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Thread: VdoMemorie-Blazing Sabot!

  1. #41
    The Brass Man Four-Sixty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Thanks for sharing your test results. You raise some great questions and we all get to learn along with you.

    I enjoy searching for a good slug combination myself. Your suggestiong of the nitro card (also reinforced by 35 Remington) placed under the Lee slug has greatly improved my accuracy. You saved me a lot of frustration. Thanks!
    “Useful undertakings which require sustained attention and vigorous precision in order to succeed often end up by being abandoned, for, in America, as elsewhere, the people move forward by sudden impulses and short-lived efforts.”

    Alexis de Tocqueville

    The human mind has a primitive ego defense mechanism that negates all realities that produce too much stress for the brain to handle. It's called denial.

    "Inferno" Dan Brown

  2. #42
    Good morning Tree Rats, first of all let me thank you for your positive comments, do need them from time to time to continue the efforts required into this project!
    I always said "we are a warm family of slug shooters"
    We are here to learn from each other and share our Good, Bad and not so good experiances,
    so others can learn from it and take it from that point on and move further in the right direction!

    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots

  3. #43
    Good morning,

    1. In my test where I loaded 37 gr of Longshot behind 450 grain bullet in sabot, using PC OP wad
    and .125 nitro of 20 gauge to fill the gap of OP wad topped by .170 darker nitro card gave hard
    extraction with extraction mark!
    this picture to show you how I put the PC wad and .125 nitro of 20 gauge and then .170 darker nitro together.

    2. 37 gr of Longshot with the same wad set up but this time with 380 grain bullet was going much
    faster and we found the sabot some 10 yards wide open! The hull had little extraction marks, we
    had used Fiocchi clear hulls!

    3. 37 gr of Longshot with the same OP wad set up but this time with 320 grains bullet, the
    extraction was easy with no problems.

    Please keep in mind all testing was done with a Savage F210 12 ga shotgun with a 24 inch rifled barrel
    measuring .910" at muzzle!
    I have other hulls from Win., Rem., etc but they are already used ( Fired ) and the hull mouth will not accept my OP wads that are full bore size and not under size and collapse the hull mouth with my Lee Load all and my Mec Grabber.

    New Fed. hull with Fed.209A magnum primers coming this week.
    Lets see if I can make it to the range as its all wet from rain and wondering if the chrono will work with the weather being so cloudy!
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots

  4. #44
    Since its been raining for the last 3 days, holding our tests back due to not being bright enough for the Chronograph to work well, but then
    God All-mighty was busy making his grass greener and making his New Jersey landscape more colorful by providing water to the plants.
    In the mean time the new extractor has not arrived from Savage rendering the Savage F210 shotgun useless, we went to pick up the Browning A Bolt for some $1249 cameo.

    Browning A Bolt:
    1. The Browning looks very good and guess what it has a 1/4 inch wide extractor that will pull out just about any stuck shell out.
    2. The bolt handle knob was very narrow and did not feel very sturdy as it dug into my hands when I opened the bolt!
    2. The barrels have open sights, very good but are only 22 inch and I am not ready to sacrifice
    any velocity at this point when every one wants faster loads ( some 50 to 70 fps )

    Savage 212:
    1. The Savage newer model 212 looked good also and I noticed the recoil pad was very nice and soft unlike my F210 which had a hard plastic plate and a "Accu Trigger" as ice-cream on the cake. The box magazine is a good feature only wish it was made of metal!
    2. The bolt handle is a different design and requires much more lift to open the bolt, very comfortable as the knob is just like the F210.
    To me the F210 bolt looks like its made much stronger and havier than the newer bolt, do not have the lift the bolt too much to open, all they needed was to re design the extractor, to a much wider design and make it of stainless steel and get rid of the undercut on the bolt face where the soft hull brass is flowing into to cause extraction issues.
    3. Barrel is 24 inch long as I wanted but sadly no open sights and measured .910" at muzzle!

    If only Savage had changed the extractor to a wider stronger one and put open sights on my F210 along with Accu Trigger, I would have gladly called it my "Savage A bolt rifled shotgun"

    The weather is opening up and it looks like we might be able to make it to the range some 40 miles from my home!
    Until then.
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots
    Last edited by SuperBlazingSabots; 05-03-2012 at 12:26 PM.

  5. #45
    Greetings, did not have a good day at the range, see it for yourself

    I had a lot of even more heavier loads but since they kept rapturing I had to stop, the chrono worked fine even tho it was not very bright!
    Let me make it very clear each powder charge was checked in 3 different scales so as to avoid any chances of errors!
    Through all my tests I keep coming to the conclusion the hulls are the weakest link!
    The fired primers all look Ok and show no sign of over pressure

    I find this lazer bore sighter a very usefull tool,I do have the arbor type ones but this is a very usefull tool and you can pick 1 up for $25 from Amazon!
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots

  6. #46
    Good morning, my Fed. hull, OP wads and darker harder nitro card shipment just arrived.
    I was inspecting the raptured hulls I noticed the rapture was always on the right side where the extractor broke off and each hull measured 7/16 wide by 7/16 long in rapture. The hull are suppose to be fully supported by the chamber, I pushed my little finger into the chamber on the right side, and there it was a cut out into my barrel chamber, seems like it was meant to accomodate a much wider extractor, same thing like the Browning A bolt OR could my barrel be made for Browning and by mistake got shipped to Savage by mistake OR Savage makes the barrels for Browning A bolt and a wrong barrel was fitted into my Savage F210
    If you have a Savage bolt action then can you please push your little finger on the right side in the chamber right where the extractor cut out is and pass it and see if the cut out is much bigger!
    My new Savage 212 does not have any such cut and the hull is fully enclosed in the chamber!
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots

  7. #47
    Slug Master
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    I talked to Ajay and it is a defect in the chamber where the metal
    isn't there in extractor area on the right side to support case,
    The cutouts for extractors , and there is one on left
    also, are on the outside tapering in to the back. So the inside should be
    a completely round chamber supporting case in the extractor areas
    all the way back to the front of the rim. Ed

  8. #48
    Boolit Master

    tomme boy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Clinton, Iowa
    Sounds like you blew it out when the shell that was shot when your extractor broke. Better give Savage a call to have a new barrel put on.

  9. #49
    Good morning, can't use the new gun as my Nikon ProStaff 3-9X scope, my Bushnell BDC or my Tasco 3-12X will not fit the new Savage 212 as you need longer scopes with 6 inch inner tubes. No open sights on the barrel either.

    You have to lift the bolt way up
    almost touching the scope to pull the bolt back, the older 210F was far better and the bolt was much more stronger and well made, all they needed to do was re-do the extractor, add Accu Trigger, add the new box magazine made of metal, add open sights and make the entire gun of stainless steel so I could have called it my :
    "Savage 210FA Bolt"
    I would have gladly paid more for my Savage 210F "A" Bolt.
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots
    Last edited by SuperBlazingSabots; 05-08-2012 at 02:49 PM.

  10. #50
    Greetings, we have been busy testing various loads, sabot combo's at the range, the manufacturers quote their velocity from a 30 inch test barrel. My testing was suppose to be all done with a over the counter 24 in barrels that most shooters have, unfortunately the test gun got damaged and the second replacement is only 22 inch barrel, causing the velocity # to be even lower.
    The Handloader magazine #267 of August 2010 had an artical on slugs by John Haviland
    he mentions this loading data

    look at the last two lines as he says flying sabots and wads are fetal to chronographs, all velocities quoted are from manufacturers, scared to use his own chrono!
    We on the other hand want true and fair results and here are some pictures to show what all goes on the range!

    My son Amit who was there said I'll thake the pictures of the flying sabots, I thought he is crazy as I did not have a high speed camera, but I was shocked to see him taking pictures of the sabots flying in the air!

    Design changes being made right now and I just got the bullet molds for 20 ga sabots to check and measure for size etc, work in full swing!
    We will be coming out with various choices of sabots in 12 and 20 gauge.
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots

  11. #51
    Greetings, I just got into 20 gauge Blazing-Sabot loading and testing and find the 20 gauge so amazing and it really feels like a Large Bore Nitro Express, that it makes me wonder how come I missed out on this wonderful calibre and the fun that goes along with it.
    I am putting all the pieces together and the stainless steel Savage being built at Savage for delivery in a week, before the plant shuts down for summer vacation.
    Looking to pick up a used but reasonable 20 gauge loader, but not a single stage 600, perhaps a Grabber, on the look out for it.

    I still need a Lyman 20 ga roll crimper like this one:

    We found some nice bullets and certain wads that just fit perfectly for size etc

    if you were to look carefully you'll find a .125 nitro card of 28 ga in wad below the slug a perfect fit!

    The only powder giving 1600+ fps seems to be 4227

    Can't wait to load them and test them on the range!
    You all have a wonderful day!
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots
    Last edited by SuperBlazingSabots; 06-20-2013 at 05:28 PM.

  12. #52
    Greetings, I resently got involved in 20 gauge and was on the look out for a loading machine to test our new Blazing Sabots, well we finally got it:

    I have the Mec Grabber in 12 gauge but found another Hornady in 12 ga and even tho I did not need it in 12 ga I jumped at it so now I have 2 Hornady's in 12 and 20 gauge.
    Still on the look out for a 20 ga Lyman roll crimper!
    Suppose to be at the range first thing in the morning to try out newer combo sabots!
    Will report back!
    You all have a great one!
    Video Memories
    VdoMemorie's-Blazing Sabots

  13. #53
    Greetings, the weather was nice and cloudy, at the range we were getting 1702 fps with a 450 gr slug in sabot, no sign of over pressure

    I am rally starting to like 6 point fold crimp, consistancy
    in the crimp for better cumbustion is very important, the bullets must be seated all the way
    at the base.
    The 391 grain bullet that I really like in sabot gave 1705 fps

    this bullet mold was modefied from a 450 gr mold, for some reason it was not locked-in
    well so it jumped at launch and as it hit the free bore, it dug 1/4 inch into the base of the sabot
    yet giving 1705 fps, I need to try a lighter bullet for faster velocity!

    I was hoping to do all my test from 24 inch barrel but all I have now are 22 inch barrels for testing
    so these velocities are from 22 inch rifled barrels!
    The Federal hulls with Fed. 209A magnum primers were used and no pressure signs, what so ever
    were visible, in the past we had extraction issues, extractor marks from Fiocchi hulls!

    To protect our chronograph from flying sabots and nitro cards, we use wooden dowels instead of metal rods!
    Its a good idea to use good quality hull for testing, once your testing is done then you can switch over to cheaper hulls!
    I keep forgetting to mention that we have been playing with the Lyman 525 slug in wad on the side and have so far
    got 1562 fps with 2 3/4 Fed hull, Fed 209, 45 gr of A. Steel, Fed.12S-4 with a .125 inch nitro card of 16 gauge right below the slug
    and put some wad pressure, for a perfect 6 point fold crimp, now we all know the wad has a powder seeping problem so cut a 1 inch
    square from any photo copy paper and push it down the throat on top of the powder with a .626" wooden dowel before you put the wad etc.
    We got 1574 fps with 3" Fiocchi, Fio 616, 40 gr of A. Steel with 1 inch paper on top of the powder followed by Fed.12S-3 purple wad with a .125 nitro card of 16 gauge
    put some wad pressure followed by a roll crimp, until it touches the slug! Now do not underestimate these loads as they are very deadly and powerful!
    Please use the above loads at your own risk!
    More testing yet to be done as the 20 ga gun and loader is on the way!
    VdoMemories-Blazing Sabots
    Last edited by SuperBlazingSabots; 06-20-2012 at 09:49 AM. Reason: Instead of writing a new post I keep adding new idea's

  14. #54
    Greetings, the new stainless steel Savage 220 just arrived and the EGW #41110 scope base,
    the gun does come with 2 piece bases but none of my scopes fit.

    the barrel rifling is much better on the stainless barrel!
    The barrel is free floated the entire length, the barrel to stock fit is nothing to brag about, the AccuTrigger is good, the recoil pad is great, box magazine very good, tho I wish it was made of metal!
    Over all the gun is good and if you are looking to get a 20 gauge, go for the stainless steel version!
    Can't wait to try it on the range, got all the components except the Hornady progressive loader which should arrive in 2 to 3 days, I just might still load some shells and go to the range without crimping as I am still looking for a roll crimper in 20 gauge, a Lyman version just like my 12 gauge one, I love it!
    VdoMemories-Blazing Sabots

  15. #55

    Blammer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Asheville, NC
    if you get those trap commander wads and the 58 cal minnies to work let me know.

  16. #56
    Hello Blammer, just finished loading a bunch of 20 ga Blazing-Sabot slugs with a good choice of bullets at hand for 12 and 20 gauge!
    Here is a picture for you:

    The 20 gauge loads with Longshot, Blue Dot, Hs-6, 4756 and 2400 powder!
    All loads in 3 inch hulls, some using Fed. 209A while other using regular primers,
    have been busy making adjustments to the Hornady 20 ga loader for 3 inch!
    VdoMemories-Blazing Sabots

  17. #57
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Ajay, what's the diameter of those bullets?

  18. #58
    Hello Al,

    As promised earlier, I would not choose any bullet for the Blazing-Sabot if the mold is going to cost more than $19,
    each and every bullet mold cost $18 plus change at MidSouth!

    VdoMemories-Blazing Sabots
    Last edited by SuperBlazingSabots; 06-20-2013 at 05:30 PM.

  19. #59
    Greetings, just been to the range testing our new 20 gauge baby and did hit a few home runs!

    Yes, those are flying sabots and wads from our testing today shot with a high speed camera, next time we will do better!
    In the past the clear 1 ga. Fiocchi hulls were found to be a bit on the soft side for our hot load testing, but the new shipment of 3 inch Brown Fiocchi did surprise me

    I'll be placing yet another order for them first thing in the morning,this load of 390 gr bullet in our sabot showed no sign of pressure and I will push the loading envelop a bit further to 1825fps from a 22 inch barrel, mind you!
    The Rem. Premier AccuTip claims to give 1850 fps for 385 gr bullet rom a 30 inch test barrel!
    For me and my friends its a homerun!
    Every test that we do helps us custom tailor our loads for better load efficiency through constant testing!
    I'm still going through todays data and will up date you all!
    Thank you.
    VdoMemories-Blazing Sabots
    Last edited by SuperBlazingSabots; 06-26-2012 at 07:51 PM.

  20. #60

    Blammer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Asheville, NC
    so what order did you load all that stuff in the 20ga?

    which of the above projectiles did you use?

    what distance was the target shot at?

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check