simple Hi-Tek coating

[HI-TEK]

Maybe Tony has a contaminant on his cast Bullets?
Some type of oil use to lube the sprue plate? Dropping into a dirty old rag that has oil on it?
Dirty container to tumble in?

Thanks for your input.
In the last 12 months, we discovered that TonyN's alloy was highly contaminated with Zinc and other impurities. Many had tried to help and advise how to obtain a reasonable alloy how to remove Zinc and other contaminants. To this date, we have no idea what he is doing, as after 15 minutes his baked coating simply washes off with solvent.
Then he wanted to rewire his oven, and had no idea of electricals. He was advised to use a certified electrician to do the work. This was not done.
Many had advised TonyN that he requires clean alloy with no other lubes that may contaminate cast. No reply and it is really not known what and how he does things.
This is all a mystery.

[Michael J. Spangler]

Thanks for your input.
In the last 12 months, we discovered that TonyN's alloy was highly contaminated with Zinc and other impurities. Many had tried to help and advise how to obtain a reasonable alloy how to remove Zinc and other contaminants. To this date, we have no idea what he is doing, as after 15 minutes his baked coating simply washes off with solvent.
Then he wanted to rewire his oven, and had no idea of electricals. He was advised to use a certified electrician to do the work. This was not done.
Many had advised TonyN that he requires clean alloy with no other lubes that may contaminate cast. No reply and it is really not known what and how he does things.
This is all a mystery.

Understood.

I can’t see why anyone who tried PC and Hi-tek with proper instruction on both would ever choose PC.
I saw a recent article in handloader magazine about PC. Bullet looked terrible and accuracy was less than traditional lube sized bullets.
Doesn’t seem worth it to me.

[HATCH]

Didn’t read back far enough to know this went on 12 months.

Tony, if you have any further questions I suggest that you contact the supplier that you got the product from and see if they can assist you.
We have taken up enough space on this thread already.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ausglock]

Didn’t read back far enough to know this went on 12 months.

Tony, if you have any further questions I suggest that you contact the supplier that you got the product from and see if they can assist you.
We have taken up enough space on this thread already.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep. I agree.

[Avenger442]

I have just kind of sat back for the last couple of days and watched without adding my voice to this discussion. I think that maybe a little oil needs to be put on the water. And the volume be tuned back a bit on both sides. Ha, listen to me talk about tuning it back. It has taken me sixty seven years to learn how to just be a little diplomatic and quite in my reply.

There are those that consider a product that competes against one they think is the best or have been using to be somehow a threat. Some kind of attack. And they will try to disparage the product and find fault where there is none. Not a very objective attitude. We have seen the same thing go on between traditional lubes and what can be called the alternative lubes (which includes more than HT and PC). Some of the real old time guys really don't care for alternative lubes. Seems it violates the tradition of what has been used for many years. Kinda like most guys when I was growing up having a favorite car make. Some guys were Chevrolet others were Ford and then there were the Dodge and Chrysler guys. Tony may be this.

Or he may be like the guy I had working on a crew under me back when I was a Field Engineer. I would tell the guy how to do something that was the way of providing the results we wanted and he would not do it or not do it the way that I asked him to. The guy wasn't dumb and actually was a guy I grew up with and we were friends. He just couldn't or wouldn't seem to get it and wasn't cut out for the job.

Point is we don't "know" Tony is any of these. And Tony if you read this I'm not suggesting you are either one. My offer to do on site help is still open. What we do know is that he has had what seems to be an unusual number of problems and at times success with Hi Tek. He has asked for help multiple times. And, to this groups credit, received it to the point that has frustrated some. Including, at times, myself. Might add I agree with someone who said what they said about the stove. Get it and see if it works. Not sure I would spend that kinda money on it, but that seems to be the logical thing to do with the responses that have been given.

We also know Hi Tek works as a lube. It is not all that labor intensive either physically or mentally to use. Not especially messy when applying, unless your me and get it on your hands. Yes I know Joe I should wear gloves. It's cheap to use. And it will help produce accurate ammunition if we do the other things that that requires. I would say as accurate as any store bought with much much less cost. And that, for me, is where it comes to the end. If I can't use it and it be thrifty and make the round accurate it is not where I want to go and will look for something else.

Is PC any better. I would say no based on what I have shot. But I have never done the whole process of PCing bullets. I've just loaded and shot some that someone coated for me. I didn't see anything in those loads that would recommend or cause me to switch to PC over Hi Tek. I once told another member of this forum that I might try PC one day but have never found a reason to do that and several to keep using Hi Tek. If someone were to ask me which one lube I would recommend they try I would have to say Hi Tek. That's where the majority of my experience is and that has been a good experience.

But back to Tony, my suggestion is that if we have some help that he has not been given in the past year or so to solve his problems we give it. If not, simply reply that that problem has been addressed maybe even give him the post number or not reply at all.

And while I'm on the subject of recent post. Treavor I have not had a problem with the way you put stuff, due to my tempering in the construction industry. It is not exclusive to your country. It is just like over here in certain groups of people you find more abrasive attitudes. The construction industry, especially in the field, is not where you need to be if you are easily offended. The guys in the field actually like to see if they can offend you. I gives them great delight to know they have. I'm sure I could find something that offended any person. Let's face it the world is full of stuff that is offensive to someone somewhere. And most of it ought to be just ignored.

[Ausglock]

And while I'm on the subject of recent post. Treavor I have not had a problem with the way you put stuff, due to my tempering in the construction industry. It is not exclusive to your country. It is just like over here in certain groups of people you find more abrasive attitudes. The construction industry, especially in the field, is not where you need to be if you are easily offended. The guys in the field actually like to see if they can offend you. I gives them great delight to know they have. I'm sure I could find something that offended any person. Let's face it the world is full of stuff that is offensive to someone somewhere. And most of it ought to be just ignored.

Ha... yep 40 plus years in a sawmill has made my skin very thick and immune to offence.
But I understand that some people are just not cut out for certain things. If I come across as abrupt, then is it from dealing with dropkicks for the said 40 years.

As they say... you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

As I said. I tried the PC, but it was too messy and slow for large production. But if it works for someone, then go for it.

[dikman]

I must admit I'm really curious to know why Tony is still having these problems. As has been said many times, it's not "rocket science". Once the principles behind the coating are understood the only real variable is getting an oven sorted and once that's done it's almost idiotproof (I stand as proof of that statement!!). I'm using a cheap non-convection oven and have done several thousand boolits in it and yes, I've had a couple of problems but they were my fault, not due to the product.

Most perplexing.......

[eljefeoz]

TonyN
tell you what, on a weekend, I can walk you through the process on skype- PM me for the details.
I have an oven /Toaster / i bought on Gumtree for $10, an oven thermometer ,another $9, an assortment of used fish oil/Vit d conatiners.
Ive done about 2000 to date, had them going from batch2-batch one looked leprous, ,I didnt know they were fine, so melted them...
The alloy ranged from sheet lead to BHN 30 Foundrytype. calibers from 12 ga Lyman, lee 7/8 12 ga ,lee TL for .45, lee 0.312 for .303 and 7.62x39, Saeco 160 gr, RCBS 145 SIl and 160 gr for 7x57, 280 gr 0.368" from a CBE mould for 9.3x62 and 380 gr 0.425" for .404 J. I'm waiting for an RCBS .224 mould...

I also have a redundant RCBS LAM2 lubesizer-cleaned and now used only as a sizer, about 20x 200gr cans of various lubes- Satan's being my favourite. Matter of fact, I lubed a batch of hitek-ed projjies as I was scared of leading.Truth be told.
My projjies range in appearance from leprous to slick as snot to sandpaper rough ( thick coating)
but NONE have ever leaded.Period.
for someone with ten left handed thumbs,I am in awe of my capabilities.

[glockfan]

I must admit I'm really curious to know why Tony is still having these problems. As has been said many times, it's not "rocket science". Once the principles behind the coating are understood the only real variable is getting an oven sorted and once that's done it's almost idiotproof (I stand as proof of that statement!!). I'm using a cheap non-convection oven and have done several thousand boolits in it and yes, I've had a couple of problems but they were my fault, not due to the product.

Most perplexing.......

i too think that most problems encountered are either contaminated boolits,not leaving the coating drying enough before baking , OR an inconsistent oven..

i' m a total beginer at coating my boolits , and i'm the kind of guy who has a tough time cooking water
for my coffee (this said to illustrate how without my wife i would die from inanition lol) , so of course i was a little nervous cooking my first batch, and in fact i messed it ; i realized afterward that it was my fault ; i was so eager to cook that i did not left the boolits drying enough on the tray before baking them on the 1st coat ; then, sure enough , a second coating over a 1st coat not correctly done isn't a cure.

after my first failed attempt, i bought a little 20 dollars fan,and left the coating alone under the fan for half an hour before baking and guess what? success!! now i have '''noted''' how my oven work,i will never ever have a problem again. the only thing i'm going to do is getting a PID for both my ovens; not because it's mandatory for good results, only because i can and it's a fun project since i know that from now on i will never ever shoot anything else than my own casted hi tek'ed boolits . i added a small brick on the bottom of each oven to help the recovery time when you open the oven door,that's it. it helped in that matter.

[slide]

I don't think there is anything else that can be done for TonyN. A lot of people have tried with no luck. Hi-Tek is just not going to work for you. Be glad that pc does, refine that technique and keep on choogling! Good luck to you!

[wlkjr]

It's definitely not rocket science. A little common sense sure helps though. I always rinse all my raw casts in a small Folgers coffee can with acetone and then drain, pour out on my cooking screen to dry and then coat. That pretty much assures that any contamination in handling is washed away. My coating procedure is not standard as I don't measure precisely the amount I squirt on the casts, but I have learned what amount works for me. I preheat my B&D large convection oven at least 20 minutes prior to cooking and I have two steel plates in the bottom for heat retention. This allows me to cook 8-10 pounds of boolits at a time. If I could not get this to work in a year and powder coating worked for me otherwise, I'd choose the one that was easiest. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is insanity, or maybe plain stupidity.
Only problem I have not been able to conquer is the slight leading I get in all 4 of our G42's. Might be my lead composition, regular wheel weights. All my 9mm and .45acp work great and all pistols are Glocks. I have probably coated at least 15-20,000 since I started. I think I had a couple of smash test that flaked a little but loaded them up anyway and they worked fine. Great coating you guys. Keep up the good work.

[glockfan]

^^^^^
so,you still experience some barrel fooling even with the coating? might it be because it is not completely baked and the boolits doesn't pass the smash-acetone test? i'm guessing that when the hi tek is correctly done, you're not supposed to have any leading in the barrel because hi tek is sealing-enclosing the boolit completely.....if you have some leading,something is wrong with the baking-cure part of the process....

[Ausglock]

You can get leading for different reasons.

My Para 45ACP leaded badly. I had to get the barrel throated with a reamer. Since then, it has been lead free.

Leading can also be caused by bullet dia. not correct for the bore.
I have S&W 686 357Mag revolvers that hate .358dia bullets. But love .3565dia.

So. Leading is not just a coating failure issue.

[wlkjr]

^^^^^
so,you still experiment some barrel fooling even with the coating? might it be because it is not completely baked and the boolits doesn't pass the smash-acetone test? i'm guessing that when the hi tek is correctly done, you're not supposed to have any leading in the barrel because hi tek is sealing-enclosing the boolit completely.....if you have some leading,something is wrong with the baking-cure part of the process....

Same process as I use with the other calibers, except even coating three times. It is not a heavy leading but a gradual build up over a period of about 200 rounds or more. I'm sizing at .357 for the .380. If you look into the barrel it just looks like a very dull coating. It has not caused any kind of problems and accuracy is not affected, but it is a minor irritation to keep dealing with.

[wlkjr]

You can get leading for different reasons.

My Para 45ACP leaded badly. I had to get the barrel throated with a reamer. Since then, it has been lead free.

Leading can also be caused by bullet dia. not correct for the bore.
I have S&W 686 357Mag revolvers that hate .358dia bullets. But love .3565dia.

So. Leading is not just a coating failure issue.

I don't think it is a coating issue. Maybe I need to size smaller.

[glockfan]

interesting observation...i've learned that an ''undersized''' bare lead boolit is gonna lead a barrel, whereas a little oversized round is desirable.is the same equation apply with a hi tek'ed boolit ?

[glockfan]

guys !! ausglock and MR hitek...just wanted to share my pride and joy....my third attempt turned so great. after tweaking both my ovens by adding a brick on the bottom to help the recovery time,i've realized that MY ovens gives me PERFECT results settled at 385 for 10 minutes.

also, my new honeywell little fan produced some magics in the sens that i now only have to wait 10 minutes between coatings . it really speed up the process.

my new batch passed the hammer and acetone test with ease. i'm so happy with how it turned out...and i have now MY recipe , and i know from now on each batch will be crowned with success ; and take note that it took only 2 coats to produce these beauties.

these are the lee 356120 tc . they will be loaded over 3.5 grs of VV320 at coal 1.130 to be shot in my glock 17 limited gun.







they're perfect.the finish is very slick. i've resized them at .356,and they left nothing in the die. no flakes,no color...nothing.very,very nice boolits. couldn't be happier ,because i've took notes of the process that work very good,and i've saved a lot of time the way i'm doing it now. i'm now a hi tek die hard fan,and i have some eastwood ford light blue for sale LOL!!!

[Ausglock]

Nice..
But.....
You might be using too much coating.
The "lube groove" should not have that much coating in it.
There should be slight bare lead in there.

BTW... what brand of thumbrest is that?
Would love to get one for my G35 in 357Sig.

[glockfan]

Nice..
But.....
You might be using too much coating.
The "lube groove" should not have that much coating in it.
There should be slight bare lead in there.

BTW... what brand of thumbrest is that?
Would love to get one for my G35 in 357Sig.

is this a problem? i mean,is the fact some product found its way into the lub grooves would make the round unstable or something ?

as for the frame weight thumbrest assembly, just let me know..i have one in aluminum with the 3d thumbrest i don't use because i prefer the heavier brass version. i could send it your way if ever you're interested. the cool part is that you don't need to drill the frame to put the thumbrest at work ; but you need to install the frame weight to use the thumbrest. let me know, i could get one in brass for you....if ever for some reasons you can't order from the dealer i got it.

[Ausglock]

It doesn't cause and issues. Just that it is wasting coating.
6mls to 2.5Kg of alloy works great for me with a 20mgs to 100 ml mix.

What colour is that? Gold 1035?? looks a bit light for Old Gold.