Hunting deer size game with 243 boolits?

[odicoilius]

The .243 is a great deer gun even on our big northern Whitetails, but only if shots are through the heart/lung and used with jacketed bullets.(And inside 250 yards or so)The typical velocity of a cast .243 (with any accuracy) in my opinion, and in several rifles I tried them in, is about 1600 to 1800 f/s. This puts on a par with the 25/20 hardly a deer gun. Yes I know the"Jordan buck" was shot with a 25/20 , but he reportedly used every round in the mag. Why cause an animal undue suffering, just because it can be done? Odicoilius

[MT Chambers]

If you tell me that the 243 and cast bullets is all you have, I say get close and go for it, if you have a 308 or 30/06, I think you're trying to stir the pot.

[vmathias]

If you tell me that the 243 and cast bullets is all you have, I say get close and go for it, if you have a 308 or 30/06, I think you're trying to stir the pot.

It was a hypothetical question and yes at the time the 243 is all i own. Didnt plan on using cast when I have jacketed for the job. Was making conversation. Inexperienced with cast hence my question.

[Smoke4320]

At least you asked before trying it.. people here have a lot of experience using cast boolits and its good to take their advice

[vmathias]

At least you asked before trying it.. people here have a lot of experience using cast boolits and its good to take their advice

Yes, I am totally new and inexperienced when it comes to cast. Will be asking a ton more questions to be sure.

[jhalcott]

It was a hypothetical question and yes at the time the 243 is all i own. Didnt plan on using cast when I have jacketed for the job. Was making conversation. Inexperienced with cast hence my question.

I have seen many deer escape(though injured)with.30 and above calibers in the hands of poor shooters. Also seen many deer killed with so called marginal caliber/bullets by good to excellent shooters! Some of the deer killed were with cartridges that were/are ILLEGAL in some states.

[vmathias]

I have seen many deer escape(though injured)with.30 and above calibers in the hands of poor shooters. Also seen many deer killed with so called marginal caliber/bullets by good to excellent shooters! Some of the deer killed were with cartridges that were/are ILLEGAL in some states.

Well I am no sharpshooter but I can hold my own pretty well. I also am not a big fan of shots over 100 yards. I am purchasing a 45-70 that will be my sole cast round for deer and bear. I want to make sure the job gets done and then some.

[jhalcott]

http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/pa...flon-tape.html
Try some Teflon patched bullets for this Deer hunting! It adds velocity, flatter trajectory and higher impact energy. It CAN be a bit tedious to get the 2 wraps around the tiny bullet though! I tried it with 25 06 thru 45-70 rounds and got some good to excellent results. A few bad results that were mostly my arthritis and carpal tunnel not letting me wrap correctly. I found I could increase powder charges quite a bit without getting any leading. This translates to very high velocities with the same bullets. Gas checks and lube MAY not be needed when Teflon is used. I still checked the bullets I used for deer hunting, but not the varmint rounds. I am STILL trying Teflon on .22 caliber bullets cast of Linotype (18 bhn, not new 20-22 bhn) with varying results ,most good. It seems the Lube can effect accuracy quite a bit. Velocity has exceeded 2700 fps at last attempt(with out leading!!).

[MT Gianni]

Teflon is a hazardous materiel when it is heated and enters the body through ingestion. I believe that the friction or the rifling causes enough heat to be a problem unless you always shoot downwind in a 20 mph breeze.

[leftiye]

No data, but unless concentrated I'm not too concerned with the smoke. However, the teflon doesn't always leave the boolit as it needs to after being fired, and I'd go all the way and paper patch.

[leftiye]

Well I am no sharpshooter but I can hold my own pretty well. I also am not a big fan of shots over 100 yards. I am purchasing a 45-70 that will be my sole cast round for deer and bear. I want to make sure the job gets done and then some.

Though many folks do seem to get good results with cast 30 cal boolits (and they do get to be destructive at higher (2500) velocities, the larger calibers (35 and up) do seem to kick butt mo bettah. And some will do it at 200 yds.

[vmathias]

http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/pa...flon-tape.html
Try some Teflon patched bullets for this Deer hunting! It adds velocity, flatter trajectory and higher impact energy. It CAN be a bit tedious to get the 2 wraps around the tiny bullet though! I tried it with 25 06 thru 45-70 rounds and got some good to excellent results. A few bad results that were mostly my arthritis and carpal tunnel not letting me wrap correctly. I found I could increase powder charges quite a bit without getting any leading. This translates to very high velocities with the same bullets. Gas checks and lube MAY not be needed when Teflon is used. I still checked the bullets I used for deer hunting, but not the varmint rounds. I am STILL trying Teflon on .22 caliber bullets cast of Linotype (18 bhn, not new 20-22 bhn) with varying results ,most good. It seems the Lube can effect accuracy quite a bit. Velocity has exceeded 2700 fps at last attempt(with out leading!!).

Dumb question but What are the benefits of paper patching?

[jhalcott]

In a nutshell, you CAN get better performance from a paper patched bullet. It prevents the lead bullet from touching the bore. It is usually done to an undersize bullet to bring the bullet up to bore size. It can also be used to take a smaller JACKETED bullet up to the dia needed. Going up one caliber(.284 to .308) can be done with thicker paper. Paper comes in weights from about 9# to 24#, the heavier paper is thicker. The bullets to be patched are cast some what smaller in diameter,IE .300 as cast + 2 wraps of paper=.308.
Teflon is so much thinner than paper, you CAN use it with the normal molds.

[nanuk]

Dumb question but What are the benefits of paper patching?

Read THIS!

[kens]

Personally, I think the majic number for a deer cartridge is 150gr @ 2500fps. Don't matter much how you arrive there as far as caliber & gun. A .257, 6mm, 7mm, any of those would be a heavy bullet for their respective caliber, and at 2500 speed they wouldn't be a heavy recoil deal.
Or, you could have a .30 cal, .32, 8mm, .35 and those would be somewhat light for their caliber, but at 2500 speed they would be light recoil and easy to shoot, and buck the brush well.

[Rattus58]

Well I am no sharpshooter but I can hold my own pretty well. I also am not a big fan of shots over 100 yards. I am purchasing a 45-70 that will be my sole cast round for deer and bear. I want to make sure the job gets done and then some.

i shoot a number of .451/.452 muzzleloaders that I shoot 45-70 bullets in the 405 grain (440 pure) up to 520. One thing I can say about 45-70 bullets of almost any persuasion over 400 grains is that penetration from these bullets is absolutely astonishing. I've not shot wheel weight or tinned bullets yet, and the only thing I'd expect different from my perspective is that you may not get quite the expansion I do with pure... but heartlung shots leave those I've shot maybe not to the extent of my 58's, but awash in blood and organ pieces... and NEVER YET a bullet retained.

I took a box of dirt out and placed it about 50 yards away and was planning on taking several shots into it and recover the bullets to see what expansion would look like. The first shot hit dead in the middle and blew the box open. The pressure that must accompany a large bullet like the 457121, the White Super Slugs and the Like, 457405, 457450 and the 510's are are in my opinion prime medicine for any game.

[9.3X62AL]

Dumb question but What are the benefits of paper patching?

V. Mathias--we have a long tradition here at Cast Boolits of regarding NO question as a "dumb" question. Don't confuse expressed passionate opinions with disregard for the needs of a new shooter or caster. Some folks here just feel strongly about some subjects, and more often than not some of their heat can shed some unique light on a matter.

Your expressed choice of a 45-70 for larger critters is a sound one. Another reality-based observation you made is that most of your shots will occur within 100 yards on these quarry species. That has been my experience in 45 years of hatrack-chasing......longest-ever shot was 125 yards, and next-longest was half that distance.

[kens]

.45 rifle is no doubt big medicine. However, it really doesn't take a big medicine to bring down a whitetail. they are thin skinned actually. I do agree that a exit wound is the key, I never lost a deer that had a exit wound.

[vmathias]

V. Mathias--we have a long tradition here at Cast Boolits of regarding NO question as a "dumb" question. Don't confuse expressed passionate opinions with disregard for the needs of a new shooter or caster. Some folks here just feel strongly about some subjects, and more often than not some of their heat can shed some unique light on a matter.

Your expressed choice of a 45-70 for larger critters is a sound one. Another reality-based observation you made is that most of your shots will occur within 100 yards on these quarry species. That has been my experience in 45 years of hatrack-chasing......longest-ever shot was 125 yards, and next-longest was half that distance.

Thanks...

[MT Gianni]

Personally, I think the majic number for a deer cartridge is 150gr @ 2500fps. Don't matter much how you arrive there as far as caliber & gun. A .257, 6mm, 7mm, any of those would be a heavy bullet for their respective caliber, and at 2500 speed they wouldn't be a heavy recoil deal.
Or, you could have a .30 cal, .32, 8mm, .35 and those would be somewhat light for their caliber, but at 2500 speed they would be light recoil and easy to shoot, and buck the brush well.

While it is well thought out it excludes the 30-30 and it well deserved reputation. I am fine with 100 gr J-words @ a striking velocity of 2400 or 160gr+ .308+ boolits at a striking velocity of 1500 fps.