Loading homemade slugs

[Chicken Thief]

Had some ramblings with Cap'n Morgan and got this

A drilling fixture for the wad and the ball





Poor mans "Brenneche"

Soft .735" ball and whatewer wad you fancy.

In hindsight i could have saved the time by not making the fixture for teh ball, the one for the wad do just fine.

[Chicken Thief]

The possibilities are endless

[longbow]

I tried using screwed on wads with balls and also hot melt glue cast into a form them paper patched to keep the glue off the bore. They sort of worked and are similar to BPI AQ slugs which shot really well for me.

Where I ran into a problem was with the round surface of the ball. The wads tend to form around it and distort. Possibly a really dense felt under the ball would help or something very hard like a hard tough plastic. AQ's look like round balls but have a flat base where the wad contacts.

Basically it is the same problem as with wads pushing into hollow base slug cavities. Those wads are under huge forces and will deform at any opportunity.

I have gone to a Brenneke style flat base slug for current testing. The flat base solves a lot of the problem.

For a simple wad you might try hot melt glue pumped into a simple form ~ I made mine from CPVC couplings bores to the same size as the slug then wipe with grease or other release agent put in the slug and pump in glue. I use a screw in the base of flat based slugs so make sure the "wad" stays attached. With hollow base slugs just fill the cavity and then into the form. There is enough glue surface to hold.

That is what I found anyway.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Longbow

PS: I should add that when I used attached wads with 0.735" RB I got noticeably increased recoil and sticky extraction with a load that shot fine with just the RB and should not have been near max even if considering the weight of the added wad. I think bore friction was the culprit. Best to start out with an extra light load then work up.

[Chicken Thief]

Funny thing is that i use styrofoam as a wad in my full power slugs.


And they look almost prestine and reuseable after firing. But when i compress them with my fingers they stay flattened, go figure.

PS. Maybe they act non Newtonian? I.e. like quicksand and custard.

[45 2.1]

OK... that all looks good. Now, are you going to tell us how it performs?

[Chicken Thief]

Test shooting sunday!

Will have carpal tunnel surgery on the right front paw thursday, but im south paw so who cares

I only have a rifled barrel (wont use for this) and a slug barrel (so no choke), but 45m~50yds shots galore.

[littlejack]

Chicken Thief:
I had that carpal tunnel done in 2001 or 02, don't remember which. I had both hands done (not at the same time) Lord nooo!
Take care of them, and do what the doc says to do. They will last you till you check out.
All the best for your surgery.
Jack

[Chicken Thief]

Had a trigger middle finger done 5 weeks ago (left front paw). No more than 2 lbs of load for the first 2 weeks then use as it will handle (docs orders). And it is still good at saying no to stoopid loads/uses

[littlejack]

Yes sir. They will let you know.

[longbow]

Well, that's different! I had no photos showing up until now. Kinda wondered.

I have no idea about the styrofoam! I can't believe it survives. Maybe styrofoam and cockroaches will be left after we are all gone! At least the cockroaches will have styrofoam beer coolers!

I hope those screwed on wads work better for you than they did for me. I haven't tried the foamy types but have used card, cushion legs, hot melt glue, copper tube and a few other things and so far the only success I have had is with stiff hard materials. Anything flexy has been a failure.

I will be interested in your field reports.

What load do you use behind that big full bore slug in post #4? I remember you posting photos of that monster before! What does it weigh?

Longbow

[Chicken Thief]

690gr and and i'm still developing loads.
I have a "slow" good one at @1300fps using 70gr of Vv N105 (2400'ish).

Eksperimenting with Vv N133 (IMR3031'ish) between 120 and 140 grains. Hoping to approach 1850-2200fps.
No need for big wads there!
120gr on top
130gr in the middle
140gr at the bottom


120gr = @17900psi~1235bar for 1800fps~550m/s and 4870flbs~6700j
130gr = @22500psi~1550bar for 1960fps~600m/s and 5890flbs~7980j
140gr = @28300psi~1950bar for 2120fps~645m/s and 6900flbs~9350j
The last one is going to be a snot kicker in a 3.7kg~8lbs rifle
Recoil energy @ 112flbs

Before anybody get a fit over the pressures i list, it is a Maverick/Mossberg pump with a frigging big locking lug directly in the barrel, not a break action shotgun! I do indeed look for telltale signs of pressure at every shot. Shotshell hulls are wery good at this due to the thin design of the bottom metal and plastic innards. And i do all my own stunts.
Dont whine go sue someone who cares (enough rant).

[longbow]

Have you got pressure testing equipment or did you get someone to pressure test your loads?

I wish I had pressure testing equipment! Maybe one day.

I thought that slug was heavier but 690 grs. isn't a lightweight at any rate. Even at 1800 FPS recoil has to be fierce! I wouldn't to be standing behind you when you pull the trigger on the 140 gr. load. I suspect you will be skidding backward with recoil!

I thought slugs were illegal in Denmark. Or is this considered a "boolit" in a rifled gun? Just curious.

Longbow

[Chicken Thief]

Regarding pressure i rely on QuickLoads guestimates.
The 120gr load was not bad at all, think BP recoil.
More of a stout push than the kick the faster powder gives (and believe me it get's your attention!)

Here's the funny thing regarding slugs and Denmark.
No mention in the law regulating weapons and ammo, what so ever.
Only mentioned in the law regulating hunting and what to use during that.
And there it only states that they are illigal to fire in a smoothbore.
I have a Mossberg cal. 12 rifled barrel and the thing is registered as a rifle with the police. I can mount a smooth barrel and use it as a shotgun but it still is a rifle on the papers. Of course i have to follow regulations for shotguns while using it with a smooth barrel. Ie. pellets no more than 4mm~US #1 and no lead.

[longbow]

Ed Hubel says much the same with his heavy loads ~ not as brutal as one might think due to the slower acceleration with slow powder.

What is the reason for restricting slugs in smoothbores? I thought slugs were quite popular and common in most European countries (maybe excepting Denmark). Can you get a way with saying a bore size ball is one BIG buckshot?

We do have hunting restrictions here with slugs adn they cannot be used for game larger than deer. Not sure why but that is the way it is. I could see limiting type of slug or having minimum amount of energy or something like that but a bore size round ball, Gualandi DGS or Brenneke should easily handle elk and moose.

Not sure but we may have a contradiction in principle too because I do not know of any hunting restrictions for smoothbore muskets and as far as I know they are not classed as shotguns. If a .62 cal. trade musket shooting a patched .600" ball is legal then a 12 ga. should be.

Anyway, I still don't want to be standing behind you when you torch off the 140 gr. load! Maybe if I have padding and a BIG catcher's mitt!

Hmmmmm, if you could shoot some video and post it I am sure it would be exciting to watch. The muzzle flash must light up the whole area! I'll bet onlookers should be wearing sunglasses!

Hah! That reminds me of an article I read about a fellow shooting a Harris Desert Rhino in .50 BMG. He said the muzzle blast and shock wave produce "... an otherworldly experience..." I think you will be there my friend!

Longbow

[Chicken Thief]

In Denmark we are limited to 4mm~US #1 shot in shotguns.
Anything bigger in a smoothbore is a big no-no.
Wery resently (2009 i think) BP guns became legal for hunting ie. frontloaders alas anything other than cartridge guns. The smoothbore/ball thing is a very good question and i have to take it up with the local Sheriff.

In Sweden buckshot and slugs are allowed for hunting and here is the funny bit:
Slugs are not allowed on roe deer (30-45lbs) but ok for anything bigger. Pigs, elk, Moose, tractors, planes and anything else in season.
Reason is that the target area is to little on a deer that is the size of a medium dog, but the larger ones compensate for the spread pattern of a smoothbore firing a slug.

Vill see about the video. My cell is a model launched just after landline and it has a camera but i think only stills and less than 1Mpix.
Wont be me firing though (hand surgery thursday!). But i might get help from a member with a modern camera/tv/PC/MP3/MP4/video thingamajig phone (that can make coffee, spotweld, remowe paint and whatnot).

Ramblings on legality in Scandinavia.

Rifles:
Anything bigger than: fox, hare, goose etc is: min. caliber 22 and min. bullet weight 3.2gram~50gr and min. energy is 800j~600flbs at 100m~110yds.
And that is per se roe deer http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roe_deer

Anything bigger tha roe deer: Caliber min. 22 and bullet weight min. 9gram~139gr with a E100 of min 2700j~2000flbs OR min weight of 10gram~154gr and E100 of 2000j~1480flbs.

Shotguns:
Min. barrel length 55cm~22", max. caliber 12. Max 2 shots.

Theese laws was made in the 1950's and here is the reason for the energy demands.
Farmers in Scandinavia from the 1800's and onvards paid a fee at the sheriff to get a rifle license. The RB was sold to privates from 1867 so by 1955 there were gods only know how many rifles on private hands that gobberment knew squat about.
The good old "50-70" of the Swedes and Norwegans only delivered @ 1600j~1200flbs at 100m~110yds but the new fangled M1896 6.5x55 just about made 2000j~1480flbs at the same distance. Law was made and now all the unregistered rifles had to be traded in for new rifles that the gobberment had registered.
Wonder if the hundred and hundred of thousands of Moose killed with BP ever knew that the 50cal 450gr boolit did'nt hold modern muster?

Again old laws: Shotgun no more than cal. 12. When law was made typical of a 12 gauge was = max. length 67½-70mm~2½-2 5/8". That set a natural max. shot load. Now we have 3½" shells holding double the old max. weight or more. Nobody ever thinks that a bigger bore will deliver a better pattern with the same load of shot. It takes sense and they have none!

Airguns: Oh the stupidity!!!
A year ago no limitations at all.
Now anything above 4.5mm~.177" has to be registrered. So a slobby 100fps 5.5mm~.20" cal is probited but a 330m/s~1100fps with a 16grain pellet yelding 56j~42flbs is absolutly free to own. Talk about stupid.

Enough ramblings for now. (i was getting myself wound up)

[longbow]

CT:

There is no sense to make of nonsense! We have it here too. We just got rid of our long gun registry so that is good. I think the government finally realized that the criminals weren't registering the guns they had and the registry cost a fortune (billions of dollars to set up) and they couldn't keep it straight anyway.

Handguns still have to be registered and there are many restrictions on them. Oddly handguns are the first choice of criminals so I am not sure what the government thought they would solve by registering long guns. handguns have been registered here for generations and can only be shot on private property or at a registered gun club. No packing them around, no hunting and no going anyway with one.

We also have to take a course and pass a test to own firearms and we have to have PAL (Possession and Acquisition License) as well and it is renewable every 5 years. There are two courses and levels of approval, one for long arms and one for restricted weapons.

I have no argument with people having to take a course before they can purchase an own firearms. A little education never hurt anyone and for many, guns and ammunition are a complete mystery. There was one woman in the restricted weapons course that thought that if she was shooting at 100 yards the bullets stopped there like they knew they didn't have to go any further. Not someone you want shooting off in the bush near you or your house for sure! I hope the course sorted that out for her. Scary!

Anyway, I digress. We have more stupid than good laws here too especially firearms related laws.

Longbow

[350Gr]

Funny thing is that i use styrofoam as a wad in my full power slugs.


And they look almost prestine and reuseable after firing. But when i compress them with my fingers they stay flattened, go figure.

PS. Maybe they act non Newtonian? I.e. like quicksand and custard.

Is that a pure lead slug or one that is hardened? Hand made or store bought?

[Chicken Thief]

It is a modified Lyman Foster slug that has had the bands added and a new (non) hollow base pin installed. I cast to a BHN of @12

[350Gr]

It is a modified Lyman Foster slug that has had the bands added and a new (non) hollow base pin installed. I cast to a BHN of @12

Nice... By the way, looking at your loaded slug rounds it appears you are using extruded powder. Where do you get your load data from or is that home-brew?

350Gr

[Chicken Thief]

Quickload