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Thread: 6.5x55 mm

  1. #21
    Boolit Buddy
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    i forgot... linstrum,
    how much of that imr powder 5010 did you put in the casing , and with or without filler?

  2. #22
    Boolit Master Nobade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geargnasher View Post
    Now that I got a push-through adapter from The Perfesser I can finally push-through size to .259" without bending boolits, PP and Swede, here I come!

    What paper did you use for those, onionskin? Do you remember the OAL? My CM mould drops boolits .265" on the nose and .2715" on the bands with wheel weight alloy.

    I also have the 266673, but wish I'd bought the 266469 to, as as well as the BRP 268469.

    Gear
    Gear
    Hi Gear,
    I have been in Texas shooting in the highpower silhouette state match, just got back.

    I do use the Papermill 9# onionskin paper. Wet wrapped, and lubed with my usual beeswax/vaseline mix. I don't remember the OAL, but it isn't very long. The boolit I have is pretty fat and my chamber pretty fresh so it's not as long as normal ball ammo. I forget the exact load but it was enough so the powder and filler will stop the boolit (very light neck tension thanks to the Lee collet die) and it engraves hard into the lands. I would like to seat it out more since the base of the boolit is well down into the case but it can't go out any further. I suppose your powder charge will be determined by the rifle's throat. Can't overload the Swede with Retumbo, so it's safe to experiment with.

    I hope yours works as well as mine has been, it's a real kick to see cast boolits working so well in that rifle after years of dismal failures!

    -Nobade

  3. #23
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    Thanks Nobade, I'm going to play with that soon when I get past a couple of other projects since I have a pound of Retumbo I don't have any other use for.

    Gear

  4. #24
    Boolit Master Linstrum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwin41 View Post
    i forgot... linstrum,
    how much of that imr powder 5010 did you put in the casing , and with or without filler?
    For the 140 grain SAECO projectile I use 46 grains IMR 5010 without filler.

    I wrote in my loading notes that 48 grains causes flyers and key-holing with that particular boolit.

    rl 1119
    ~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+
    There is no such thing as too many tools, especially when it comes to casting and reloading.
    Howard Hughes said: "He who has the tools rules".

    Safe casting and shooting!

    Linstrum, member F.O.B.C. (Fraternal Order of Boolit Casters), Shooters.com alumnus, and original alloutdoors.com survivor.

  5. #25
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    Question

    hello
    i just got back from the range to try out this rifle.
    as mentioned , i only have some factory prvi partizan ammo so far.
    the rifle handles great and is still accurate , in fact VERY accurate.

    been comparing some powder in advance , im also looking for a commonly available
    powder here in holland.
    so far im comparing vithavouri n 560 , accurate 3100 .
    i dont know wich one is the bulkier powder , maby someone has a comment on this?
    these two powders are mentioned in the reloadingbook , for the 140 gr j-bullet.
    i also took a look at the burningcharts , and i noticed a accurate 8700 powder,
    wich is about the slowest burning powder.
    in holland these accurate powders are much cheaper than other brands like vithavouri , alliant , imr etc. , dont know about the quality of the AA powders though.
    the starting volume of powder VV 560 and AA 3100 is about the same , some 40gr
    in the posts ive read so far it is mentioned to choose the most slow powder, so im kind of leaning towards the AA 8700 powder , but cannot find a reload data .
    would it be safe to start out with some 40 gr of the AA 8700 ?

  6. #26
    Boolit Master Nobade's Avatar
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    AA8700 is certainly safe to use in any amount you can fit into a 6.5x55 case. But it will produce low velocities and a large amount of unburnt powder. AA3100 is a better choice - it is not ball powder like 8700 but rather large sticks. I find it shoots quite well in my '96 Mauser under 130 grain boolits (paper patched of course). I haven't tried it under the 175gr. ones, a bit slower powder is indicated for those.

  7. #27
    Boolit Master Linstrum's Avatar
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    Hi, edwin41, I use AA powders and I don't have any complaints. I haven't heard of any complaints, either.

    Nobade has some good info.

    As I recall AA8700 is the same as H870 and WC870. H870/WC870 is one of the powders used for the U.S. Military 20mm Vulcan canon that is the business end of the Phalanx Defense System. H870/WC870 is slightly slower than IMR 5010 and if AA8700 is the same as H870/WC870, then I would say that 40 grains AA8700 would be a very low starting load for the 140 grain bullet for the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser. When small amounts of very slow powders are used, powder ignition is erratic and combustion is incomplete so that a lot of un-burned powder grains remain in the cartridge and rifle barrel. The usual practice is to carefully work up a load until the powder grains burn completely or high pressure signs become evident. With my own personal experience with the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser, I got unsafe pressure with large amounts of some very slow powders, including IMR 5010. This is because the 6.5x55 has a large powder capacity with a small bore diameter. IMR 5010 is completely safe when not over loaded. I would not be afraid to use AA8700, just make sure of its burn rate first.

    I have used H870/WC870 with the 140 grain boolit in the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser, but it was 10 years ago and I don't recall what results I got. My loading notes say that I used 51 grains of WC870 with the 140 grain boolit and nothing bad happened. So, the main thing is to determine if AA8700 is the same as H870 and WC870. If AA8700 is the same as H870/WC870, then start with 44 grains with a 140 grain projectile.


    I use a lot of WC870 for 7.62x54R Russian and .30-06 for 180 grain cast boolits because all you need to do to load those cartridges is pour 4 grains IMR 4895 over the flash hole in the cartridge, fill to the mouth with WC870, and then press in the boolit for a compressed load. The purpose of the 4 grains of IMR 4895 is to boost the ignition so that all of the very slow powder burns. If the load is not boosted it leaves a lot of scorched powder in the barrel. Scorched powder grains are called "mummies", and as far as I can tell they don't cause problems unless they fall down into the action and jam things so they don't work.

    Good Luck!

    rl 1123
    Last edited by Linstrum; 05-09-2012 at 11:13 PM.
    ~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+~+:/&\:+
    There is no such thing as too many tools, especially when it comes to casting and reloading.
    Howard Hughes said: "He who has the tools rules".

    Safe casting and shooting!

    Linstrum, member F.O.B.C. (Fraternal Order of Boolit Casters), Shooters.com alumnus, and original alloutdoors.com survivor.

  8. #28
    Boolit Buddy
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    so , after a lot of reading i think ill have a good startingpoint now.
    the mould still hasn t come in yet , but im gathering information as much as i can.
    i think my startingpoint will be the casted bullet , 140 gr lyman 266469,
    powdercharge for starters would be 37 gr vithavouri n 160 , mabey dacron filler,
    paperpatch would be printingpaper , as mentioned as chain paper.
    bullet with patch sized a little over bore diameter , little beeswax / vaseline lube.
    sounds like a good startingpoint?

    yet another question
    over here it gains some popularity for shooting with highly tuned down loads.
    i believe it found its way here from gemany , used in indoor short distance matches.
    they shoot a casted bullet , gaschecked , at some 1400 to 1600 ft/sec.

    the question now would be if i can use the same paperpatched bullet as described
    to make a plinking cartridge , for indoor use.
    im thinking of some 11 grains of unique powder.
    or is a gascheck better for these plinking loads ?
    would i have to use the dacron filler with these loads?

  9. #29
    Boolit Master pdawg_shooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwin41 View Post
    so , after a lot of reading i think ill have a good startingpoint now.
    the mould still hasn t come in yet , but im gathering information as much as i can.
    i think my startingpoint will be the casted bullet , 140 gr lyman 266469,
    powdercharge for starters would be 37 gr vithavouri n 160 , mabey dacron filler,
    paperpatch would be printingpaper , as mentioned as chain paper.
    bullet with patch sized a little over bore diameter , little beeswax / vaseline lube.
    sounds like a good startingpoint?

    yet another question
    over here it gains some popularity for shooting with highly tuned down loads.
    i believe it found its way here from gemany , used in indoor short distance matches.
    they shoot a casted bullet , gaschecked , at some 1400 to 1600 ft/sec.

    the question now would be if i can use the same paperpatched bullet as described
    to make a plinking cartridge , for indoor use.
    im thinking of some 11 grains of unique powder.
    or is a gascheck better for these plinking loads ?
    would i have to use the dacron filler with these loads?
    It will work fine...but, why? Lubed naked bullets will do what you want. The "magic" of paper patching is getting jacketed velocity and accuracy with zero chance of leading.
    45 AUTO! Because having to shoot someone twice is just silly!

  10. #30
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    yes pdawg , i agree that the purpose of the paperpatch is to shoot a cast bullet
    at very high speeds , but my thinking was that if i had some pp bullets ready at hand , i can make the plinkers and the full power cartridges .
    if my intention was to shoot at low velocities i have to make the casts way harder
    and add a gascheck.
    i find it a real nice bonus i can go from low to very high speeds with the same
    alloy , bulletmould and patch.

  11. #31
    Boolit Buddy
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    hello
    the bulletmould came in 2 days ago , so now i have some measurements..
    the bullet as it drops out of the lyman mould is 6.66 mm , or 0.262 " in diameter.
    tried some patching , and with the suggested chainbar printer paper i wrapped twice around the unsized bullet i got a 6.91 mm or 0.272 "diameter.
    with ordinairy printerpaper i got 7.01 mm or 0.275" diameter.
    the bullets i casted for a try out are a alloy of lead and tin , according to my lyman reloadbook
    it should be around ten bhn... where as pure lead would be around five bhn.
    really like this alloy , i use it in my revolver cartridges , bulletmould fill is very good , and the bullets come out sharp and shiny , plus i like mine to be soft.
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  12. #32
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    i also took some measurements from a factory cartridge and a fired casing..
    the factory one measures on the outside of the neck 7.35 mm or 0.289 ".
    the bullet has a diameter of 6.63 mm or 0.261 " [prvi partizan].

    the fired one measures on the outside of the neck 7.58 mm or 0.298 ".
    the inside measures 6.73mm or 0.265".

    the reason for this measurements are that i ideally would want to leave the
    fired brass as it came out with as little as possible sizing etc etc..

    i also put a piece of paper for rolling sigarettes around one of my castings and put it in a fired case , just a little and then let the bolt lock it up.
    the total lenght of this cartridge was 72.4 mm or 2.850 ".
    for this bullet lyman gives a overall lenght of 2.925", so my measure could be incorrect , will measure again when sized properly.
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  13. #33
    Boolit Buddy
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    now i have never slugged a barrel , so there was some confusion how to do it.
    i started with a oiled casted bullet , wich i tapped in my barrel muzzle side.
    went okay , but was not good enough for measurement.

    i took a piece of aluminum i had laying around and drilled a hole of 6.8 mm through.
    now i melted some pure lead and poured it in .
    when cooled of i got this "slug" wich i carefully tapped in my barrel from muzzle side.
    didnt got far in because the lead bumped up so it wouldt not go further in.
    none the less i got my measurements.
    my thinking would be that its best to slug at the muzzleside , cause here the barrel should have the less wear on it... after all , the barrel is from 1967.
    the slug measured groove : 6.68 mm or 0.263".
    bore : 6.43 mm or 0.253".
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    Last edited by edwin41; 06-10-2012 at 04:53 PM. Reason: wrong spelling

  14. #34
    Boolit Buddy
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    so now i have read pdawgs posting again...
    very good tips there i must add .
    my bullet as it drops from the mould is 0.262 " and needs to be reduced to
    0.254 " , then wrapped twice in printingpaper and a final sizing to 0. 264 or 0.266.
    my fired case has a inside neck diameter of 0.265 ".
    so it hink i will size my bullets to 0.264 " , as i read here that the paper will bump up a bit .
    so then i wouldnt have to touch my brass at all , just clean and reprime it , put some powder in , set the bullet with my thumb and let the bold do the final seating !
    looks almost to good to me ..

    by the way , i must add that the lyman reloadingbook gives a 0.264 " for castbullets
    in this caliber and are very spot on !

    what would be your thinking on this combination ?

  15. #35
    Boolit Grand Master
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    My view is that you'll need to do A LOT of down-sizing of your slug before wrapping the existing boolits. Why not start with a 25 caliber boolit (nominal .257") and wrap it up to .265" with 9# airmail paper?
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  16. #36
    Boolit Buddy
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    you got me there ...
    i actually don t know if i could size my bullet so far down.
    its kind of soft at 10 bhn , so it could be done i think.

    hmm... i need to look into this

  17. #37
    Boolit Buddy
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    this evening i tried to make a sizer to see if it would work to size the bullets down
    that far , i ended up with sticking bullets in the sizer , they bump up and get stuck.
    i dont know if its even possible to size down so far.
    would a factory sizer do the trick ?
    would it be better to "shave "the bullets ?
    anyone with opinions on this matter?

    input is much appreciated.

    btw.. i looked into the .25 bullets as suggested , but the available ones are not the desired shape and weight.

  18. #38
    Boolit Master Nobade's Avatar
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    I bought a .258" Lee sizer from Ranch Dog, and attacked it with 320 grit sandpaper on a split dowel. Finally worked up to 600 grit, it now takes a .269" boolit to .259" with no problem if I lube them on a RCBS case lube pad. As delivered, it did what yours is doing - boolit riveted and stuck in the bore. It needs to be super smooth and used with lube.

    Recently I heard about using Flitz polish after honing one out. I haven't tried that yet but I'd imagine it would help.

  19. #39
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    thanks nobade , at least i know now it can be done !
    i will try to smooth my homemade die a little , and see wat happens!

  20. #40
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    Extream sizing

    I had the same problem in sizeing in sizeing 8mm bullets down to .314 and sizeing .315 bullets down to .306. They stuck with most of the lubes I tried. I did find that a rubbed on coat of regular bullet lube (alox/beesewax) or even better Lyman Super Molly bullet lube allowed the bullets to size without great effort. The Super Molly even allowed copper jacketed bullets to be sized to a great extent. Your sizer needs to be a long taper for best results. Give this a try.It cost you nothing and may get you going right away.
    n.h.schmidt












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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check