For those who have served so that the world may be a better place:

[MtGun44]

I've talked to many vets about their service, but mostly in aircraft and on ships. I think the
land battles that were more personal are a lot harder on the people.

I would like to point out, that I am entirely sincere when I say "thank you for your service" to
a service person. I really do understand the military (father, brother, sister, and more were or
are in the Navy, Marines or AF) pretty well, even though I never served. My contribution has
been to design and build things to make bad things happen to bad people for more than 30 years.

I sure have no real idea about ground combat, but I am truly thankful for those the have
served and sorrowful for their wounds physical and mental. I have lost close family to war,
and it sure hurts, forever. One family member has been to the sandboxes 7 times.

For all those veterans out there - Thank you for your service. Stay safe.

Bill

[jaysouth]

I think that most VN vets could tell you that surviving the first 20 or 30 years after VN was an ongoing ordeal that left them feeling an outcast. The heroes of that era were people like John Kerry, our esteemed secretary of state and former senator from Mass, going around telling everyone that anyone and everyone who served in VN was a war criminal, murderer, arsonist and rapist. This was picked up by the MSM and became a perception that made life miserable. You could see it in the eyes of employers, admissions directors, bosses and, and fellow workers.

Most of the people who suffered were draftees. They had two choices, go into the army or go to prison, that's what the draft is all about. The heroes were the ones that fled the country and denounced those who served. There are legions of veterans who have been badly abused by our country that are loathe to speak of any experience lest they will be tainted by john Kerry and his ilk.

Think about who is running our country today. The heroes of the anti-war movement, need I say Hillary, Joe Biden, John Kerry, the executive staff of almost every college and university, and our media. I understand why a lot of people are ashamed to speak of their service.

[leeggen]

Very well said Jaysouth!!! As a student in school if someone spit on me it was fight on. During my service I was never asked if I wa in Vn., I was a military person and that was that.
We underwent bomb threts hate mail and every kind of disrespect you can imagine and some you can't. That is why I try to thank every Serviceman or woman I meet. Sometimes it is hard for me to do , but then I remember what I felt like haveing been treated in disrespect, so I put my hand out to thank those that feel upside down about coming home from duty.
Sometimes it is not just for them but for myself also. It is a real shame that our soldiers have to get plumb da-- drunk just to beable to release some of their troubles. I know a few and I listen carefully to them, then I never pass their story along cause it was said in a military type confidence amoung past and present service members. It was their secret and I respect them, I just talk to them about specail help that I know about.
CD

[jaysouth]

When I got out of the army in 1969, I applied for a position with several police departments in the Middle Atlantic area. One interviewer ask if I still did drugs or had ever murdered any villagers.

In the late 70s, I worked for a small subsidiary of a well known media giant. there were 50-60 employees depending on demand. Each week an employee was selected randomly for a drug test. Two black guys on the loading dock and I took 45 for the 'random' tests in one year. A couple of years later, I was the corporate controller of a very well known internet company. One of the people that reported to me was the director of personnel. She was of the opinion that all veterans be flagged as potential threats in the workplace and that no VN veterans be hired because of their proclivity to violence and drug use (the president of the company was a West Point grad and did two tours in VN). He and I seldom agreed on anything, but that was her last day on the job, but indicates a mindset fueled by the mainstream media and pop culture.

I could go on for hours. After Obama got elected the second time, I sewed my flag up in a triangular pigskin case. It will not be displayed again, because it does not represent the country that I grew up in and my family has served since 1777. It will be cremated with me when the end comes.

It has not gone away and we should be aware that all too many vets don't want to be identified as such much less talk about their experiences.

[MtGun44]

I respect those that served and despise Kerry, Clinton and Biden.

They have the lying media pushing their false stories, and get away with it. They are wrong
and the veterans are in the right. The alphabet networks and big eastern papers like NYSlimes
and Washington Compost are a pox on this country, providing nothing but falsehoods 90% of
the time.

Bill

[rick173]

Well I looked in here again and decided I would crack the lid on that can of night crawlers just a little. So here goes. I went to Viet Nam in January of 1966 assigned to the 1st Bat, 503rd Parachute Infantry Regiment, 173rd Airborne Brigade. I'm not going to talk about blood and gore. I want to relate a few short things that reading through this thread tonight prompted me to think about. The first thing is who we were really at war with. Anyone who has ever spent a little time in the far east will readily understand this. Although they all have slanty eyes there are major differences in the looks of Chinese, Vietnamese, Koreans etc. It is based on this and the fact that we did body counts and saw our enemy after the fight that I say we killed a lot of Chinamen over there along with VC and North Vietnamese Regulars. The second thing is a ambush patrol one night. It was dusk not dark yet. I was setup and watching my lane of fire when a 6ft white guy in dark brown fatigues walked by being followed by 20 or so VC. I came to my senses and opened up, to late to get the leader. When it was over we checked bodies but the white guy wasn't there. I told our platoon leader about it and he said I saw a Russian adviser. I have never had any doubt about who we were at war with and what for. It did my heart good when I heard about the Soviet Union being bankrupt and breaking up.
The other thing I'll relate was when we were not doing search and destroy ops. we sometimes took Air Force Forward Observers in close to their targets. It was on one of these little forays that we found the NVA 66th Division near Song Be. The problem with these little patrols was when the FO was calling in very accurate bombing runs it didn't take charlie to long to figure out those pilots had eyes on the ground. It was during this time that our FO, an Air Force Capt. got shot in the leg. The Company Commander got a Med Evac chopper going and we put down covering fire for the dust off to get in. I had the FO over my shoulder after sitting against a tree with him, getting a tourniqete [hell I can't spell] on his leg, before running out with him to the med evac. About ten years went by and I was on a flight from Newark to Washington when I got up to go to the mens room. As I walked down the isle of the plane I saw a pair of eyes locked on mine. I was back in the jungle in a second with the FO. I didn't look anything like I did as a 20 year old grunt and neither did he but we had instant recognition. It would be another 27 years before I dealt with what caused that moment. And that leads me to this. When I got home, which was to my parents home in New Jersey they hugged me welcomed me home and never said a word about my time away. I left Viet Nam wounded and spent 13 months at the 249th General Army Hosp. in Japan. They never mentioned it. They just didn't know how. Neither did I. It wasn't until my wife of 15 years asked me since the mess over there was over, was I ever going to watch the news again. Hell I said the news is boring. If I want to know what the weather was I would ask her. Who me? I'm fine. Fifteen years after that she stopped sleeping with me because I was reliving the thing in nightmares and she was tired of me saving her, covering her and or pushing her out of bed into low cover. I still held out another 7 years before a close friend of mine and a WW2 combat veteran took me down to the VA in San Antonio[we had moved to Texas in 1978] and introduced me. They signed me up and walked me into triage and said I needed to see a PTSD Counselor. Well I did and they did and now I'm 68 and I don't wake up screaming anymore. It ain't perfect but it's enormously better.
I hope that some of you new kids coming back from Afghanistan and Iraq. That little war on terrorism where you got to serve multiple tours and had geniuses telling you they were going to bring you in and talk to you about your experiences every few months and that way you wouldn't get PTSD. I couldn't believe I heard that right the night it was on the news. I think the talking heads can report anything and keep a straight face.
Man don't be me. Go right away and get the help. Your life will be so much better. It seems like BS when your doing the different programs. But a little at a time you get a little better. But it takes a long time.
So Airborne! and Semper Fi! for my Marine grunt brothers.
Sorry I went on so long and thanks for listening.

[AlaskanGuy]

I must say this... Lots of folks that returned from asia came home to unwelcome hostile crowds of folks that did not love, or support us in any way. Many just hated. Made me ashamed for the time that i served for a long time. like i had done something wrong... Then i saw how things changed with desert storm and such with those awesome guys that served the same way that we all served, and they were heroes, while those that served before were scum. That s why i don't say nuthin about it... Bring up all of those feelings of betray, and bitterness, and those are better left buried forever. I have learned to forgive, but its damm hard to forget.... Better to just put it away and not discuss. I am much happier that way.

Everybody that puts on a uniform and their life on the line for the service of their country is a hero. Period.