simple Hi-Tek coating

[dikman]

Joe, just for your info, Cactus Juice is used for stabilizing timber for making knife handles, pens etc. The wood is immersed in the liquid and put into a vacuum chamber, where it is pulled into the pores of the wood. Untreated wood, when used for knife handles, has an unfortunate tendency to shrink over time, which is not a good thing on an expensive custom made knife! This stuff, and similar concoctions, generally stops the wood from moving.

A home-made brew uses perspex dissolved in acetone and from your explanation I now know that this is pretty much the same thing.

[HI-TEK]

A home-made brew uses perspex dissolved in acetone and from your explanation I now know that this is pretty much the same thing.

Interesting. Thanks for your input.

I make somewhat similar material, a liquid gel Acrylic, (no Acetone used), that can be used to repair cracked Acrylic lenses on cars. It is used to repair lenses, that are no longer available and the brew simply is applied to cracked or broken area, where, then the original plastic "melts" into the gel structured brew, and with UV, or appropriate Catalyst, the whole lot fuses to form a solid plastic.
The colours can be matched to original lens colour so it looks like a new one without cracks.
I suppose that such a brew may be suitable for impregnation of Timbers or other porous materials, that would be then converted to Acrylic impregnated product after cure.

[Ausglock]

We use a permethrin preservative applied under Vacuum for our dry hardwoods, Or LOSP for interior timbers.
In 40 years of Working in the timber game, never heard of Cactus Juice.

[dikman]

I'm not surprised you may not have heard of it. It's American (), well-known to knifemakers (which is probably it's main market and who it was designed for) and as far as I know not available here in Oz.

Isn't permethrin the stuff they use in bug sprays??

[Ausglock]

yep. it sure is. It is a commercial wood preservative made by Arch Chemicals ( formally Koppers)

[Southern Son]

I got the Cactus juice from an Aussie vendor...

http://www.timberbits.com/cactus-juice

Hi-tek, I will give the boolits a blast with my Air Compressor and then a roll in an old towel.

Next time I will finish one task before starting another, that will confuse my wife and might prevent something like this happening again...

[Avenger442]

I thought that it might be good to show some of the guys starting out a too thick first coat.

The bullet on the left has way too much coating on it for first coat. Bullet on the right is just about right for the first coat. This happened when I failed to notice the, for lack of a better word, sludge that had built up in the bottom of my tumbling bowl. The bullets on the bottom picked it up and instead of washing it off I though I would use it as an example. Bullets were dried for about a half hour on top of a hot oven with fan blowing on them in 45% humidity controlled basement.

This is after first bake. As you can see the bullet on the left has a rough texture because of the bubbled coating. All of the bullets that picked up the additional coating did this.

This is after smash test. I fully expected the thick coating to fail smash test and come off when sized. (I put on gas checks and size after first coat) Neither happened. But if you look close there are some specks of coating that came of at smash. I have had a complete failure of the coating at sizing when I coated too thick in the past.

Coating was more forgiving than I expected in this case.

[dikman]

Avenger, good idea posting the comparison photos, might help clarify the idea of thin coats to newcomers.

SS, thanks for that. Quite some time ago a knifemaker, who I built a vacuum chamber for, was trying to find that stuff but we couldn't find it anywhere here. Next time I see him I'll let him know, if he's still interested. I think he found something else in the meantime. HI-TEK's stuff sounds like it's the same thing, possibly just a little thicker in consistency.

[rcslotcar]

Thanks Avenger. I have everything to start coating except the wire screen. I got a small convection cookie oven and all the chemicals ready. I have been reading here and looking at "you tube" video's. I've been casting and lubing for about two years and am ready to venture into Hi Tek now! I would like to thank everyone for all the info they have posted here.

[Avenger442]

This series of post started me coating with Hi Tek. I have read all of them but started back when it was about 1200 or 1500. I had been casting for about a year and was looking for a lubricant. Looked at just about everything the waxes/greases, alox, powder coating, copper plating. I even looked at paper patch after starting Hi Tek. I thought that this would be the one to start with and it has been the only one that I have used as a lube. Why? Well the end product for me is not necessarily the color or the texture or the beauty of the bullets. Not that you can't get that. I wasn't looking for a nostalgic solution to no lead in the barrel. Understand, I consider any of the above as being a way to keep lead out of the rifling. Some may have a particular advantage over another. Have several pounds of the bees wax and oil lubes on hand. I even have used a mixture of coconut oil and bees wax on the tail of my bullets in black powder cartridges to keep the hard fouling down. Those bullets were coated with Hi Tek. But the end product for me is, can I obtain performance comparable to or better than rounds I can buy with no lead fouling? Hi Tek has accomplished that for me as a lubricant in my bolt rifles, semi auto pistols and revolvers. I have found it fairly forgiving, in it's use, unlike some of the other detailed operations we do as hand loaders. Measuring loads within a tenth of a grain, keeping lead at same temp when casting, head space....... the list goes on and on. Instructions are simple.

I look at what I say about it and sometimes sound like a salesman for Hi Tek. I don't have any ties to it other than I use it. Some of the guys that do the other lubes sound just like me about that lube so they must work, too. If I had not found the Hi Tek I probably would have been powder coating or mixing waxes and oils. And, if I had accomplished the goal, singing their praises.

[HI-TEK]

Avenger I sent a PM

[popper]

sludge that had built up in the bottom of my tumbling bowl. Just looked into my mix bottle (green) Ugh. Crusty/flaky dried out coating all around the lid and on the bottom that doesn't dissolve. Got some small #5 (good for acetone) pill bottles I'm going to try - mix just what I need, toss any unused. Does mean I need to cast a bunch before coating,as Ausglock points out - larger batches are easier to work with. Storage of mixed and clean containers appear to be my problem with failure.

[HI-TEK]

sludge that had built up in the bottom of my tumbling bowl. Just looked into my mix bottle (green) Ugh. Crusty/flaky dried out coating all around the lid and on the bottom that doesn't dissolve. Got some small #5 (good for acetone) pill bottles I'm going to try - mix just what I need, toss any unused. Does mean I need to cast a bunch before coating,as Ausglock points out - larger batches are easier to work with. Storage of mixed and clean containers appear to be my problem with failure.

Popper, the deposit built up on your coating bowl can be recycled.
It does take time for it to dissolve, so if you add solvent (Acetone or MEK) into containers and put on it a lid, leave to soak, majority should dissolve. Agitation occasionally will also help to mix in dried residues.
The beauty of this coating is, that until you bake it, it is reasonably stable. The only thing that may happen is that final re-dissolved mix may become darker that original brew.

[Ausglock]

I have been saving the acetone/coating I reclaim from the mix bucket. I strain it through coffee filter paper to catch any bits of lead etc etc.
Then use this to make up new coating mix. Mainly for doing Black as darkening doesn't matter.

[HI-TEK]

Here are my first 2 attempts, using Zombie green, the powder version, convection toaster oven, weigh and measured my coating and acetone so I should be spot on there, but I think my technique is off, the 9MM seems to get a good coverage, but very dark almost brown color, the 45's were more green, but pretty rough finish. Here are a couple pics, am I shaking too long or too much liquid with the bullets ? both sets got 2 coats.

Thanks, Fred

the 9MM (and a 45 after smash test)



the 45's

Several matters here.
1. Using too much solvent is not a problem. It simply applies a thinner coat. This will dry quickly.
2. If you continue to shake coat for too long, irrespective of dilution, after solvent evaporates, you will have a rough finish . Rough finish indicates shaking too long. 6 mls of mixture to about 250 bullets is OK, more dilute or not, 6 mls should be OK. 10-15 seconds to coat, then dump and dry thoroughly. Test cook a few only first to see how they turn out. If OK cook the rest
3. If you look at colours, you have some more green and some brown. This is possibly
a. cooking at much higher temperatures that set, and
b. mixture was not mixed well before you applied it to bullets to coat.
c. combination of both
4. The 45's, is more green, as you may have more metal weight inside oven, so it takes longer to get up to temperature to cook.
If you get variation in colour on same tray, it is also telling me that you have poor heat circulation, and possibly no fan inside oven to get even heat into alloy.

[dansedgli]

I tried my first batches of hitek today. Black cherry.

They passed the smash and acetone rub test but I'm getting some patchy coverage in the lube grooves and where the driving band meets the front part of the bullet. I assume because they don't contact the bucket when shaking.

Is this a problem? If yes how do I just need more coats? Im only doing 2 coats at the moment.

They sized fine so ill load them up tomorrow. They are my first casts so I'm pretty excited.

If these shoot ok I'm pretty happy with the hitek process. I followed the instructions and it was easy. Ill try to do more volume next. 4.5lbs of 45 acp isn't very much. I think i can get another tray in my oven.

First coat.



Final product.

[Hi-Performance Bullet Coatings]

Looks good.
Patchy coverage in the lube groove and where the driving band meets the front part of the bullet is normal for that style bullet. Color looks like it may be off a little in the last pic maybe in the oven too long?
Real test is in the shooting.

[dansedgli]

Thankyou for the feed back. Do you have a photo of what it should look like? I had it in there for 10 minutes preheated at 200 c.

[6bg6ga]

Where did you get that color?

[Ausglock]

could be the light, but Black Cherry is darker than that. Tested the lastest batch for the US last week.
Worked fine. I then put a coat of black over it...