223 wildcat

[bruce drake]

Thanks, I will try to keep the thread updated. The next major update should be range results from first batch of test loads.

I considered rechambering the barrel to 7.62x40WT but the tradeoffs in case prep time versus powder space versus bullet selection just lead me to deciding that for most of the applications for this rifle, a 125gr bullet is more than big enough to do the work needed and then I'm personally tired of dealing with case prep for the 300BLK. trimming 10mm off and reforming are few more steps than just reforming... the 7.62x40WT requires the same amount of prep time but just cutting 5mm off from the parent case (223 Rem).

I had a fun time shooting this upper in 300BLK at a 100 yard match using 147gr FMJs. I'll test these same FMJs later to see if they work with this new cartridge.

[LynC2]

Bruce I would imagine you should be good with the 7.62x40WT load data since yours is a larger capacity case.

[bruce drake]

Good call. I've got some AA1680 and some 110gr and 125gr spitzer jacketed bullets to try it. At the Wilson site they give 23gr at a start and 25gr max (2269fps/2534fps) for the 110gr spire point.

The Dies came in today and I've built starter loads at 21gr, 22gr, and 23gr to see what they do. Now that being said, those are jacketed loads. tomorrow, I plan to build some cast loads using Varget and the 120gr 311359 Lyman mold boolit.

Bruce

[bruce drake]

Family Life took precedence this weekend. Took the youngest boy out to zero his AR15 for this weekend's NRA Highpower match and forgot the ammo for the 30 Apache upper on the bench at the house 45 miles away...The boy got his zeros but the range testing and chrono work I had planned will have to wait for sometime later.

Bruce

[bruce drake]

Initial Range Testing with the pistol length gas system and 7.62x40 load data over 110gr RN bullets. It works but primers were flattened and the bolt carrier group got shoved back too fast and peened a chip out of the bolt head.

Fast forward to last month.
New bolt, carbine length pigtail gas tube and an H3 buffer (5.4oz versus 3.0) installed in the carbine has tamed the recoil and primer issues. Now it fires the 110gr RN and 125gr Spitzers over 24gr of AA1680 (~2400fps/~2300fps with the 110 and 125gr bullets) without any issues. This is 7.62x40WT load data so I probably could up it if I needed to but the velocity and the accuracy of the load is just fine that I won't change this one. The 125gr bullets are nearly the same speed as their equivalent 30-30 loadings.

Bruce

[KLR]

Update with my results:

I reamed a H&R Handi rifle AAC 300 Blackout model to 30-223. Using Accurate 1680 I worked up a load that produced 2609 fps with a 110gr Hornady VMax at about the point pressure signs were beginning to appear. Then I switched to a 130gr Speer jacketed FN bullet and got to 2372 fps before I ran out of daylight. Looking at the primer I think I'm nearing the limit there too. 2400 fps is possible, but it will likely be a little too hot.

Not bad for a 16" barrel with a 1:7 twist. That puts it in 30-30 territory.

I still have accuracy testing to do, but this answered my question about how much I could get out of this rifle/cartridge.

So:

Pros:
* Cheap brass and easy to form.
* Gained about 200 additional fps over the 300 BO.


Cons:
* Brass has a thin neck - easy to crumple when seating a bullet if you're not careful.
* Thin brass at the shoulder makes it easy to set back the shoulder firing reduced loads in a Handi rifle. I began to have misfires with the third firing. (No problem with full power loads.)

So now I want to try this in a bolt action rifle with a slow twist, 22" barrel, and .223-sized mini action.

[SSGOldfart]

It has been done a long time ago.

I have an article by Roy Dunlap (IIRC) on the .30 Apache which is simply the .223 necked up to .30 cal. Also .30-223 was an early entry into metallic silhouette shooting according to Elgin gates.

So, yeah, nothing new under the sun is right. Not a bad idea though and I am a bit surprised it didn't catch on as an economical .30-30 level round using surplus brass. It should be easy to load up supersonic to decent ballistics and down to subsonic without much trouble. I have thought about it myself.

As mentioned though, nowadays there is so much 7.62 x 39 around it is easier to use that.

Longbow

Yep and I think Gates tried to use the xp-100 platform for his 30-223R I played with the 243w-223 myself but the well ran dry(life got in the way I still think the 223/5.56 neck up to 243/6mm would be a better route myself,fast with out the recoil until you get into to heavier bullets,I'm working on a light weight 243 Winchester load now with a 46gr GC Boolit.
I'm wanting to push it about 1600or 1700 fps,cast up a second 1000 rounds this morning,but I'm kinda thinking I should have made this bullet a HP instead of a flat Nose for squirrel hunting
Sorry Didn't mean to Hi-Jack your thread

[BAGTIC]

One can push .30 carbine bullets to more than 1800 fps in the .30 carbine case at the lower carbine pressures. It might be possible to get 2,500 fps with a 110 grain carbine bullet but why? Would be better off with a 125-130 grain at 2,300+. If you are shooting an autoloader you will be spending a lot of time chasing brass and forming new replacements.

[bruce drake]

Well...I've been using the newer 110gr Spirepoints from Hornady and I feel they are built a bit sturdier than the 110gr RN when I need to use jacketed. I shoot the 110gr RN as plinkers mostly and not at the same speed as the Spirepoints. the spirepoints are very effective on coyotes and porcupines in my experiences in the field.

[CENTEX BILL]

What about using the new 22 Nosler case necked up to 30 caliber. Would it be worth it?

Centex Bill

[oldblinddog]

What about using the new 22 Nosler case necked up to 30 caliber. Would it be worth it?

Centex Bill

that would be a .30 Remington with a rebated rim.

[Nobade]

Use 30 Herret dies to load it. Wouldn't be a bad thing.

[brstevns]

Any new updates on the 30-223 ?