Has Anyone Made A Gas Check (Cap) Punch ?

[Chicken Thief]

You load a list of wich gears you have and it calculates wich ones to use and how to place them

Here is a screendump of the intire user interface with a 14TPI calc.

[DoctorBill]

Cut the End Button for the Punch Ram that sets in the Reloading Press.



Was a lot of work with many pointed cutting bits as I am afraid to use
a cut-off bit. Had them grab. They made an awful Screeching....
I even saw my machinist friend have a cut off bit grab the work....he said
he doesn't like working with them either.

Now to either cut the slots in the Punch Body with my Harbor-Freight Band Saw
or thread the Die Body - hmmmm.

C.T. - I downloaded that program and a couple of other, too. Thank you !
I may just make a printout notebook with all the gears for each TPI - good idea !

Later - C.T. Can you explain what these things are !?

What are E, F, G, and H ? Where can I find B ?
Mine is an ENCO 9" x 20" Chinese Lathe. What's an EMCO ?

Whoever wrote this has to be a Genius !

DoctorBill

PS - 4-13-13 The program is for Lathes w/o a Transmission ! BEWARE.

[Chicken Thief]

B: Is the advansement of the sleigh for one full revolition of the lead screw. How far will the tip of the steel travel for one rev.
E: I just set to zero
F: Gears are cut to a modul size. That way a small and a big gear can run together without grinding/wear. See this http://www.tech.plymouth.ac.uk/sme/d...ars/nomen1.htm
G: The distance from center to center from your lead axle to your main axle. The combination of gears cant be smaller than that or else it wont engage the main axle because it is to short.
H: The max distance between the Lead screw axle and the top adjustable axle.

ENCO is a chinese copy of the Swiss made EMCO lathes.

Pic showing B lead screw (look in the manual for that value. Or measure one rev. it is a "standard" measure so dont worry)


Pic showing G


Pic showing H


Pic showing how i set up mine

[DoctorBill]

Here is what I have....







As I read it, my leads screw is 1.5 TPI.

Mine ALSO has NINE Transmission Settings in the Front !

DoctorBill

[Chicken Thief]

And so do i!

[DoctorBill]

Chicken Thief - If you have the same Lathe as mine, where did all those other
change gears come from ?

Mine.......28..30..36..40..42..45..60..80..etc

Yours (Post 43)

....20..24..30..33...35...40..45...50...52...60...66...80...etc

I don't understand - BIG difference in the change gears in the chart you show in Post #43.

Is that your hand in the photos (with all that swarf underneath the Gear Side of the Lathe).

Do you have more than one Lathe ?

(Confused ) DoctorBill

[Cane_man]

chicken and DB, thanks for the help on figuring out the threads... once i understood how the gear threading chart corresponded to the gears i finally got it! you have to change out the gears per the chart to achieve the threading you are looking for, doh!

[DoctorBill]

I put a piece of paper over my oily, dirty ENCO 9" x 20" Lathe Leadscrew and rolled
a metal cylinder over it to make an imprint of the threads - then measured the TPI
with my calipers. The calipers flip back and forth between 0.999 and 1.000, BTW.



Is it just me, or do YOU count 'over' 16 threads per inch. The Leadscrew IS 14.95 mm in diameter.

Why would they mix Metric (Diameter) with English (TPI) ? "T15 x 1.5 TPI" Is that "Normal" ?

The specs say 1.5 TPI......maybe they should write 15 TPI, more or less.....do I need new glasses ?

What are accepted deviations (+/-) on Machine Parts ?

1mm out of 15mm is 6.7% error !



If anyone is interested, I measured the travel of the Carriage for Ten Turns of the Leadscrew.



That comes out to 0.465mm (0.0183 inch) per one revolution of the ENCO 9x20 Leadscrew.

Could some of you Machinery Edumacated guys tell me what "Size" this Metric Leadscrew is ?
What is the designation ? Is it non-standard or standard size ?

I am guessing the "Pitch" is 0.465mm, but relating the designation of the screw to pitch
and mm/turn has me dumbfounded....Duh....?

DoctorBill

[Chicken Thief]

Yeah it should read 15 TPI.

Your lathe and mine are two way different beasts!
Mine is @ 7"x10" and weighs no more than @90lbs.
http://www.optimum-machines.com/prod...rio/index.html

[DoctorBill]

I am, right now, very confused as to what we have been talking about as regards the Change Gears
Program that Chicken Thief gave us. C.T - Your Lathe does not have a "Transmission" ?

I have been measuring my ENCO 9x20 parameters to use in that program to give change wheels.

Does that program have provisions for the Lathe's Transmission ?

I have all the change wheel gears shown in my post, but also nine transmission gear positions.

My manual shows Gears AND Transmission Selection for Threading Dimensions.

I don't understand.

Which is more difficult to understand THIS Chart - - - - or - - - - -Egyptian Hieroglyphs ?



DoctorBill

BTW - It took me a while to figure this out ! I AM SLOW.....

To place the Change Gears on my ENCO, I now do the following and have 'less problems'.
The paper is essentially two thicknesses of computer paper - sets the gear to gear clearance.
Strange thing - THAT big 127 tooth gear is not perfectly round !


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


Now I can do 8 thru 14 TPI w/o changing the Gears - just the transmission lever.

[Rick459]

DB...here's the check maker that i made using Ed Smith's diagrams. i mounted mine on a 1 ton arbor press. works great. good luck with your project. oh the discoloration that you see in the metal is from heat treating the check maker using oil.
Rick

[oldred]

this is what i did:

for the plain base check the disc OD = boolit OD + (2 x material thickness) + [3/4 x (2 x boolit base band height)]

hope that makes sense!

You will want to use thin soda/beer can material of about 0.004" thick for checking PB boolits.

The finished check should have a slight flare (very slight) and be just large enough to slide onto the boolit then swage in in a sizer. The disk size for .45 cal. PD should be 0.537" according to my reference. That is the punched disk before forming.

Thanks guys that's exactly what I wanted to know, now to get off my duff and get this done!

[FrankG]

DB...here's the check maker that i made using Ed Smith's diagrams. i mounted mine on a 1 ton arbor press. works great. good luck with your project. oh the discoloration that you see in the metal is from heat treating the check maker using oil.
Rick

Rick459
Where do your checks go once punched ?

[DoctorBill]

For anyone New to this..................



The Metric Threads are done the same except the 127 has the 120
stacked on the outside instead of where the spacer is in the photo.

The bottom has the spacer cylinder on the inside.

Hope this helps someone. I printed this out to review now and then.
Better'n lookin' at that damned chart thing !

See Post #50 for adjusting the spacing of the gears.

DoctorBill

[Rick459]

Rick459
Where do your checks go once punched ?

Right Here......

[DoctorBill]

What caliber are the Gas Caps in the photo for ?

What thickness of Aluminum are they being made from ?

DoctorBill

[Rick459]

the gas checks are for these....

they are .338/06....the aluminum flashing is .010" thick.
Rick

[Cane_man]

looks sweet Rick, freakin atomic missiles!

DB - ya the hardest part of this threading thing is figuring out that dang chart that comes with your particular lathe and then identifying which gears match which letters... after that it doesn't seem like too big of a deal

[DoctorBill]

Cane Man - Yes, once you "get it" OK, but I don't thread very often and tend to forget
those details.

So I made that Picture with everything to remind me.

I HATE getting old ! My rifling is wearing out....

Here is my "Hand Cranking" setup that I use for threading.


You guys who use the leadscrew advance, don't laugh, I'm new to this.... !

Here I am just beginning the 1.25" x 12 TPI threading of my Punch Die Body.


I have a FIXED routine - if I mess it up, I mess up the work.

Take the Belt off the Lathe Drive - no use turning the motor too !
If the Hand crank is on, you could Seriously Kill Yourself in a messy way !
Square off the 60° bit to the work with a 60° Center Gauge.
Make sure the Compound is set to 29°.
Set up the Tail Stock with the Live or Dead Center for support.
Align the bit and approach the work until it just cuts a mark, then set it to the right side of the work, 1/2 in. out.
Depress the threading Lever and don't touch it again until you are done ! I tape it down.
Advance the Compound 5 thousands (remember - you are turning by hand !). **** note below
Turn the crank fast until the bit reaches the end of the threaded part on the left (your choice where).
Turn the Cross Slide Crank OUT one full turn (set it to Zero). This pulls the bit out so you can go backward.
Reverse the crank until the bit is back where you started.
Turn the Cross Slide Crank IN one full turn back to zero. Puts the bit depth back where it was.
Advance the Compound by 5 thousandths to make a new cut.
Turn the crank FAST until the bit reaches the end of the threaded part.

Repeat over and over until you have what you want. I lube with ATF - works great.
BTW - as you go in further, it gets harder so ease up on how deep you are cutting !
Remember - don't touch the Threading Lever until you are done ! Taping it helps remind you.

If you want to TEST your Threads, use a NUT of the appropriate size before taking
the work out of the Chuck - You'd lose your orientation....

Now you old timers can laugh !
If I had a REAL slow rpm setting, I'd use the Feed, but mine is just TOO fast for me.
Someday I might get a DC Motor.....etc.

DoctorBill

**** note...At 30° you are advancing TOWARD the work by 1/2 of what the
Compound setting says. TRIGONOMETRY
You are also advancing into the right side of the thread - taking off more metal with each advance.

[DoctorBill]

Finished....

Here I just finished trimming the ends to make it "Pretty" since it has
to pass my machinist friend's scrutiny.....and he's picky !



All done -



And now to pass THE TEST......



'T worketh !

Now I have to make the slots for the Aluminum strips and the Disk Punch
(one half) of this project will be overs.

DoctorBill