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Thread: Clays vs Clay Dot

  1. #1
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    Dean D.'s Avatar
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    Clays vs Clay Dot

    I recently ran out of Clays and went shopping for some more. My local reloading supply store was out of Clays but did have Clay Dot so I thought what the heck, I'll try it. I had read about it but had not had a chance to compare it.

    According to Alliants website:
    Designed for competition shooters, Clay Dot™ is functionally and technically identical to competitive shotshell powders but at a reduced price. This American-made powder meters the same through reloading press powder bushings and functions with the exact same powder charge weights to achieve equal velocities and pressures. No need to change bushings or load data.

    Remarks:
    Designed to duplicate the performance of Hodgdon® Clays™ at an economical price.


    I have also read that Clay Dot is slightly denser than Clays. I thought I'd do some tests and see how much they differed. I set up my Ponsness-Warren 375 Duo-Matic and dropped charges of each powder using all of my different powder bushings. I used an electronic scale and a minimum of 5 throws per bushing to get an average. Here is what I found:

    Bushing Clays Clay Dot

    F 13.7 13.73
    G 15.0 15.23
    J 17.74 17.89
    K 18.5 18.78
    L 19.0 19.34
    M 20.0 20.48
    N 21.4 21.64
    P 22.1 22.5

    Conclusion; Clay Dot IS slightly more dense than Clays but not enough to make much difference in listed shotshell loads.

    I am planning on loading some pistol cartridges using Clay Dot loaded with Clays published data. I will start low and see how it performs and being very careful to watch for signs of pressure. In my opinion Alliant is doing themselves a disservice by not investing the time and money to publish load data for anything other than shotshells with Clay Dot.
    "The worst wheel of the cart makes the most noise." - Benjamin Franklin

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  2. #2
    Boolit Master

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    What about cleanliness? Does it seem to burn as clean as clays in handgun cartridge as well?
    I am really debating buying clay dot but as it only comes in 8lb jugs I really hope I like it.
    Any help is appreciated.

  3. #3
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    arjacobson's Avatar
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    I bought 42 pounds of universal clays and clays($100 for ALL of it!) I have loaded tons of pistol rounds with universal and although sometimes I get a bit of unburned flakes it really burns clean and accuracy has been very good. Good powder.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master


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    Whats difference between these two? Right one is purple color and left one is brown flakes.


  5. #5
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    Johnch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunoil View Post
    Whats difference between these two? Right one is purple color and left one is brown flakes.
    Clays is the faster of the 2
    It is close to WW231 in speed
    Universal Clays is closer to Unique in speed

    I used Universal Clays in the 20 gau for a while , when I was able to get it cheap

    Both powders work well for me
    Both powders are a lot cleaner if you keep the pressure up

    John
    Yea, thou I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil; for thou art with me; Thy rod and thy staff, they comfort me.
    And I carry a SIG

  6. #6
    Boolit Master

    Beau Cassidy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunoil View Post
    Whats difference between these two? Right one is purple color and left one is brown flakes.

    Totally, totally different burning rates!!!! Universal can be equated to unique for burning speed. Clays can be equated to bullseye. I really like both powders (especially Clays) but Hodgdon could have really done a better job naming these powders.
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  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    Unless I'm mistaken, Dean is talking about an Alliant powder http://www.alliantpowder.com/product.../clay_dot.aspx and Hodgdon Clays.

    Old Alliant data was published for pistol loads of the original "Dot" powders.

    Dean, let us know how the Alliant powder compares with the Hodgdon.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by BeeMan View Post
    Unless I'm mistaken, Dean is talking about an Alliant powder http://www.alliantpowder.com/product.../clay_dot.aspx and Hodgdon Clays.

    Old Alliant data was published for pistol loads of the original "Dot" powders.

    Dean, let us know how the Alliant powder compares with the Hodgdon.
    Yes, and I was actually asking about clay dot the Alliant version of clays.
    I am very thankful of the feedback so far but would really like to hear something about Clay Dot.

  9. #9
    Boolit Bub
    OregonCaster's Avatar
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    Never tried "Clay Dot" but I do love "Clays" in my 45 ACP.
    Winners go home, survivors go to the hospital and losers go to the morgue.

    NRA Life Member

  10. #10
    Boolit Mold
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    Quote Originally Posted by OregonCaster View Post
    Never tried "Clay Dot" but I do love "Clays" in my 45 ACP.
    Same here. I wanted a light 45 load and found it in Clays. I was also extremely acurrate for a light load.

  11. #11
    Boolit Bub
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    Quote Originally Posted by 45fisher View Post
    Same here. I wanted a light 45 load and found it in Clays. I was also extremely acurrate for a light load.
    My Sig P220 with 3.7-3.8 grains of "Clays" is just about good as it gets.
    Winners go home, survivors go to the hospital and losers go to the morgue.

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  12. #12
    I've done some reloading with Clay Dot that was left over from my trapshooting.
    3.3 gr's Claydot, 200 lswc, cci 300 primer Avg velocity thru my chron 719 fps.
    I also show 3.8 gr with a 185 lswc at 825 fps.

    I've loaded 2.2-2.5 gr's Claydot in the .38 special with a flush seated 148 gr hbwc.
    fired in a model 66 6" I got 711 fps with 2.2 and 800 fps with 2.5

    but, I found leading in my cylinder throats which wasn't a problem in the .357 mag cylinder, but, when 2.5 gr's was fired in the M-14 s&w severe leading in the forcing cone and barrel throat was present.

    I suspect melting of the base of the bullet.

    I have no data on this issue with the 2.2. load...

    but, I've once again become happy with bullseye in my .38...

    Jim
    Last edited by groot nadine; 03-27-2013 at 05:34 PM.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master rsrocket1's Avatar
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    Actually Clays is more close to Red Dot than Bullseye. For most low recoil loads of Red Dot, you can get almost the same performance with Clays. Clays does generate more pressure and less velocity than Red Dot which is good for some applications like 3/4 oz 12 gauge target loads. I went through 10# of Clays last season and really liked it. This year I couldn't find any Clays so I had to settle for Red Dot which needs about 1 grain more per load for my shotshells to burn cleanly.

    To the OP. Clay Dot is supposed to be almost interchangeable with Clays but it does generate a slightly lower max average pressure in comparable shotshell loads. For low recoil handgun loads, I'll bet you can use the same data for Clays and not notice any difference in your chrony using Clay Dot.

  14. #14
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    Dean D.'s Avatar
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    I apologize to everyone for not advancing this project. Between winter weather, work and family obligations I just have not had time to sit down and test some loads with both powders. I still plan to do so and will post my results here when I can find the time to get it done. If anyone else has more info to add feel free to go ahead and add it here.
    "The worst wheel of the cart makes the most noise." - Benjamin Franklin

    "To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson


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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check