Powder Coat Piglet style VS Klass Kote

[Skip62]

I've done this both on PC sprayed and tumbled boolits. I find no benefits of any kind. It does make sizing harder to do (go figure). So I tried sizing first before the HBN, but it just makes loading at the press slippery. Looks like I got a pound to sell.

Excellent, that just got crossed off my list.
Thanks

[prickett]

My oven wasn't up to the task either, it would swing from 325° to 475°, not good. That's why I went back to KK.

Basically, 1 teaspoon of KK in the bottom of a 2 1/2 quart mixing tub, dump in 1050grains of bullets and shake and swirl till coated. I dump before they start getting sticky. Repeat 4-6 hours later, sometimes 24 hours, until I've got 3 coats on. I then pour 2 racks of bullets into a sauce pan and warm them up with the heat gun, then put a little carnauba wax on them and mix around. I think this step makes the barrel cleaner. If you look at the MSDS sheets for KK it says you can speed up the curing time by heating to 120°. I sometimes do this with a heat gun, takes about 5 minutes to heat 8-10 racks. Some swirl longer with good results, it's one of those things that you have to play with until you know what works for you. I'm going to try 1/2 teaspoon for the first coat next time, just curious.

Good luck.

What ratio are you using for your KK? 2:1 or 1:1? Are you thinning at all? When you heat, how much cure time reduction do you get? Have you tried fewer coats than three?

I saw where you were out of carnauba. I tumbled my Piglet boolets with a small amount of JPW when I was having problems sizing them. That helped immensely with sizing, and might give you the same "clean barrel" as carnauba. I have a whole tub of the stuff now that I don't have to mix up LLA + JPW + MS anymore!

[Skip62]

Oops, I just tried 1/2 tsp/1050 grains of bullets, thinking I was cutting it down. I think I was always using 1/2 tsp, except the last time, which explains why I went through so much...lol 1/2 is more than enough. Next time I'll try 1/4 tsp.

I'm following KK's instructions for their product which is 1 paint, 1 hardner, and whatever is needed for reducer based on humidity and temp. When I first tried KK I was frustrated because I was constantly getting mixed results due to amount of reducer. It was late spring in Texas, now that it's 95° all the time, I use 1 reducer. The cooler it is, the less you need. I'm going to experiment with that too, but I just can't cast and shoot fast enough...what a great problem to have. I've giving a lot away, just to get more testing in.

I have gotten away with 2 coats, not sure what the difference has been. Now I just make sure I can't see lead and call it good.

Not out of carnauba, could have been a typo. It goes a long, long way. I have JPW here and have used it on PC bullets. I think I'll try the JPW on the next batch to compare, it's much easier to apply.

Thanks questioning me about that, I would have wasted more of the stuff.

[NineInchNails]

Was thinking of taking hardware cloth and making a squarebox or a hex tube and then connecting it to a rotissary spit with motor. With a fan on it, it will dry and agitate without them sticking. Just an idea, any one else come up with something except a vibration table.

Someone mentioned attaching a square plastic kitty litter bucket to a rotisserie motor. The square sides makes the boolits tumble. I thought that was smart.

That is a rig I wouldn't mind seeing. Might give people ideas. It sure got me thinking about ways to frame it up, easy on & off and stuff like that.

[Maximumbob54]

Just had what may or may not be a dumb idea for the Klass Kote. I'm sick of getting it all over the buckets. It doesn't peel off for me and it tends to flake off if I reuse the bucket. I bet I can get a bunch of small trash can liners and a small plastic trash can to fit them, add bullets, add KK, tumble, pour out bullets, pull out liner, trash liner, and bucket stays clean.

[Maximumbob54]

Klass Kote "Battleship Gray" with satin catalyst but looks like Haze Gray to this sailor:

[jmort]

Looks good to me, but I'm no sailor.

[Skip62]

Darn good looking bullets

[nighthunter]

Received my KK today and did up a couple small batches. I got the dark brown and the bullets come out looking like pieces of chocolate. A couple things I learned already that I haven't seen posted. If you are going to gas check them make sure the gas check is square to the base or the bullet will enter the sizer at a slight angle and cause shaving of the coating. I'm thinking a push through sizer might eliminate this. Also an out of round bullet will have the coating shaved. These are just a couple of things we can get away with when lubing in the traditional manner. Definitely going to be a learning game. I'm glad some of you learned some of this stuff first. Will get some loaded tomorrow and see what the results are.

Nighthunter

[shadowcaster]

Klass Kote "Battleship Gray" with satin catalyst but looks like Haze Gray to this sailor:

Looking good!

I was just wondering.. How did your KK rifle boolits perform? Did you give them a coat of JPW? How hard did you push them? Gas check or no gas check?

Shad

[Maximumbob54]

Looking good!

I was just wondering.. How did your KK rifle boolits perform? Did you give them a coat of JPW? How hard did you push them? Gas check or no gas check?

Shad

None of them are loaded with gas checks and I haven't done any JPW on anything. The .30-30 loads are a middle of the road 170gr Trail Boss listing in the Hodgdon load manual (I forget how much but it's a load I know to be accurate) and the 8mm Mauser loads are I think 16gr maybe of 2400. I don't have the load data in front of me but I want to start mild and see if they make it before I push them. Testing is this weekend... (I hope...)

I will add this. I quit using the thinner and went back to a 1:1 mix. I just tumble them in the KK in the bucket, pour them over regular wax paper to air dry tack finish to the touch, then pour them over the screen, bake them at around 200 for 15 minutes and re coat them one more time with another air dry then bake. Then I load them. Everything in standard pressure handgun has worked fine now. Light magnums and powder puff rifle testing is TBC but I will of course post results. TBC...

[Maximumbob54]

Received my KK today and did up a couple small batches. I got the dark brown and the bullets come out looking like pieces of chocolate. A couple things I learned already that I haven't seen posted. If you are going to gas check them make sure the gas check is square to the base or the bullet will enter the sizer at a slight angle and cause shaving of the coating. I'm thinking a push through sizer might eliminate this. Also an out of round bullet will have the coating shaved. These are just a couple of things we can get away with when lubing in the traditional manner. Definitely going to be a learning game. I'm glad some of you learned some of this stuff first. Will get some loaded tomorrow and see what the results are.

Nighthunter

You have to post pics of the chocolate boolits!!!!

[nighthunter]

225107 with and without GC, 311041 and Mihec's 430640 with and without GC. Probably hard to eat as the KK probably isn't digestable.

[prickett]

None of them are loaded with gas checks and I haven't done any JPW on anything. The .30-30 loads are a middle of the road 170gr Trail Boss listing in the Hodgdon load manual (I forget how much but it's a load I know to be accurate) and the 8mm Mauser loads are I think 16gr maybe of 2400. I don't have the load data in front of me but I want to start mild and see if they make it before I push them. Testing is this weekend... (I hope...)

I will add this. I quit using the thinner and went back to a 1:1 mix. I just tumble them in the KK in the bucket, pour them over regular wax paper to air dry tack finish to the touch, then pour them over the screen, bake them at around 200 for 15 minutes and re coat them one more time with another air dry then bake. Then I load them. Everything in standard pressure handgun has worked fine now. Light magnums and powder puff rifle testing is TBC but I will of course post results. TBC...

Bob,
Any reason you quit thinning?

[Skip62]

I will add this. I quit using the thinner and went back to a 1:1 mix. I just tumble them in the KK in the bucket, pour them over regular wax paper to air dry tack finish to the touch, then pour them over the screen, bake them at around 200 for 15 minutes and re coat them one more time with another air dry then bake. Then I load them. Everything in standard pressure handgun has worked fine now. Light magnums and powder puff rifle testing is TBC but I will of course post results. TBC...

how much KK are you using per number of bullets on each coat? And, like Prickett,why no thinner?

[Maximumbob54]

Nighthunter - Those are awesome!!!

Prickett - It just doesn't seem to be needed. They tumble nice and quick without it and it seems like less mess and no more tiny splatter splashes.

Skip62 - I try to add a minimal amount but I've added more if I'm not getting a full even but thin coat. I'm using tossed aside plastic spoons from the office plastic ware stash. Every time someone just needs a fork they open a kit and toss the rest into a bucket. We have a pile of spoons that hardly ever get used so I grabbed a few. I fill the oven tray with boolits but I've never counted them. I usually add half a spoon of A and then the same of B but again I've added as needed. And again, I've not found a need for the thinner. The very first batch I ever did of KK was without thinner and I started using it only because everyone said you need it. Now that I've stopped I don't see a reason to start up again. The coating may be a bit thick but it's all in making sure you don't add more than you need.

I've never done a smash test to see if the coating will flake off. So I smacked this one pretty good with a fifteen pound hammer:



After the third whack with the hammer I noticed the tiny tears in the coating now that it's about an eighth of an inch thick. I'm pretty sure it's a good sticky tight coating.

Now how about these apples....

http://youtu.be/dotsGdy8kjo

Yeah, that's a Hornady bullet feeder dropping epoxy coated cast boolits into the cases... I need to get some missing parts from Hornady for the Bullet feeder (they were missing from the box) and soon it will be a Hornady / Inline Fabrication Boolit feeding Ammo Factory...!

[Skip62]

Thank you Sir. I just did the 2nd coat on 600 bullets without reducer, good enough results, maybe better. Thanks

[Maximumbob54]

Finally got to the range before the rain kicked in but still had to trudge through a swamp to reach the target stands.

The good news:

I shot both the 8x57 and .30-30 loads both of which were loaded to minimal recoil mouse fart type loads. Powders used were Trail Boss for the .30-30 and 2400 for the 8x57 both of which have been decent shooting loads in previous lubed lead testing with these powder charges. I let some Hoppes soak in the barrels and with a couple of patches I see zero leading and the bores are sparkly clean.

The bad news:



That's at 25 yards...


When I first started with lubed lead I had the same results and had to work with alloy, powder choices, powder volume, and bullet sizing to get both of these loads dialed in before I started getting a respectable grouping at 25 yards and then stretch it out to 50 yards. I never did try the 100 yard range as I started to get all into the coatings to try. So I was really hoping to not start back at zero again for testing but it seems starting at zero is required. As these coated bullets are more similar to a plated bullet than a lubed lead bullet the first thing will be to stop sizing to larger than bore diameter and default back to bore diameter and start working up powder charges from the bottom again. So as usual...

TBC...

[nighthunter]

Attachment 80366Attachment 80367Range results .... Mihec's 359125 HP with 2 coats KK sized .358 and loaded over 3.8 gr WW231 in 9mm. Accuracy was more than acceptable at 25 yds. Had 100 rounds loaded and fired them all in my Beretta 92A1. No hint of leading or epoxy left in the barrel. Bore looks clean and shiny as if only a fw rounds of jacketed ammo was fired in it. I also loaded and shot Mihec's 430640 HP with 2 coats KK sized .430 over 16.5 gr 2400 in a Ruger SBH 5 1/2 inch barrel 44 Mag. 44's were loaded both with and without GC's on a GC design. Shot about 75 rounds through the 44 and again accuracy is better than acceptable. Surprisingly the un gas checked bullets grouped better than those with gas check. Recovered bullets (pic)Attachment 80145Attachment 80144 maintain the KK coating despite good expansion in a dry dirt berm. The un gas checked 44's show no sign of gas cutting through the coating. I like this coating a lot. I'm going to get some rifle rounds loaded up and will try them out in the next few days. I'll post the results.

[prickett]

So what is the prognosis with KK and getting chips from previous tumblings? One person posted that they were getting chips from the dried paint on their tumbling container when they tumble subsequent batches. Are others experiencing that too? What type of containers do you guys use (either successfully or unsuccessfully)?