Starter Progressive Press??

[Love Life]

Because they don't improve the odds if a person is careful about reloading. What they do for those people is give peace of mind.

They are a convenience and should be factored in on that account, not because "they improve safety." As I have said before a non careful person can load bad ammo just as efficiently on a single stage as a progressive. They can load bad ammo just as carefully on a machine with no auto index as they can on a machine with auto index.

IMO, and only my opinion, manual index allows me to check things easier. After weighing my shooting needs the first press I ever bought and reloaded on was a Dillon RL550B. I had no mentor. I still have that press and have loaded thousands upon thousands of rounds. Never a double charge, never a squib, never a overly long rd, etc. Why? Because I have the ability to read the manual, learn a machine, and watch quality control.

While I do believe a powder check die decreases the chances of a squib or double charge what if the battery is dead? I do not believe the auto index adds anything to safety.

All that being said I will say that both the Hornady and the Dillon will work very well for the OP. Just weigh your skill, needs, preferences and buy the machine that you believe will work best for you.

[Kull]

While I do believe a powder check die decreases the chances of a squib or double charge what if the battery is dead? I do not believe the auto index adds anything to safety.

I agree with you completely that paying attention and using your head is the number one thing. As long as your doing that you will probably notice that for the first two strokes of the press, when there is no case full of powder at the third station, the buzzer is not sounding as it should. Added safety features are no more of a convenience than a reserve parachute. The definitely serve a function.

For what it's worth I started on a 650. Started with no case feeder and no powder check. Auto indexing and case feed of the 650 make it a better beginners progressive than the 550. There's a lot going on at once with any progressive. Those two features, more than the powder check, make it better for a beginner simply because that's two less things on that large list of things going on. The powder check is a bonus.

[johnnybar]

If a device can improve one's odds of a mishap not occurring, from say 1:100,000 to 1:1,000,000, pray tell, why should we not employ the use of that device and recommend it to others?

Because they don't improve the odds if a person is careful about reloading.

Huh? What? Sometimes it's better to just give up! lol Signing off and moving on.

[A pause for the COZ]

RCBS presses charge on the back side. 357 mag brass. Forget about seeing the charge in the case. Even if you do look a powder check die is a nice feature.
It even catches under or over charges. Mine has caught 3 over charges that i can think of. Wont ever not use one.

[Alvarez Kelly]

If you read the original post, he was concerned about dollars. In my opinion, the best quality progressive for the money is the Dillon 550. The LnL and the Dillon 650 are both optimized for a casefeeder. To keep costs down (for the guy asking for advice) the Dillon 550 makes sense.

I disagree with comments about the 550 not being a good press for a beginner. The manual advance is actually a great benefit to a beginner. He can check EVERYTHING before advancing the shellplate. It is a great confidence builder.

And of course, the original poster is not a rank beginner.

Buy a Dillon. Any Dillon. If history repeats itself, you could sell it in a few years for more than you paid for it. There are not too many tools you can buy in this world that go up in value.

[joehaberxxx]

I'm a new kid on the block here but after reading Johnnybar's post it make me appreciate my Hornady progressive press (pre LnL) even more. I had not considered how convenient it is to insert a case and bullet with your left hand only while keeping your right hand on the operating handle, plus being able to lean forward a little and check to make sure your primer is in the pocket and to do a visual powder check. I wanted to tell you a story about a friend of mine that was moving and had his reloading bench complete with Dillon 650 press mounted on it. It fell off the back of the pickup and broke the press body in half. He sent the pieces to Dillon and they replaced the press. One more thing about the Hornady press and that is I have seen engine pistons smaller that the ram on the Hornady

[Love Life]

Welcome aboard Joehaber!!!

[btroj]

Why manual advance? Because I am in control of when it moves a case. Same reason i don't like powder check dies.
Reliance on a mechanical device can lead to complacency.
Sort of like people who wave around loaded guns with the safety on. I don't trust a mechanical device, I trust ME.

I don't think a person new to reloading should be near a progressive. A person new to a progressive should load a single case at a time until he is comfortable with what happens at each station. Understand what moves, what is done, and how. Having many things happening at once is tough to keep an eye on at first. Safety first.

[Matt_G]

Mischief
May I suggest you go to http://ultimatereloader.com/ and watch the videos of both the 550 and LNL in action.

[gefiltephish]

Regarding btroj's comment:

I started with a progressive. It was a hand-me-down loadmaster which is best used as a door stop, but at least I learned a lot using it for a year. Just like any other press, on a progressive nothing happens until you pull the handle, until then you can look over each station as long as you want to make sure all is ok. I suspect someone that is too stupid to handle that is also too stupid to be reloading at all. I had very few problems that weren't directly related to the loadmaster itself.

Next I got the LNL - what a relief and a really nice press! After that I got an LCT for short runs - another really nice press. I've never used a Dillon, but have considered an SDB to leave set up just for 45acp. I couldn't care less what "color" the press is, what counts for me is that it suits my needs.

I know the OP said he "wants" a progressive, but based on what he stated about his volume, all he really "needs" is an LCT. He may even be happier with it. I just wish it had 5 or 6 stations. Yeah I know, we're never satisfied!

[FLHTC]

I can't understand why the answers to the original post became skewed so quickly. The question was about progressives, not turrets. I don't believe there is such thing as an entry level progressive but some will be a one time purchase, as opposed to replacing one that wears out. All progressives index automatically and the stations are in the same order from press to press. The engineering is what sets them apart from each other and provides more durability in some, more than others. I hear comments about chains, disks, hollow tubing for rams and constant tinkering. If ya want to avoid all these things, buy a high end press. I personally prefer Dillon presses and always will. Im convinced they'll last me my entire life and still have value when im gone.

[Love Life]

The 550 does not index automatically. It is manual index.

[Kull]

Why manual advance? Because I am in control of when it moves a case. Same reason i don't like powder check dies.
Reliance on a mechanical device can lead to complacency.
Sort of like people who wave around loaded guns with the safety on. I don't trust a mechanical device, I trust ME.

I don't think a person new to reloading should be near a progressive. A person new to a progressive should load a single case at a time until he is comfortable with what happens at each station. Understand what moves, what is done, and how. Having many things happening at once is tough to keep an eye on at first. Safety first.

Safety first, yet unwilling to embrace safety devices because they're scared of becoming complacent. You hear the same thing from people who absolutely hate loaded chamber indicators. I think it's an ego trip thing more than anything, I'm with johnnybar and just gonna give up.

[btroj]

Biggest safety device lies between the ears. I use mine.
I pay attention. I have a routine. When in doubt I stop, dump the powder, and recharge the case.

Ego trip? Not at all. It is the voice of experience. Over 15 years with a 550 and no double charges. Maybe I do this because it just works?

[johnnybar]

Cost:
LNL AP $440 + 500 free bullets, depending on bullet selected, a $117 to $160 value at the pre-panic prices.
LNL AP Total $280-$323 Sounds like a bargain and an even better one if you sell your free bullets online or at a show.

XL650 $566

[grampa243]

i'll +1 for the dillon 550b. works great for me and i only load 100-200 at a time but will never go back to a one stage press.

I load 45 acp; 223 rem(5.56mm); 22-250 rem; 243 win; 30-30 win; 308 win; 45-70 gov.
and i'm waiting for my 9mm dies and shell holder to come and start loading them too.

i keep one extra tool head for other dies like the universal de-primer when i have to get out crimped ones.

as far as powder measures go i have not had trouble with the dillon's but you can put other brands on it. i do find that i like to use ball and short grain powders more then others.

[Love Life]

Safety first, yet unwilling to embrace safety devices because they're scared of becoming complacent. You hear the same thing from people who absolutely hate loaded chamber indicators. I think it's an ego trip thing more than anything, I'm with johnnybar and just gonna give up.

I understand how the powder die is a safety device, but can somebody please explain how auto index is a safety design or device?

[Love Life]

Cost:
LNL AP $407 + 500 free bullets; depending on bullet selected, a $117 to $160 value at the pre-panic prices. $247-$290 Sounds like a bargain and even better if you sell your free bullets online.

With the free bullets thrown in and resold the price point of the Hornady is much better than the Dillon.

[1bluehorse]

Tastes great!! Less filling!!

I would also like to add, if the manual indexing is one of the attributes that makes the 550 so attractive and safe...then my RCBS 5 STATION manual indexing press would be even better....that gives a person room for one of those unneeded powder cop dies..if needed..or not..

[johnnybar]

Here is a current price comparison. If anyone knows of the 650 having a current on sale price, please let me know. LNL AP price listed includes one shell plate. I assume the 650 comes with one shell plate. Dies and components should be the only additional costs.

LNL AP $440 + 500 free bullets, depending on bullet selected, a $117 to $160 value at the pre-panic prices.
LNL AP Total $280-$323 Sounds like a bargain and an even better one if you sell your free bullets online or at a show.

XL650 $566