Lee Enfield 2 groove barrels

[LAGS]

The NOE 316299 solved my Keyholeing issues with a Long Branch

[WineMan]

My Remington 1903A3 with a 1944 2 groove barrel likes the last Group Buy Fattest 30 "Loverin" design sized at 314. With 16 of AL 2400 I have put five shots into one hole at 25 yards and they will hover around 1.5" at 100 yards. Holding at 100 with my eyes and issue sights is the main impediment to accuracy.

Dave

[Stoats]

Holy Thread Necromancy, Batman!

Anyway, I was getting set up to start casting for my 1943 Longbranch, so I slugged it. I hadn't paid attention to the bore up to that point (aside from noting it's clean and shiny), and would you Adam and Eve it, it's a 2 groove. .304" on the lands, .317 in the grooves. I also measured the widths of the grooves - .115" each, giving us about 24% groove to 76% land.

Now, I can answer quite easily the question of why the 2-grooves are deeper.

If you take the official drawing of Enfield-profile rifling, it's 5 grooves and 5 lands, all of equal width. Lands run at .303", grooves at .313" (which is why so many people have a bad time with the generally-believed .311 - such tight bores are rare beasts indeed, and most run over the .313" spec. Cos they can with the way Mk.VII ammo is designed to set up).

So, your absolutely-to-spec 5-groover has an average bore diameter of .308". My 2-groover has an average bore diameter of .307", which within the tolerances that we expect from L-E barrels, is close enough for government work.

So we'll end up with a similar amount of swaging at a similar pressure (even if the bullet is behaving a little differently and displacing material outwards into the deeper grooves) and hence similar chamber pressure, similar muzzle velocity and so on.

An interesting solution! And obvious after the fact!

Right. As for casting, I suspect that I can't expect the bullet to fill the grooves, so I'm going to go for .318", GC and powder coat it, and see what it does.

[leebuilder]

That's all I do. Drop the bolt and see what happens. I have two 2 groove LE. One the savage is less than perfect barrel I actually rechambered and reset the barrel, one groove has leading the other is clean, this rifle shoots quite well j-thingys and cast. The other a long branch is quite clean and in better shape, this rifle likes certain loads and only expelles cast fliers and keyholes.
Good luck

[ballkeeper]

Shame the link not working.
I have a 2 grove 4 1star it slug at .318 in grove and want to shoot cast .which mould would be best /cheapest way . Using range lead .
Thanks

[arlon]

I have a 2 groove Smith Corona and it measures .308. Most accurate cast lead shooter I own.

[303Guy]

I have a mint 2-groove (Longbranch) sporter with scope that needs to be tested with cast or paper patch. It's waiting on a suppressor.

[vzerone]

Not wanting to sound bias, but the U.S. two groove are a little more conductive to accuracy due to the way they differ in how much of the bore the lands use up and how much the grooves use up. I know that doesn't help any of you to reload for them, just saying is all.

Those long nose bore riders shoot good in them if the nose fits correctly. The 314299/311299 is an example. The fellow that has the .317 groove is going to have to find a fat bullet. The largest diameter bullet that will still let the cartridge chamber is the way to go and insure that the nose isn't too fat.

[LAGS]

Now you guys have made me want to take out my 1943 Long Branch and see what it does with Cast.
I tried Cast a few years back, but they Keyholed with Mouse Fart Loads and underized boolits.
Now that I have molds that will fit, and I PC my Boolits. ,I think it is time to give it another go.
But they Keyholed less with Harder Lead like Lino, and Monotype.
But the rifle is pretty good with Surplus ammo that does fire and Or the Bullet and powder loaded into a Boxer Primed case .

[303Guy]

I mentioned earlier in this thread (years ago) that I've shot cast in my rust textured two groove Longbranch. It wasn't accurate but the 217gr smooth side patched boolits I was firing went nose first. I also fired plain cast 225gr smooth sides but the rough bore half sheared the rifling ridges so I never range tested it. Now I just happen to have another Longbranch with a mint bore - the one I mentioned above. The whole rifle is mint in fact. It has been 'sporterized' by bubba - even being crowned by file. That's the one I want to try plain cast in. Other than that I have a good five groove No4 barrel on a 1902 MLE action that has been reasonably sporterised. The barrel is full length but the bayonet lugs have been turned off. That did shoot cast quite well when I tested it years ago.

Oh yeah, I have yet another two-groove, a Maltby this time. The barrel is untouched but the bore is a little 'worn' and rust damaged. It looks suspiciously like it needs to have the end bit of the barrel cut off to get a clean crown but that's not what I want to do. I would like to restore it to original (the fore end has been 'doctored' just a tad). For now I might try cast or even paper patched to see how it shoots. Otherwise I'll test it with j-words.

[JMax]

I had a Savage No4 Mk1 2 groove barrel that I could not get cast to shoot well. I was offered more than I paid for it and replaced it with a 1944 Long Branch with a 5 groove barrel. .312 sized NOE 314-202 bullets exhibited a hint of yaw at 100 yards but that disappeared when sized to .313 and I will change out the sizing die to .314 today. I had to re-crown the barrel and finished optimizing the dies yesterday and off to the range Friday as it will be a bit warmer then at about 38F.

[bruce drake]

Shame the link not working.
I have a 2 grove 4 1star it slug at .318 in grove and want to shoot cast .which mould would be best /cheapest way . Using range lead .
Thanks

https://www.remingtonsociety.org/rem...roove-rifling/
They updated links at the site.

[bruce drake]

I've found either of the Lyman Loverin 8mm bullets (323470 & 323471) to be excellent performers in such oversized 2 groove .303s along with over groove size 7.7 japs and 7.62x54Rs. For the .303s I GC and lube (all the lube groves) at .325 and push through Lee sizers of .316 or .318 (both honed out from .314 sizers). If larger is needed then the Lyman .321 H&I is used.

Larry Gibson

I have a Herters 320176 mold that casts a spitzer copy (176gr) of the 8x57I jacketed bullet from WWI era that I resize down to .316 for my fat Enfield barrels and T99 Arisaka with its Metford rifling. It took both wall hanger rifles into accurate rifles again.

Bruce