S&W 625-8 ,45 acp leading.

[Graakall]

Hello.
I´ve fired ca 4000 lee 228 grs 1-r bullets in a 5" version this season.
Throat to barrel dimensions and timing is ok.
No frame choke.
There is leading if alloy hardeness at brinell 12 or lower.
There is still some leading at brinell 14-15.

I tumble lube size, ,452 and tumblelube.

I use this boolit at powerfactor 175 for IPSC/USPSA competitions and suspect that the reason for the leading is the shallow rifling of the modern S&W barrels.

Does modern ,45 barrels need harder boolits or am I off in the wrong direction?

[HeavyMetal]

I am not a fan of Lees 228 rnl boolit, but understand its use for reloading speed.

As I recall this design has a real minimal lube groove and tumble lube has never impressed me!

I suggest a mold change, lees TC 45 mold with the standard lube groove and use a lube like Carnuba red.

Pan lube 50 or so and then use the lee push through sizer. I strongly suspect leading will "go away". Porvided your not using a Lee FCD die at the end of your loading cycle.

[Pepe Ray]

I can 2nd that mold recomendation. That profile is AT LEAST as fast to load as the RN. Keep them large and hard.
Pepe Ray

[Graakall]

230 grs TC TL.
I´ll give it a try.

Thank you very much.

[imashooter2]

I shoot that same boolit for the same purpose at the same power factor. You can see them in my avatar. I use water dropped range scrap that hardens to about 18 BHN and load as cast tumbled in Rooster Jacket (which frankly isn't much of a lube). What do you use for tumble lube? I solved a leading problem in a 686 by going to the JPW/LLA blend.


There's just no way I'd use a TC design for USPSA.

[Dale53]

I have a Smith 625-8 (and a 625-6) and have several friends who also have the 625-8. We use cast bullets without leading. My personal mix is WW's+2% tin air cooled. I size to .452".

However, my bullets are conventionally lubed with Lars White Label Carnauba Red in my Star luber/sizer. My "go to" bullet is the #68 (MP Molds version) a 200 gr SWC. If I were using in competition where a quick reload was required, I would use Lee's conventionally lubed 230 gr TC. It loads perfectly with full moon clips and while it is not quite as accurate as my #68 bullets, it will shoot in 1 1/4" at 25 yards.

FWIW
Dale53

[BLTsandwedge]

I had leading in the long throats of the 625 but accuracy never suffered. It seems that years ago I slugged/miked the throats @ .452". Then Mal Paso brought a pin gauge set to the range one day.....each throat pinned at .453". I stepped up to .454" and no more leading at all with 10 Bhn range scrap. Lube is 45/45/10 (45% JPW, 45% beeswax and 10% Lee brand mule snot)...... projectiles include L#452389, L#452640 and H&G's #68. Load is 4.1g Clays.

[coat]

Craakall: I have had S/W 625 for a long time now. I have shot hard and soft bullets .451 and 452 sized for wst to unique, bullseye red dot, green dot. I SITLL GET leading sometime a little to Alot. Now When I do shoot it i use plate bullets

[runfiverun]

i have a 625 with the 4" bbl and use a 225 rnfp on moon clips.
sometimes the shallow rifling prefers a harder alloy.
i however would look over the cylinder throats.
it only takes one that's slightly smaller to start leading the bbl then the rest are trying to move it down the bbl.
before they clean it up you have laid down more.

[Shiloh]

230 grs TC TL.
I´ll give it a try.

Thank you very much.

This boolit drops heavy for me, closer to 238, but loads very easily from speed loaders.

Shiloh

[jmsj]

Graakall,
Where are you getting the leading?
I worked on a newer 625 (don't recall the -#) this past fall that was horrible for leading. It was leading in the cylinder throats, forcing cone and the first 1 1/2" of the barrel after 50-100 rounds.
I measured the cylinder throats and they were .4505" and they could use a polish job. The forcing cone had tool marks in it as well. The guy it belong to was shooting a H&G 68 type commercial cast bullet with commercial hard lube and WST powder. After polishing the throats out to .4515" that got the throats to stop leading. Polishing out the tool marks of the forcing cone helped the barrel but there was still some leading in the barrel using his loads.
I tried some of my 45 ACP loads that I shoot out of some of my revolvers, Lee 452-200-RNFP (50% COWW/50% SOWW, FWFL and 4.0 grains of Bullseye. I was able shoot 200 rounds without leading and 1-1/4"-1-1/2" 6 shot groups. We tried some of his commercial cast bullets again but this time he applied a coat of Rooster jacket on the H&G 68 type bullets and there was very little leading this time.
I have never used Rooster Jacket lube before but I guess it was enough of a lube to help. I have used Recluse's 45/45/10 and I do know that it works well for this type of load, I still prefer FWFL. The hard commercial lube and bullets being undersized by the throats probably had more to do with problem than anything.
On this revolver there was more than one thing causing the leading. Since we fixed the leading and the other things he wanted done, he is really happy with this revolver.
Good luck and Merry Christmas, jmsj

[Graakall]

Thank You all for the useful advises.

I use LEE liquid allox lube.
There is lube in the barrel after shooting and it cleans out with a oiled swab. Thats when the lead deposits become visible.

There is no leading in the throats but the forcingcone has some toolmarks in the first half.

The leading is along the rifling for the first 1-2" of the barrel and a small amount in the forcingcone.

( I get deposits in the same area shooting Berry's plated 230grs bullets.)

When i slugged the barrel the testslug could be pressed trough the throats with a firm push.

I guess I'll clean barrel and throats and slug again.
From the advices given I suspect the forcingcone needs looking into. Recutting or polishing. Hmmmm.

[Dale53]

Graakall;
Before I'd invest in time and effort on the gun, I'd first try some normally lubed bullets with a good bullet lube - NRA 50/50 or one of Lars White Label lubes.

Last winter I was shooting with some friends. One of them was using Lees Liquid Alox lube and was having leading problems. I loaned him some ammo. Mine were target loads with Carnauba Red lube. He fired them and not only did they not lead, they removed the previous leading he had experienced.

Just a thought...

Dale53

[softpoint]

You might try a slower powder.

[Graakall]

I think it's solved.
Worn cylinder stop and fast da shooting.
The leading has gotten worse as the play has increased.

No leading in my new 625 PC and I'm currently waiting for a new cs for my best gun.

I'll report when the new cs is installed.