Is my hand annealing technique OK?

[Typecaster]

I've never been a fanatic about case annealing, but am thinking maybe I should be.

My technique is pretty simple—I rotate the case with my fingers, holding the neck of the case in the flame, then drop the case into a bucket of water. It's really no different than flame polishing the end of glass tubing, a skill I had to learn when I was a glassblower. I've never had a problem keeping the case neck centered in the flame until it shows color, and it seems more uniform than trying to tip the case over into a tray of water. Trying to dip case mouths into molten lead seems silly…and definitely warm.

Before anyone gets excited about overheating the base, I've never had the base get too hot to hold, or even warm.

As an extreme example, I was given over 500 .38 Special REM-UMC cases that had been loaded multiple times. The first time I loaded some I had some mouth splits on firing. I annealed the balance and haven't had any problems since. Even those short cases didn't get too warm to hold.

I use the same technique for annealing cases for my .25/222 Copperhead when forming from .223 military, and obviously there's no problem with the larger cases.

Do I really need to build/buy a mechanized annealing machine? My technique has worked for over 35 years. Is it broke and I don't know it?

Thanks,

Richard

[GP100man]

It ain`t broke !!! & don`t fix it !!!

Been doing the same thing for 28yrs or so , but have found the brass really does`nt need much heat to relieve the tension.

Here`s a batch of 357 mag & ya barely can see the color change ,but it went rite back to shooting better groups (I can`t say good groups) !

I chuck my lee trimmer in a cordless drill & turn it in the flame on low , no quench.

[Chicken Thief]

The water is not needed, just adds a drying step to the proces.
The rest is what i do.

[John Boy]

Is it broke and I don't know it?

Richard - Nope! The fastest, easiest way to anneal without buying & using all the gizmos's. Have done 100's this way

[P.K.]

There are a few video's on youtube on the subject. One cat over there uses a socket and a drill to turn the cases in front of a torch. If I were doing 3gun or another form of volume shooting I'd consider building my own machine but as GP100 said "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

[jmorris]

Do I really need to build/buy a mechanized annealing machine?

If your happy, you don't. Consistancy varies from person to person with your method, so results will too. I didn't build a machine to anneal until I had more cases than I wanted to handle. My machine is in a sticky at the top of this forum. Once loaded and set runs itself with no input from a person other than dumping more cases into the hopper from time to time.

[DLCTEX]

I have been using a drill and a socket in an adapter for years. Select a socket that accepts the brass closely but easily. A short socket for pistol and short rifle and a deep socket for longer cases. Turn the case while heating in the flame of a torch until color change, then dump into water to stop the heat from migrating to the body or head of the case. Do not heat the brass to a red color, just a blue/black of the neck area.

[Moonie]

I've not started annealing yet but I've heard of using your lead pot, anyone have experience doing it that way?

I've read that getting lead out of them can be a problem but if you do cases before depriming them it shouldn't be a problem.

[kokomokid]

moonie, lead plus tin equal solder and will stick to the case. If you have pure lead maybe?

[geargnasher]

Lead won't stick to "seasoned" brass. If it has a slight tarnish, you're fine. You only need to poke the first 1/8" of the neck into the lead anyway to "draw" the part you want to anneal anyhow. The color change isn't as apparent, so COUNT. Check your results with pliers by pinching the necks and seeing how much pressure it takes to deform them. When you notice a change, that's enough, you have your time established. Keep the pot temp constant and the timing consistent for that batch.

I dip in the pot, then quench just the neck in water for much of my rifle brass because I don't like the shoulders getting soft, and the quench stops the heat from migrating. Sling off the water and you're done.

Gear

[Blanket]

the rotate in the flame and quench method is what I have done for 40 years. You cannot hold onto the brass as the heat warms the base area long enough to cause it to anneal the base end of the case.

[plow]

I've heard of putting the case mouth side down on a hot plate; does that work?

[P.K.]

I've heard of putting the case mouth side down on a hot plate; does that work?

No, unless you have the Tim Allen special and can attain 1000 degree's. Check out the Feb. issue of Hanloader Magazine. Excellent article in there about this subject.

[desteve811]

At which stage do you anneal your brass? Before trimming?

[Unclenick]

Desteve811,

If it has started splitting or you think it will, you anneal before resizing to avoid further hardening and to reduce spring-back for more consistent neck tension. Resizing is when neck growth occurs as squeezed down brass flows forward, so trimming is done after sizing. Anneal, size, trim, in that order.


Typecaster,

You've got a good method if you are reading the colors correctly. The oxide stain should not go so far as to get dull, as that's a sign of overheating. You can get a 650°F Tempilstick crayon and start heating then mark the neck then keep heating until it melts. You can also get Tempilaq liquid form to apply before heating.

If you are unsure about the exact heat coloring, Fred Barker (Precision Shooting, July 1996) recommended a candle flame as it can't overheat within reason, which turns out to be limited by your fingertips. With that cooler flame, it takes longer to anneal and gives the heat time to get to your fingers. He suggested you keep rotating the neck and shoulder in the flame until it gets too hot to hold. He then slaps his against a damp towel to make it cool enough to handle again without submerging. If it's not wet inside you don't have to wait for it to dry.

The idea behind using water is to stop grain growth, but with metal as thin as a case neck air cools it off peak temperature so fast it's not likely to matter. The candle method does leave soot behind that you'll want to wipe off with steel wool or by tumbling.


Moonie,

Barker also advocated the lead method, but he dipped his necks in graphite before the lead to prevent soldering. He used the lead at 700°F to 750°F. If you use propane and a Tempilstick crayon or Tempilaq the temperature indicator used is selected a little lower because, by the time you see it melt and react to remove the case from the hotter flame, it's already overshot the melt temperature.

Barker points out a reason to avoid overheating is that, ironically, it can weaken the brass so much that it can crack within as few as three subsequent loadings. If you hear of folks annealing every three or four reloads because otherwise they get neck splits, then chances are they are getting the cases too hot.

[3006guns]

I've used the "hold in the fingers until warm" method for years and it works very well indeed. If there's one piece of advice I could give, it would be 'stop being so worried'! The brass will barely change color when you feel the warmth at the base, then just let it fall into the water.

Comment was made that the water is not necessary. Well, you anneal your way and I'll do it mine.....but I don't want any chance of the base getting overly warm so I feel my way is safer.

As a side note.....when I first tried annealing over thirty years ago, I placed a batch of deprimed .38 special in a shallow pie plate of water and heated the necks with a propane torch until they got RED hot then tipped them over. The result was a bunch of case necks so soft you could crush them between your fingers with no effort at all, so cartridge brass can get VERY soft!

[jmorris]

Comment was made that the water is not necessary. Well, you anneal your way and I'll do it mine.....but I don't want any chance of the base getting overly warm so I feel my way is safer.

This was my point above, hand methods vary too much from person to person. There are 100's of "methods" if you search for them. Most won't put you in danger, some will.

[BD]

I do all of mine by hand, holding the case in my fingers and turning it in the flame of a map gas torch until I just see the neck just turn dull red. For handgun and .223 I don't think you could hold it long enough to do damage. In a semi dark room it's pretty easy. For my purposes it works as the brass holds up and the groups are there.
BD

[BD]

I do all of mine by hand, holding the case in my fingers and turning it in the flame of a map gas torch until I just see the neck just turn dull red. For handgun and .223 I don't think you could hold it long enough to do damage. In a semi dark room it's pretty easy. For my purposes it works as the brass holds up and the groups are there.
BD