HFPC Boolits..Piglet Method

[popper]

Extreme lube thread talks about too slippery lube causing accuracy loss. Did the hammer test on some 4x coated, didn't fare well. 2x coated and cooked for an hour to try to regain BHN, recoated 2x normal. WD passed, new coatings didn't. Chipped all the way to lead.

[Maximumbob54]

Has anyone tried the HF matte black for a first thin coat followed by a second coating of the gloss red? I'm trying it right now and the gloss red seems to really stick to the first layer and I think the gloss is easier to size.



As you can see they take on a bit of a satin finish and the red doesn't show much at all.

[TES]

So I tried the Alternate method with the Super Coat and it does not work with this coating....Sooo...here it is....

Do not tumble the bullets like the super coat.

Instead get a dripper bottle like a Goof Off can and put the mixture in the can.
Place your bullets standing ogive up on your screen and drip the coating onto the bullet.
(make sure that it is completely coated)
(Its a good idea to have a mason jar beneath the screen to catch the drippings so that you can reuse the overflow.)
Allow to air dry for a few seconds maybe 15 between coats.
then repeat dripping the PC on the bullets 2 more times.
Lastly bake one time for 15 minutes.
Done

(Also clean your dripper bottle / Nozzel after use as it will cause clogs if the PC dries inside)

If anyone thinks of a good name for it you own it.

TES

[Maximumbob54]

Sounds like TEScoating to me.

Do you not get a build up of coating on the base from dripping that makes it stick during baking? I know if I put on too much from tumbling it then they stick like glue.

[Rangefinder]

I suppose this is a multi-purpose post. I've already done accuracy tests, and will post some results one of these days. This one is a velocity/HP expansion test.

Boolit--Lee 401-175 from a 6-cav that I did a HP job on that drops 165gr. with 50/50+2% alloy. The idea was to load 'em hot, press one HP cavity with a plastic insert (ski plug I use for 30 cal ballistic tip swagging), and see what kind of expansion differences take place. Prior experience firing J-word HP's through layers of tee-shirt, denim, etc showed HP's that were clogged up with clothing and didn't expand well once they hit the wet-packs. Well... Here's what a good CAST boolit does...

165gr. HP's (one with insert, one empty), both moving a touch over 1150fps.


The test target: 2 layers denim (old jeans), 20 layers manila folder and printer paper sopping wet (to simulate surface tissue and skin), 1/2 inch white oak plank for hard sternum or ribs, and then water jugs.


Left is empty cavity, right is with insert. BOTH penetrated roughly 14", both expanded well, both left debris scattered all through the first jug from the oak plank, both left a portion of nose in the second jug, both stopped at the back edge of the third jug. Short version--very little difference--both performed extremely well.

[TES]

Sounds like TEScoating to me.

Do you not get a build up of coating on the base from dripping that makes it stick during baking? I know if I put on too much from tumbling it then they stick like glue.

Yes, but with not having to bake 3 times its worth having to break the bullet free. Once you get the build up on the screen of the PC they "break" more easily. The backs are still coated and once sized and loaded you can't see the build on the base.

[Maximumbob54]

Yes, but with not having to bake 3 times its worth having to break the bullet free. Once you get the build up on the screen of the PC they "break" more easily. The backs are still coated and once sized and loaded you can't see the build on the base.

So the mesh starts to get "seasoned" with PC I guess. I know the HF gloss red breaks down into a runny snot looking glop so I don't see being able to do this with that one but the matt black seems to break down different I guess not having whatever additive for the gloss finish. How much powder do you add to how much thinner to get the right mix?

If you have already posted this info can you tell me the name of the thread or better yet post a link?

[TES]

So the mesh starts to get "seasoned" with PC I guess. I know the HF gloss red breaks down into a runny snot looking glop so I don't see being able to do this with that one but the matt black seems to break down different I guess not having whatever additive for the gloss finish. How much powder do you add to how much thinner to get the right mix?

If you have already posted this info can you tell me the name of the thread or better yet post a link?

5 level scoops of powder to 5 scoops of acetone.

You really have to mix it well before adding it to the bullets. Shake it until there is no powder visible when holding it up to a light.

One other thing I tried was to use paper towels after each coating to remove as much excess liquid from the bottoms by touching the bottom of the screen. It will wick away excess coating but really is kind of pointless.

[wrinkles]

Didn't read through all 19 pages so forgive me if this has been posted. I was doing some powder coat bullets using the piglet method and accidently ran into this. Here's the setup. 1 part HF powder coat to 4 parts mineral spirits. Tumble bullet to coat then stick in oven at 400 for 15 min. I then covered the bottom of the tumble can with the PC MS mixture and dropped the hot bullets straight from the oven into the can and tumbled. The mineral spirits smoked and instantly evaporated. The bullets got covered with the PC in a nice heavy coat that dried instantly into a paint like coat. I then baked again. Bullets are almost 100 percent covered in a thick coat. I'll post pics when I get home. Only issue is that the coat sticks to the mesh in the oven and comes off the bullets when removing them. I'll have to look into a way of getting them to not stick to the mesh.

[Maximumbob54]

Waaaay too thick. Thin coats. Do two thin coats and they will not only look better but shoot better.

[coffeeguy]

Had some good success with TES's version. See picture below...Bullets shot fine with normal accuracy, no leading, and no more smoke than the J-word bullets.


The flourescent green was a jighead paint from Bass Pro Shop...Spike-It brand, though I think they sell Pro-Tec brand now.
The red was from a sample given to me by a local powdercoating shop. Two coats, one bake for each.

Two thin coats of each, ratio was about 2 parts acetone to 1 part powder. Haven't tried lacquer thinner yet. Like TES said, you have to shake the heck out of it...I used a small 20 ml glass vial with a screw-on cap, part of the idea is that the mix should fill up at least a third of the container so you can get some good agitation. For coating, I used a glass medicine dropper; I'd imagine a small artist's paint brush would work but seems like overkill.

One funny side note...after this, I went back to the powdercoat shop and asked the owner/manager if I could buy some samples in different colors, and showed him those bullets. He said that it was a great idea, but there was no way that I could do that with his product, etcetera...as he was holding them in his hand. Okay, if he didn't want my money, then...

Anyway, here's what I've found, to supplement TES's list:

1. It's easy to do a smooth coat, but making 'pretty' bullets will take more time. If you just want 'functional' and appearance isn't that big a deal, either use the Piglet method or one of the others discussed here.

2. Clear PC works too, but not always easy to get an idea of coverage til after you're done baking. The fluorescent green one shows thin spots in the color, but the polyester coating is there and that's what's important.

3. The shop I ended up buying from had 11 different formulations of powder. I think that using something with TGIC polyester base works well, but the bottom line is, start with a small batch and experiment til you find what works for you. Acetone, lacquer thinner, toluene, whatever, and find the mix ratio that works best.

3.5 Bullets with flat areas and more edges, i.e. truncated-cone or the semi-wadcutter one in the picture, took more time to coat than round-nose bullets where everything tended to just run down the sides more or less uniformly.

4. I wait for the projectiles to dry after coating, then can gently reposition them on the screen, so they don't stick quite as much after baking.

5. Last, do what suits you best. Commercial products out there work well or they wouldn't have survived on the market. Home-brew methods can work well too, as proven by the results posted on this thread and others.

Thanks to all for their work on this and for sharing their information!

[mjwcaster]

Maybe a silly questions but has anyone tried powder coating cases?
I am a firearms instructor and need to get a bunch more dummy rounds, but I hate paying more for dummy rounds than live ammo (~$1.00 ea).
I have made my own dummy rounds, no powder/primer and drilled holes in the side of the cases, but would love for the whole thing to be bright orange or better yet green.

Finding this thread again made me start thinking about powder coating the whole dummy round a nice bright color, so when you check the action or magazine it is obvious that the round is not live.

Also what color would contrast best for those who are color blind?

I had been very interested in powder coating boolits before, but now I have a great reason to get into it, if it will work and the round will still chamber.

Thanks,

Matt

[Beagle333]

I haven't tried it, but PC does add a little to the size. I bet you could just resize the case after coating, just like resizing a coated boolit and they would chamber fine. Sounds like a great idea though! I may have to try it for dummy rounds.

[popper]

I've powder coated many as part of a spraying jig I tried. Sticks well but I don't now about the sizing - you can't size the case head. They may not chamber. I'd try the colored VHT paint, it may give a thin enough coat to chamber. Red-green is the most common color blindness but they see a 'color', might not be the same we see.

[coffeeguy]

There also used to be a thread somewhere about coloring the cartridge cases. You can use a permanent marker and it'll last a little while before it wears off; otherwise can do a chemical dip which will, for example, give a dark brown or black color to the case...Iodine comes to mind, as will dissolving some black powder or pyrodex in water and using that. I know it's not a bright color, but should be obviously different from most cartridge cases other than, say, Wolf or Brown Bear or other imported steel cases.

[Skip62]

buddy of mine used cera-coat, it goes on very very thin

Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk

[sparky45]

This is a simple question.
Do any of the people using this process have a Star?

If yes, second question.
Why are you doing this?

I am a big believer is KISS. Cost is less of a concern than productivity or improved performance. Thanks for any insight you can share. I am trying to understand.

Don Verna

I know this is a response to a "old" reply in this thread, but, I do have a Star and I use it to size the PC'd bullets and it works very well.

[coffeeguy]

I know this is a response to a "old" reply in this thread, but, I do have a Star and I use it to size the PC'd bullets and it works very well.

I think that what he was getting at was why powdercoat bullets instead of using traditional lube? In other words, especially with a Star, why do several steps (powdercoat, bake, size) where lubing/sizing in one fell swoop will do?

For me, the answer is cleanliness and a lot less smoke. The powdercoated/TES-coated bullets don't leave any sticky/dirty residue during the handling and loading process, and when they're fired, there's MUCH less smoke and I don't have to concern myself as much with the powder I'm using, as some lubes generate more smoke with certain powders/loads than others.

More steps? Yes. More time-consuming? Yes. But the end result is more pleasing to me.

[igolfat8]

I want to know if there is an abrasion factor to these boolits....that I do not know.

You could use a Falex film strength testing machine to measure wear scar.

[bangerjim]

OMG.........this old method post STILL exists! Everybody uses BBDT these days.

Just take my word (and many MANY hundreds of others on here) there is not any barrel wear using BBDT PC!!!!!!!! And there is no proof that matte colors with ESPC cause any wear either.

FMJ's have more wear than PC.

banger