be down in the 500- 600 fps range. Still quite deadly though.

I've killed 69 rats off my squirrel feeder with the M54 and R9. I've also killed numerous rabbits, lots of ground squirrels quite a few crows, gobs of starlings, several pigeons, a couple feral cats and numerous other small vermin with the M54. The R9 has accounted for some (even managed to shoot a trophy bull elk with it!) and the Webley sees duty around the camp shooting yellow jackets and rogue grasshoppers.

I started out hunting with air rifles a number of years ago (30+) when a friend (who was a part time sportings good distributor) showed up with two demo FWB 124s, a .117 and a .22. We got permission to shoot the ground squirrels around the Forest Service buildings at the airport. Had a ball, got my own air rifles (should have bought that FWB .22 cal) and have enjowed it ever since. Actually my first "kill" was with a pump up .22 cal air rifle (don't remember the name) when I was 5 years old. I had captured a gopher under a bucket and when I tried to pick him up it bit me. I loaded up the pellet rifle (took some doing pumping the rifle up hard), kicked the bucket over and shot it. As to hunting bigger animals than I have with air rifles I figure if I do that I step up to a firearm. Same if I want more power.

Shooting a springer accurately can be a lesson in humility as they have their own quirks. You have to learn to hold them correctly and consistantly. Most of the magnum ones are hell on scopes so a quality air rifle scope is a must. I've run the gamut of RWS, Beeman, Simmons and Burris air rifle scopes on the M54. I'm now using a Leupold and so far so good. The M48/52s and other magnum springers are as bad on scopes. The R9 wears a Simmons 4X which is holding up without problems.

I prefer the springer to a pump or gas air rifle as with the rifle, a can of pellets and one cock they are always ready to go. No pumping and no tanks to go empty. Anyways welcome to the wonderful world of air rifle shooting. It is a very enjoyable part of the shooting sport. I would like to hear of some chronographed velocities from your M52 .25 cal. I generally set the front screen up 2' in front of the muzzle and I get very consistant readings. Last time I chronographed (Oehler 35P) the M54 with CPs (unweighed) the averaged 799 fps with and SD of 6 and an ES of 14 for the 10 shot string.

Larry Gibson

[Scrounger]

Accurate Reloading has quite an active Air Gun group. Carpetman recently posted about killing a 3 foot snake in the tree in his front yard. I believe he has a .20 he bought from Buckshot...

[Larry Gibson]

Might check out the "Squirrel Pellet Gun" thread on our Hunting forum.

Larry Gibson

[9.3X62AL]

Larry--

The 780 FPS figure was chronographed by me, with the Crow Magnum pellets--which are on the light end of the weight spectrum. As far as I know, the piston spring is a stock item--but the guy I bought it from was an engineer at Rohr Industries in Riverside, so he might have had the rifle re-sprung. He was pretty inquisitive, and did lots of wild stuff. Dunno. I do know the sidelever is a bee-otch to cock, more so than a 48 in .177" I tried some years ago. I thought that might be due to the caliber differential--but again, I know just enough to be dangerous on this subject.

I think you are correct on the inaccuracy bit at distance--past 35+ yards with the irons, hits on critters are a little iffy. I thought it might be my eyesight, but if they de-stabilize as you say, that might be the answer.

Thanks a bunch.

[Larry Gibson]

That is pretty cool, must be a different spring in the .25 cal. I much prefer the side cock to a barrel cock, especially with the more powerful models. Will be interesting to see how the accuracy holds with a good domed pellet.

Larry Gibson

[shotstring]

I have a Beeman Rx 2 in 22 cal and consider it an excellent training tool for high power shooting. It quickly shows you the errors in your technique, and is great for small varmint critters up to 40 or 50 yards. The larger the critter, the closer they need to be to be humane.
The problem isn't power - even a 177 fired from a pistol can penetrate a rabbit, in one side and out the other - I have done it. The problem was, the rabbit didn't even realize it had been shot. I was forced to go back into the house, get my Ruger 22 pistol, and with one shot knocked him head over tea-kettle and it was all over. With pellet guns, you just don't have the lead mass, thus the knockdown power. DO NOT use anything but a scope designed for pellet guns! Leupold will not cover the scope under warrantee if they find you used it on a pellet gun, and many Leupolds have been destroyed in just that way. Of the centerfire rifle scopes, for some reason Bushnell Banner scopes do have a reputation of holding up with pellet guns, although I have never used one.

[Ohio Rusty]

The more I've read, the more it seems the air guns that use the air tanks are more popular across the pond. Spring and lever cockers are more popular here in the States. Mt Brother has several 20 caliber guns. I did several years ago get a squirrel with his Beeman .20 and it was an instant kill. That was the only experience I had with air guns/bb guns until recently. Wally World has a Daisy Powerline 3x9x34 for less than $30 and that includes the mounts. It seems lots of guys like a scope made by a company named 'Leapers' I think. They aren't expensive and Natchez and Cheaper than Dirt both sell them so I've read. My eyes aren't good enough for seeing small targets at longer ranges, so a scope is mandatory for me. It's amazing to read folks making head shots on small game at 40 a 50 yards with an airgun !! That means someone put that tiny pellet powered by air into a target 1/2 inch square at 50 yards ..... man o' man that is excellent shooting. Several fellows on another site showed pics of wild turkeys they got with air rifles. That is my idea of a good time !! Unfortunately, that isn't allowed in Ohio. This air gun stuff might get fun, and it sure looks addicting. Next year, I'm leaning toward a .22 caliber, either a RWS/Diana 350 Magnum, a 460 or one of the high power RWS guns, one of the 50 series guns.
Ohio Rusty

[Bob Jones]

I don't have any interest in hunting with one but bought a little $50 air pistol, Russian, at a gun show last year and use it in my shop in the winter shooting at 40'. That thing will put all the shots in 1/2" at 40', the rest of the group size is my fault. It's cheap and convenient practice, lets me shoot at home in the winter with no noise to mention.