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Thread: simple lube.

  1. #201
    Boolit Buddy SlippShodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taco650 View Post
    So the 2-stroke oil gives it the color?
    I think R5R pointed it out earlier, it's the combination of components that determine the color. In my case it was yellow/brown beeswax, red ATF and blue 2-stroke. The vaseline stays pretty neutral. The tan stuff has a brownish 2-stroke in it. The beeswax has a lot to do with the final outcome.

    mike
    I saw this in a cartoon once. I'm pretty sure I can pull it off...

  2. #202
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    Crayons aren't as bad as some would think, most of the name-brand ones have castor wax and paraffin in them. The castor wax does some good in small quantity, and the paraffin in small quantity doesn't seem to hurt anything. Liquid or powder candle dye is the best. Block candle dye isn't all that great, at least not any of the Yaley colors I've tried, and it's chalky, powdery junk I don't want in my lube anyway.

    Gear

  3. #203
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    some of the chinese crayons don't help a lube at all and will have a tendancy to just fall through a lube leaving a bunch of gunk on the bottom of the pan.
    they must just cram a bunch of clay together with some colored wax stuff
    and figure you bought it you got it.
    they generally get broke and tossed before half way.

    a blue color should make the lube green.

  4. #204
    Boolit Master taco650's Avatar
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    OK so I'll leave the crayons out and just go with the original like everyone says, he he.

  5. #205
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    Sometimes , well actually all the time, If it isn't broke, Don't try to FIX IT.
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  6. #206
    Boolit Mold The_Doctor's Avatar
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    Hi everyone... I'm new to this forum, but have been around firearms a LONG time. Just would like to say hello!

    RunFiveRun, I experimented about 30 years ago with a lube formula quite similar to your "simple Lube". (Yes, I'm

    the same "The_Doctor" from that other forum) When I first purchased my RCBS Lubri-Sizer, I liked the lube it came

    with, and attempted to duplicate it using my limited senses and experience. (I'm a retired aircraft mechanic)

    My formula, such as it is, is FAR from exact - but I had excellent results with all my cast bullet loads during my

    pistol competition years in Toronto. (1980 - 1995 ish)


    Here's what I started with: a big chunk of beeswax, a splash of ALOX (I figured it would help

    with corrosion prevention, and smelled like the RCBS lube) a glug or two of non detergent

    motor oil (I did mention I'm an aircraft mechanic) and a smidgen of STP oil treatment, for the

    "slippery" quotient. I never bothered to make hollow sticks, I just poured the molten mass into

    the sizer. For over 30 years, this mix has served me admirably. (Albeit, in indoor shooting conditions,

    and the ammunition has never been exposed to temperature extremes.) I rarely shoot my cast bullets

    outdoors, but that could possibly change in the near future. (Perhaps Cowboy Action Shooting?) I've not

    yet had a contaminated powder charger, or primer, or fail to fire using this mixture.


    Yes, I realize my proportions are inexact... I went with what "looked good, felt good, and smelled good."

    And my procedure seems to have worked, for me!

    I also rustled up a lube for my cap and ball revolvers which was based on (again) beeswax, and a lot more

    non detergent motor oil. I heated, stirred and tested until the consistency of the mix was similar to a fibrous

    wheel bearing grease. It, too, smells nice! LOL!


    Thank you all for letting me join your forum.


    Sincerely,


    The_Doctor

  7. #207
    Boolit Buddy SlippShodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Doctor View Post
    Thank you all for letting me join your forum.
    Like we had a choice.
    Er, um, I mean... Welcome to our little slice of insanity!

    mike
    (Cripes, I'm gonna get put in time-out again...)
    I saw this in a cartoon once. I'm pretty sure I can pull it off...

  8. #208
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    the doctor can take it
    he just mustered out of the service.

    i thought you were allready a member here guess that would splain why i hadn't seen you post..
    hope to see you around a LOT.

  9. #209
    Boolit Master OLPDon's Avatar
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    Welcome Back Doc:

    Backsliding can happen to anyone. Let us get the fatted lamb and add tallow to the mix....

    Don

  10. #210
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    actually adding the stp and the alox is what helped that lube...
    you basically used them to make a thin tacky calcium stearated grease from the oil.

  11. #211
    Boolit Mold The_Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runfiverun View Post
    actually adding the stp and the alox is what helped that lube...
    you basically used them to make a thin tacky calcium stearated grease from the oil.
    If the truth be told, I haven't actually recently mustered out of anything. I'm just old and cranky. LOL

    But now, the STP I've used in my "formula" I think has addded to the "slippery" factor as well as assisting

    the softening of powder residue. My cast loads are mild by most standards, but I have not yet had a trace

    of lead fouling in my barrels. (Before I sold my Colt SAA 45, my favourite load was a 200 Gr, SWC pushed with

    10 gr of Unique. It was accurate in my 7.5" Colt, and really pleasant to shoot.)


    I've been away from the shooting sports for many years now, and am anticipating getting

    back into the swing of things soon. No sense in letting the Vault Queens gather even more dust! LOL


    Again, thanks for the welcome.




    The_Doctor

  12. #212
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    stp is origionally from the studebaker corp [studebaker petro is what stp stands for]
    it has a sticky in it called paratack it's a long chain molecule.
    it's also used in lucas oil products,chain saw oils, and some 2 stroke oils.
    in the stp it's a poe/poa base, solvents and paratack,it helps oils cling and climb.

  13. #213
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    What does "poe" and "poa" stand for?


    Custom Cast Boolits Google Search


    The Learning Never Stops!

  14. #214
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    polyolephinester [like atf]
    and polyolephinalphetic [like base oils for grease]
    poa's will make a b-wax more crumbly and dry usually inducing a dry scale on the surface.
    poe's are usually better absorbed into the wax,they CAN however have base solvents that will dry out when exposed to air and or heat.

  15. #215
    Boolit Mold The_Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runfiverun View Post
    polyolephinester [like atf]
    and polyolephinalphetic [like base oils for grease]
    poa's will make a b-wax more crumbly and dry usually inducing a dry scale on the surface.
    poe's are usually better absorbed into the wax,they CAN however have base solvents that will dry out when exposed to air and or heat.
    Wow. Lots of technical stuff to learn. Just by pure luck, I seem to have stumbled upon a working mixture.

    I know absolutely NOTHING about Polly's Uncle Fester, and even less about POAs. (POA to me means point of aim)

    But, and please forgive me for being repetitive, but I have a great appreciation for the usefullness of STP in the

    reloading process. I'm certain it softens the lube substantially - I have some cast 9mm bullets on hand that were

    fabricated some 20 or more years ago (never got around to reloading these) and the lube is just as soft and supple

    (yet firm) (Wow - this is starting to sound like an "X" rated advertisement! LOL) as it was when I sized them.

    I have also given up on commercial case resizing lubes. I "finger apply" a light coating of STP on all my cases when I

    resize them, even when reforming to other calibres, without a problem. I've had case dents when I wasn't careful, but

    that's my own fault. Wish I had another 30-30, as I have a large supply of 31141 hard cast bullets ready for sizing.

    Sold my model 94 in 30-30 a LONG time ago. (sigh) Now I'm looking for a mold for 25 cal, for Grandad's 25-35 Win.

    (Model 94)

    I expect to be able to shoot it quite a lot this coming summer. The Old Reliable lube should work quite well in .25!



    The_Doctor

  16. #216
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    the stp has quite a bit of polybutene in it, that is the sticky and the slippery.
    polybutene is the big secret in lots of boolit lubes and in case lubes too.
    remember the old roller pads and the lube they used?
    that was polybutene that gave them the sticky slippery too.

  17. #217
    Boolit Master Eutectic's Avatar
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    Sadly, current STP has been 'cut' a lot. Current Vasoline is 'cut' too much as well. Modern refining fractionates or strips a lot of the "goodies" for use in other products and more $$$ for them, and gives us a narrow range product compared to say 50 years ago.

    I had a quart of Standard Oil 'Alta-Vis 215' that finally went bad on me. It was over 50 years old. Older STP was this fraction with a few additives extra in small %. We sold many a tank car of Alta-Vis 215 to Studebaker Corp. who offered the first STP oil treatment. IF I could still get that old STP I'd use it along with Dexron III for the 'oil' in my lube. These days I prefer a good quality chain bar lube (with naphthenic base) in my lube formulas rather than current day STP.

    Eutectic

  18. #218
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    notice eutetic said napthenic base oil, not a poa [oil] type.
    vasoline has changed over the years and i [and a few others] have been looking for a suitable replacement.

  19. #219
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    Polyalphaolephins are a man-made molecule, very consistent in size and shape, which makes oils with very uniform viscosity characteristics in all temps, but also makes them tough to blend. POE's are ester oils as opposed to olefins. The napthenics are natural petroleum oils that have had the waxes cracked out of them and have been fractionated to a gnat's ****, essentially a manual way of making a PAO out of natural stuff without engineering it from scratch.

    One thing I think we've been missing in our lubes is the "grey matter", the various-length carbon chains all blended together and representing the range of molecules from hard waxes to thin oil. All that molecule variety makes a tougher, more homogenous, better bonded soft wax in my thinking, which is why it's such a shame that petroleum is so super-refined these days.

    A good refinery detective could put the pieces together again and find a variety of products we could use to make a good Vaseline again.

    Gear

  20. #220
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    yeah,, a yin/yang wax blend similar to what carnuba red uses could be mixed up.
    hopefully it could be reproduced again from the feedstock.
    you'd need something like a 50 on the penetration test then a 70,and a 125,135,and something on the real soft end..
    plus you'd have to find different melt temps to blend them to go liquid around the 100-f melt temp base, just to get started.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check