45 acp

[Todd S]

I am currently casting for my XDM .45. I am using two different Lee molds. I am shooting the 200 SWC and the 230 TC. The TC is giving me better groups, so far. I am sizing using a .452 lyman sizing die, lubed with Carnauba Red. I am having a problem with a few of the rounds not chambering correctly every shooting session. It seems that lube is getting inside the chamber and keeping some of the following rounds from chambering. If I drop the round in the chamber by itself and release the slide, it will fire and eject normally. I have this problem even after wiping the noses of the all the boolits to make sure there is no lube outside of the case. I am using a Lee FCD. BTW this load is showing absolutely zero leading, so I think I have the boolit sized and lubed correctly. The SWC had a few chambering issues but I dropped the seating depth a little more and the feeding issues disappeared. The 230 TC cannot be seated any deeper without crimping on the cone part of the boolit. Has anyone run into this before?

Thanks,
Todd

[EMC45]

I used to load the SWC for my brother's XD. Never could get them to run right. It was a pump action pistol. The TC on the other hand will run all day. I load the TC with about 30 thou showing above the case mouth. Crimp just enough to remove the bell.

[Char-Gar]

Another satisfied used of the Lee FCD on pistol rounds with problems. I think I am seeing a trend here.

[Todd S]

So, should i just crimp with the seating die?

[Char-Gar]

So, should i just crimp with the seating die?

No, you should buy a taper crimp die of good make like RCBS or Redding. You should also wipe the bases of your bullets free from lubricant if you are not doing so already.

I am starting to sound like a broken record, but I have loaded 1/4 million of cast bullet rounds in the 45 ACP for use in 1911 pistols and have never had the problem you have. It is very straightforward process with very few issues. We have been loading this round for 100 years now, and it holds no secrets. Folks keep trying to reinvent the wheel and find new and better ways to do it and they wonder why they have problems.

[Todd S]

Thanks, I'll look for the crimp dies. I am using a styrofoam cushion in the sizing die. I do not get any lube on the base of the boolit. Is this the die you would recommend? http://www.midwayusa.com/product/709...cp-45-auto-rim

[Smoke4320]

yes.. that will work fine

[PS Paul]

Welcome to the forum, Todd. Looks like you might get some good info from some fellas here....... Second the opinion on a taper-crimp die as opposed to the FCD. I have the taper crimp in .45 ACP from Lee and it works just fine. Certainly the RCBS and Redding taper-crimp dies are great products and will work for you as well. I've done both crimp/seat in one operation AND crimp then seat in two different operations. Latter tends to work best, but I still do both, depending upon the boolit I am using.

I have a feeling your problems will disappear when you taper crimp, but I would do any changes in steps, through a process of elimination, and check for the desired results.

Good luck!
PSP

[Char-Gar]

Todd...that is a good die, a very good die. It probably has instructions, but let me tell you how to adjust it the no sweat way. The purpose if to produce a case mouth that measures .470. There is no need to measure if you do the following.

1. Take a military or commercial 45 ACP round and with it in the shell holder, run the round up in the press as far as it will go. i.e. the top of the stroke.

2. Now screw the die in on the round as far as it will go. Get is as tight as you can using your hand only, no tools.

3. Now set the lock ring on the die and you are done.

This will produce a loaded round that is the same as a factory round, which is .470 on the case mouth. Very simple process.

I assume you know how to use the barrel of your pistol as a bullet seating depth gage. If not let us know and somebody will give you a hand.

[Larry Gibson]

If I use .452 sized bullets in my match chambered P14 it will fail to close into battery 2- 3 times per mag. This occurs with ammo loaded on the dillon SDB (has it's own propriety dies) or with Lee dies on a 550B or with Lyman dies on a single stage press. I use a Redding taper crimp die on the 550B and single stage and the SDB also taper crimps. Using the Lee 45 ACP FCD solves the problem as does sizing the bullets .451. I put the FCD in station 4 of the 550B or use it on all ammo loaded on the SDB in the single stage press.

The ammunition run through the Lee FCD is just as accurate and produces no leading in my P14, Colt Combat Commander, M1911 Series 70, Contender barrel or the M98 converted to 45 ACP. A few complain about the Lee FCD but it works for me and solved the problem.

Larry Gibson

[Todd S]

That's the funny part. I use the barrel of my gun as a depth guage. They ALL drop in and out easily and they seem to be the same depth as factory rounds. It only happens after I fire a few rounds. This also only seems to happen with the 230 TC boolits. The SWC's feed with no problems. They just do not group as well for me. I'm going to order the crimp die because I also have a sizing die for .357 sitting in my cart waiting for my next purchase. I'll update next week after I get it and can run a few through the gun.

[ncbearman]

Todd...that is a good die, a very good die. It probably has instructions, but let me tell you how to adjust it the no sweat way. The purpose if to produce a case mouth that measures .470. There is no need to measure if you do the following.

1. Take a military or commercial 45 ACP round and with it in the shell holder, run the round up in the press as far as it will go. i.e. the top of the stroke.

2. Now screw the die in on the round as far as it will go. Get is as tight as you can using your hand only, no tools.

3. Now set the lock ring on the die and you are done.

This will produce a loaded round that is the same as a factory round, which is .470 on the case mouth. Very simple process.

I assume you know how to use the barrel of your pistol as a bullet seating depth gage. If not let us know and somebody will give you a hand.

CharGar,

Can this result be accomplished by using the RCBS crimp/seat die and be done in one stage/stroke? I set mine up exactly the way you described. I too have been shooting 45acp for 40 years and have never had a separate crimp die. Not trying to re-invent the wheel here just wondering?

[MtGun44]

Inadequate TC can cause this, or a lead ring building up ahead of the case
mouth if you are seating and crimping at the same operation. You should
TC as a separate operation to about .471 or so.

Look for rifling marks on the boolit, too. You may need so seat a touch deeper.

Bill

[Char-Gar]

CharGar,

Can this result be accomplished by using the RCBS crimp/seat die and be done in one stage/stroke? I set mine up exactly the way you described. I too have been shooting 45acp for 40 years and have never had a separate crimp die. Not trying to re-invent the wheel here just wondering?

Well, if it works for you, it works for you and after 40 years there is no reason to change.

My RCBS 45 ACP dies are from 1980 and do a roll crimp. A roll crimp can be used, but is harder to adjust. The idea is to get a uniform .470 case mouth and I suppose there are multiple ways to get there.

The big difference between a roll crimp and taper crimp is a roll crimp can leave a little bulge in the case where it is turned over abruptly. A taper crimp won't do this.

The issue of seating and crimping in the same operation is just what Bill said above. When crimping onto the smooth side of a bullet the last little shove as the crimp is applied can push a small ring of alloy onto the case mouth. This isn't a problem with a bullet that has a crimp groove. Even then I seat and crimp in separate operations..just because.

I am "old school" to the max and do not use a progressive loader and bulk loading is not something I want to do. Therefore I am not looking for short cuts, but the best ammo possible. I am willing to go through extra steps and take my time to do so. I enjoy the process of reloading, so this isn't a problem with me.

[historicfirearms]

Inadequate TC can cause this, or a lead ring building up ahead of the case
mouth if you are seating and crimping at the same operation. You should
TC as a separate operation to about .471 or so.

Look for rifling marks on the boolit, too. You may need so seat a touch deeper.

Bill

What Bill said.

The 230 truncated cone Lee is my favorite 45acp boolit. One other thing to look at is to make sure you are expanding the case mouth enough so that it doesn't cause lead shaving or lube "shaving". That can also build up in your chamber and cause problems.

Before I knew better, I used the FCD on 45acp and never experienced problems. With 9mm, it sized down my boolits too much and caused leading. If you don't want to buy a seperate taper crimp die you can remove the carbide sizer on the FCD and just use it to crimp.

[David2011]

Todd,

There's already lots of good advice here. I've run into the same issue with truncated cones in .40 and .45 when checking them with a case gage. Every match round I load goes through a case gage before going into the ammo box. If the boolits are seated too far out the full diameter front edge will hang up on the case gage which has no leade- just a square shoulder that catches the OD of the boolit. Now, "too far out" is a variable and debatable term in this case. Too far out for the case gage will still chamber easily due to the rifling leade giving the shoulder of the boolit a little space. A taper crimp die is a must IMO. I have gotten by with a roll crimp before I learned about taper crimp dies but it's not as reliable as a taper crimp because it's so dependent on all cases being exactly the same length. Sizing boolits smaller "fixed" the problem at the cost of the boolits being undersized.

Most of my chambering problems have been traced back to carbon buildup in the chamber, mostly from shooting very light loads. A good carbon solvent will clean it out pretty easily. Shaved lead, as mentioned previously, can also build up in the front of the chamber and cause the same symptoms.

Charcoal lighter fluid makes a very good and inexpensive boolit lube solvent to clean up sized boolits and loaded rounds- just use appropriate precautions for such a flammable product.

David

[Char-Gar]

Perhaps, one of the reasons I don't have the problems that some do with 1911 and other firearms is I clean them after they have been fired without fail. I do not allow powder, lead or bullet lube to build up.

I tend to forget that the younger set of shooters don't clean their guns as often as we once did. This is evidenced by the "Quest for a clean burning powder", that I read about so often on boards such as thing. I need to remember to mention how important keeping your weapon can be in eliminating many issues that folks seem to have. It just never occurs to me that a dirty gun might be the problem as I never have dirty guns.

I have been mixing and using Ed's Red for some years now and it get the job done every time.

[gray wolf]

Just as a side note, if your pistol is a 1911 with internal extractor DO NOT drop a round in the chamber and close the slide. Bad Ju Ju for the extractor claw, it was not meant to jump over the case head--you will ruin it in a short time. Also while I'm at it, don't drop the slide on an empty chamber--that will screw up your sear hammer hook relationship and could ruin a nice trigger job.

[mdi]

No, you should buy a taper crimp die of good make like RCBS or Redding. You should also wipe the bases of your bullets free from lubricant if you are not doing so already.

I am starting to sound like a broken record, but I have loaded 1/4 million of cast bullet rounds in the 45 ACP for use in 1911 pistols and have never had the problem you have. It is very straightforward process with very few issues. We have been loading this round for 100 years now, and it holds no secrets. Folks keep trying to reinvent the wheel and find new and better ways to do it and they wonder why they have problems.

Exactly! I haven't said it quite so clearly, but I agree. I've had more problems when I tried an FCD than I ever had reloading "normally"! I bought one out of curiosity and it now resides in a landfill somewhere in Southern Oregon...

[MtGun44]

"FCD resides in a landfill. . ." LOL! Good move.

Same as Char-Gar - easily 1/4 million .45 ACP in 30+ yrs of IPSC and the functional failures is microscopic. Different
boolits, different dies, etc add unknowns. Early XDs have issues with SWCs but later are fixed. IME load an H&G 68 at .452
to 1.250 to 1.260 LOA, taper crimp as a separate operation to .471 or .470, and add enough fast powder to get the
cases out of the gun reliably and you are done with function in 99% of the guns. Individual gun anamolies will no
doubt occur. Now for accy, there are different needs but not in the TC or diam.

Bill