30 Cal M2 AP Penetration (30-06)

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

have you tried shooting the 13 inch oak log with anything else , I found that even the lowly 30-30 with cast bullets in a not particularly hot round was going thru a 9 inch oak log


you need a tree wider than you are to call it cover when you start shooting rifles at it
softer woods , well it's going to be hard to find a tree big enough.

this isn't the movies where a door jam and a few 2x4's stop bullets

when you get done with all your testing , it would be interesting to see how many shots at the same spot it takes to get thru that 8 inch concrete. looking at the crater of a hole it left , i am thinking 3
I would bet that with a bandolier of enblocs you could make swiss cheese of that wall making it lousy cover


thank you and very nice job

[xs11jack]

Very interesting and informative. The following posts scared me. I come across some military stuff now and then in my buying and trading. I will definity pass up any of that stuff. Didn't get to 71 taking big chances! I guess you could call the bounce back an involuntary suicide!!
Ole Jack

[MakeMineA10mm]

The key to bounce back is what your shooting at. Wood, dirt, sand and even water won't kick rounds back. (Water will allow deflections/ricochets in other directions, so not 100% good idea or "safe.") Very solid/massive rock and steel are the dangers. Ammo doesn't matter so much. I've had .22s come back at me off steel and rock. 7.62x39 lead core/steel jacket came back off a steel plate a buddy shot before I could tell him to quit. Distance don't matter a lot either. There's a youtube video of a guy shooting a .50-cal Barret at steel several hundred yards away, & the bullet came straight back and hit him in the head. Steel should either fall, bounce/move, or be angled down to deflect bullets into the dirt.

AP ammo is perfectly safe if you don't shoot steel or rock with it.

[smokemjoe]

Wow, I have been very lucky in my days, Joe

[Blacksmith]

My copy of Hatcher's Notebook is in the basement but IIRC .30-06 Ball ammunition after it goes far enough to become stabilized will penetrate 34" of oak. There are pictures of stable and unstable rounds penetrations in the book.

[MtGun44]

+1 on the stable versus unstable. IIRC the issue came up when they tested a
design for an Army rifle range and found that 150 gr M2 ball was reliably stopped
by 10-12" of dry oak timber (from mem). Later they started getting reports
that rounds were penetrating much deeper on real ranges. Turns out that
at 200-300 yds the bullets were so much more stable that they penetrated
very deeply. At the shorter testing distances, the bullets were still yawing
slightly and had not fully settled down, so they tumbled in the oak, leading
them to believe that this was an adequate thickness since it seemed that
the slower bullets at longer ranges should penetrate less. Turns out to not
be so.

Bill

[Blacksmith]

Hatcher update. I went and got my copy of Hatcher and the photographs are on pages 406 & 407 and the captions are as follows:

"Penetration of 32 1/2 inches of oak by .30-'06 bullet weighing 150 grains driven at a muzzle velocity of 2700 f.s. Range, 200 yards. The range was long enough so that the bullet was sufficiently stabilized to continue point first and thus give good penetration. At shorter ranges, the penetration is likely to be much less-see photo showing results at 50 feet."

"Penetration of 11 1/4 inches in oak by .30-'06 150 grain bullet driven at 2700 f.s., range, 50 feet. The penetration is much less than that achieved at longer ranges. The reason is that at this short range, the bullet had not settled down to a stable flight, and when it encountered the resistance of the oak it yawed badly, and rapidly gave up all its energy."

The picture of the badly yawed bullet did show a larger permanent cavity.