simple Hi-Tek coating

[Ausglock]

I think he stated that he has a bullet on the end of the Thermo-couple.

[HI-TEK]

I think he stated that he has a bullet on the end of the Thermo-couple.

I understand that.
It does not explain why his solvent wipe test fails.
As you know, coating will not cure, and can be removed with solvent, or the next coat, because it is under baked.
Even if he has a projectile on end of his temperature probe, this will not guarantee that the bulk load is at same temperature.
PID oven temperature control is a great start.
For a particular load, user must determine how long it will take that load to get to 180C. That is what I have tried to explain, may be inadequately.

[Tazza]

I'd start by doing smaller batches, same temperature and time, just fewer on the tray and see if they pass the wipe test. If they pass, you are just not getting the load to 180c+ for the required minimum of 2 minutes.

My oven does quite well, 12 minuets and i have 2 trays cooked and all pass wipe and smash tests.

I have had issues in the past when trying to cook too many at once, i'd apply the the second coat and you could see some were too light in colour, the second coat was washing the first non cured coat off.

[HI-TEK]

So just to be clear I am sure that the coated cast bullets are reaching temperature, the oven is controlled by a PID and the thermal couple has a bullet screwed on the end of it. Once the oven has returned to temperature I start the clock.

As for the Red Copper mixing, I will check to make sure that what am doing insures a good mix.

MOZZ
Just wanted to ask, how did you know that the load you placed into the oven reached correct temperature for correct cure?
If you are relying on probe with cast on the end as being the indicator, you may be misled by simple facts.
If you have a plain Lead non coated cast , on tip of temperature probe, it will heat up very quickly and get to oven set temperature..
However, if you have a Coated Cast at end of your temperature probe, at exactly at same time, a coated cast on the end of probe will be 20-25C lower, as heat cant get through coating as fast.
If you have the uncoated cast probe, sitting on top of your load in your oven, the probe will show temperatures more closely to oven/PID settings.
If you have a coated cast on the end of your probe, at same time exposure as non coated cast, the coated cast will be much cooler and provide lower temperature indications.
However, both the non coated cast, and the coated cast located on probe, will not correctly advise of the actual load temperature, which will be much cooler, and the reading you are getting from probes will not provide you actual load temperatures.
There is two reasons for this
1. Load has much higher mass weight to absorb heat and takes longer to heat up, as air cannot circulate as well around the load.
2. The coating significantly reduces heat transfer to the bulk load.
In summary, the probe will provide a temperature, but cannot supply you the actual load actual temperature.
You seem to be assuming, that what the probe is indicating, also reflects load temperature.
That is simply not the case. That is why you are getting solvent wipe off.

As Tazza indicated, with his reply, bake smaller batches where air inside your oven can circulate evenly around the load.
You really need an infra Red thermometer to diagnose product temperatures.
The PID control stops oven over heating, or have huge temperature swings, but for a particular load, you need to determine your ovens ability. how long it takes to get a specific load up to correct cure temperatures.

[Mozz]

Ah, that's clearer thank you. I was using a plain non coated bullet. I will get a infrared thermometer as advised.

Once again thank you for your help and support guys.

Mozz

[slide]

For those that are interested Jerry Miculek has posted a video about hi-tek. Don't know how to post a link. You will have to look it up.
It is on youtube. The title is Bullets,bullets, and more bullets!! Let's reload!

[RedlegEd]

For those that are interested Jerry Miculek has posted a video about hi-tek. Don't know how to post a link. You will have to look it up.
It is on youtube. The title is Bullets,bullets, and more bullets!! Let's reload!

Hi Slide,
Here you go!
Ed

[Mozz]

redleg.

Are you pre-warming your bullets? Have a look at my drying stand picture. You can see the fan heater that is used to pre-warm the trays next to go into the oven.
My oven has 2 huge wattage elements, so 7:30 is no problem.
The smaller convection benchtop ovens need around 10 to 12 minutes at 195Deg C.

Trevor are you pre-heating your bullets to ensure they are dried fully?

[kevin c]

Always fun to see Jerry shoot and hear what he has to say. More skill there than I'll ever have with any kind of firearm, with broader, deeper shooting knowledge and experience as well.

That said, I'd never put unprocessed scrap in my casting pot, and I wish he'd given more credit where it's due for HiTek.

[Michael J. Spangler]

Always fun to see Jerry shoot and hear what he has to say. More skill there than I'll ever have with any kind of firearm, with broader, deeper shooting knowledge and experience as well.

That said, I'd never put unprocessed scrap in my casting pot, and I wish he'd given more credit where it's due for HiTek.

I agree with him on getting deeper into reloading and casting to learn more about guns. I’ve always said that.

I think he gives hi-tek credit. Maybe not enough but I bet he doesn’t want to sound like an infomercial especially since his brother Donnie has been using it for decades (bayou bullets ex owner) and selling it (hi performance bullet coatings) that being said I think he is more in tune with the coating than most of us hobby users. As he is with most anything firearms. The man is a legend for sure. I wish I had 1/100th of his skill.

[Avenger442]

Casting and handloading have let me shoot much more than I would have with store bought. All that shooting took me to a greater understanding of both firearms and my abilities with them. Hi Tek is a part of that six years of learning.

I somewhat disagree with Jerry in that he seemed to say jacketed was more accurate than cast. Or maybe I just misunderstood him. Cast just relies on the caster for it's accuracy and not a company. Like anything else knowledge, practice, consistency, and patience will help make the casting you do more accurate. Mine are certainly more accurate than they were when I started. But I do not claim that they are as accurate as they can be.

[Ausglock]

Trevor are you pre-heating your bullets to ensure they are dried fully?

Yep. sure do... even in summer..

[Mozz]

Yep. sure do... even in summer..

What temp and for how long?

[Ausglock]

What temp and for how long?

for as long as the previous tray of bullets needs to bake. and temp is warm to the touch.
rest the palm of you hand on the bullets, they should be warm.

[Stephen Cohen]

Michael J and Avenger442, I agree with you both that Jerry is a shooter to aspire to. I think anyone watching this could be forgiven for thinking his brother manufactured the product, I also disagree with the assumption that jacketed are more accurate than Hi-Tek. Anyone who has shot at night under lights will agree that Hi-Tek cuts down the smoke and allows one to see the target and sights better. But I am biased towards Hi-Tek. Regards Stephen

[ioon44]

What temp and for how long?

In the summer I place my coated bullet trays on my dark red deck and in full sunshine and after about 15 min the bullets have reached 130 deg F to 150 deg F which is almost to hot to touch. I have never had any coating fail using this drying temperature no matter what the heat source I use.

[HI-TEK]

In the summer I place my coated bullet trays on my dark red deck and in full sunshine and after about 15 min the bullets have reached 130 deg F to 150 deg F which is almost to hot to touch. I have never had any coating fail using this drying temperature no matter what the heat source I use.

That is a great way to save power.
At 140F you certainly would have coating dry.
It would not take long to get it up to cure temperatures in oven.
Many casters have arranged a drying rack system with warm air blowing through several trays.
The get each tray to about 120F to 130F and bake afterwards.
This is reproduced winter and summer.
No failures or adhesion problems.

[kevin c]

Ioon44, how long is your bake and at what temp? I'd guess that the same time at lower temp or a shorter time at the same temp if you're prewarming to a higher temp than most.

[ioon44]

I have a drying cabinet to blow hot air through several trays with a 1500 watt fan heater that I use in winter and rainy days, I can reach 120 F to 130 F depending on the ambient temperature if it is over 50 F, to work colder than that I set them on the wood stove until they get too hot to touch (140 F).

A lot of ways to dry the coating depending on the resources each person has.

[ioon44]

Ioon44, how long is your bake and at what temp? I'd guess that the same time at lower temp or a shorter time at the same temp if you're prewarming to a higher temp than most.

I use a built in kitchen convection oven and my oven load is 3 trays with a total of 15 lb to 16 lb bullets and I bake for 13 min at 200 C to 208 C because the old thermostat has a big temperature swing, so I don't pay any attention to how warm the bullets are before placing them in the oven.

Am I over baking? Yes, but I think that is better than under baking. My colors are close to what they should be and my barrels are clean after a 300 round match.