Limitations of the Lee Classic Loader

[Texantothecore]

I just started batch processing 150 rounds of 45-70 with the Lee Classic Loader and it is very quick. At least as fast as a single stage press. I normally do one full round at a time through bullet seating but this is working really well.

I am a bit surprised even though I have used my LCL for several years.

[W.R.Buchanan]

I wish we had a store like that place in Aus, here in the US. I looked around on their website and they have a bunch on nice stuff that I haven't seen over here.

I have never seen a FL case sizing die like those, I must have lead a sheltered life.

However that outfit has them in bastard calibers like .25-303?

Must be alot of Lee Loaders in AUS.

Now there is a whole new bunch of doodads I have to find for my reloading habit.

I do have one question? I thought everyone had to turn in their guns in AUS? Obviously this is not true but what is the real story?

Randy

Randy

[WilliamDahl]

I do have one question? I thought everyone had to turn in their guns in AUS? Obviously this is not true but what is the real story?

Coming to a country near you soon if the leftists have their way...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Australia

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com...ile_dundee.htm

Now, the official story was that Rodney William Ansell was "affected by amphetamine intoxication" and "convinced that Freemasons had kidnapped his two sons and were now stalking him". Judge for yourself... The government wouldn't lie to you, would they?

First comes registration, then comes confiscation...

From what I understand, there is a proliferation of wildcat cartridges in Australia due to government restriction of owning firearms in military calibers plus the fact that the military surplus rifles were easily available at that time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildcat_cartridge

In Australia, wildcat cartridges were relatively common. Most are made primarily for hunting species such as deer, kangaroo, are generally based on the .303 British because of the post war popularity of that round and of the cheap surplus Australian Lee-Enfield MkIII military rifles available. Many of these surplus rifles were rebarreled to .257 caliber, known as the 303-25. One of the unique features is that these cartridges relied less on handloading - and instead were offered as proprietary cartridges from gunsmiths.

Since having an existing barrel rebored and rechambered was (at that time) less expensive than fitting a new barrel, a 303-25 rifle with a shotout barrel could be economically converted to .277 caliber, known as the 303-270.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

Wow, can't belive this thread is still kicking. I ended up going with the Lee Hand Press so I could do some of my reloading in the livingroom without getting yelled at, but I still appreciate the simplicity of the Lee Loader. Maybe one will find its way into my ever growing box of reloading suupplies!

[Survival Bill]

Now if it would size your GC CB when you put in the boolet it would be just about the most perfect loader.
I have had one primer go off but I was in the mood to seat em with one whack were I usually do 2 whacks to seat em..... it went off like the cap guns you had as a kid not a big deal....

[bonza]

"I thought everyone had to turn in their guns in AUS? Obviously this is not true but what is the real story?"

No, it's not true at all, but it's a story that's been perpetuated in part by folks who really should know better (eg our own NRA, for example). Closer to the truth is that firearms ownership has been restricted in Australia for decades, but each state had it's own laws which varied widely, for example Tasmania allowed the ownership of full auto until about 17 years ago, while the Northern Territory, at one time, wouldn't allow the ownership of rifles that used factory loaded ammunition with a velocity of over 2000fps. At that time (1970s/80s) I lived in Australia & competed in Lever Action matches around the country, the folks from the N.T. could own a .45/70 (1300fps) but not a .22 rimfire magnum (2000fps)!
Anyway, after the shooting in Pt. Arthur, Tasmania, in the early 1990s firearms laws became more standardized, with certain classes of firearms being banned or restricted. Essentially semi-automatic rifles & semi automatic & pump action shotguns were banned (with certain exemptions available for farmers, etc.). The government instituted a 'buy back' were financial compensation was given for the turning in of the newly restricted classes of guns. Some of the prices given for guns was way above normal market value, & the result was most folks just turned around & took the money to their local gun store & bought better quality 'politically correct' firearms. Friends in Australia have told me that the number of guns in private hands has actually increased since the 'ban'.
As to the gun shops. I have lived in the U.S. for close to twenty years now, & have still to find a gun store equal to any that I went to in Australia as far as quantity & variety of stock on hand is concerned. This is especially true with reloading gear, & components.
Would I want to go back to Australia & live with their current gun laws? No thanks, I am very appreciative of the freedoms we have, for the most part, in this country. However, the shooting sports are alive & well in Australia despite opposition from certain groups in & out of the government (just like we have in this country).

[Catshooter]

I didn't read every response, but I didn't see anyone list the other potential drawback to the Lee; noise. If you need to reload quietly they aren't your friend.


Cat

[0verkill]

That's a good point for those that are used to working 3rd shift.

[Jkallen83]

i started with Lee Loaders because they were cheap and i was learning and this taught me what all was involved in reloading. I have a Lee Loader for all my rifles and some rifles i have 2 so i have a backup just in case. I load all my rifle ammo this way. its not that slow to me. i do have a single stage press that i think is SUPER slow, and i have a progressive for 9mm which is semi-auto guns, but rifles is Lee Loader only.

if you have a bolt-action rifle, and want to load cheap but excellent ammo, Lee Loaders are the way to go. i load the best ammo i have ever fired in my guns with Lee Loaders.

you WILL pop primers from time to time but its no big deal. but to prevent that and speed up the process, i now have a Lee Hand Primer. I deprime all my brass at once, then resize all at once, then prime them with the Lee Hand Primer, then powder and seat bullet.

i find the Lee Loader to be truly relaxing to me. sure i could get a press and crank out alot of ammo fast, but they wouldnt be any better than what i have now, and i wouldnt get the relaxation of loading by hand.

Limitations??? i guess the only limitation is when ur loading and realize u just ran out of primers, powder, or bullets to load lol.

[RobsTV]

The 45-70 round is one reason why I stopped using the Classic loader and moved to a press. Seems like it is designed to be used with jacketed. Sizing, flaring and seating resulted in shaved lead and poor accuracy with commercial Oregon Trail Laser-Cast .459 which was used before casting my own soft lead/tin for use in original 1884 BP Trapdoor (slugged .458). Forget about using with as cast lead. Even now, using a press and dies, still required the larger expander plug from Wolf's to properly size the case for lead.

[Jkallen83]

RobsTV, I load 45-70 with soft cast with Lee Loaders, i have a pair of needle nose pliers that i use to flare the case mouth, the die then wont go all the way down on the brass, but it does keep from shaving the bullet. when you seat the bullet, everything drives together then.
i have had no issues this way but u HAVE to flare the case mouth with soft lead cast or it will shave. its a simple fix to flare with needle nose pliers.

[Musket Man]

After reading several of these responses I think I already know part of my answer I am trying to find. Just to clarify though, if I am using a Lee Classic loader for a 30/06 then I will only be able to use those cartridges in my 1903 Springfield bolt action and not my M1 Garrand? The Garrand will need a full resize because it's an autoloader?

I hope I have not confused the dickens out of you with this question.

Thanks

[EDG]

The Garand will need a full resize because it's an autoloader? yes

[wonderwolf]

After reading several of these responses I think I already know part of my answer I am trying to find. Just to clarify though, if I am using a Lee Classic loader for a 30/06 then I will only be able to use those cartridges in my 1903 Springfield bolt action and not my M1 Garrand? The Garrand will need a full resize because it's an autoloader?

I hope I have not confused the dickens out of you with this question.

Thanks

If you fire the cartridges in the 03 then you can load those cartridges in your LL for your O3 but they should not be used in the garand. There is a chance they will chamber but I wouldn't bet on it.

If you take cases fired out of your Garand and try to load them with the LL most likely they will not function in your O3. Not so much because its an autoloader though that does play a part with it but more because it is simply a different chamber cut in a different gun. To get a good understanding a study of how your two rifles are on headspace and case growth after firing would need to be looked at. I have recently neck sized only brass that was fired out of a tight headspaced 1919 which is an auto loader and fired them through my savage 30-06 which does not close on a field headspace gauge. Its not something that you need be overly worried about if your not that into it but it does help to understand what safe practices are in relationship to reloading and what will produce reliable reloads.

In practice however I would FL size when able and only use the LL or other neck sizing options (like with the Lyman 310 dies) when taking brass fired from a bolt action or single shots where lock up is a all or none proposition.

[Musket Man]

If you fire the cartridges in the 03 then you can load those cartridges in your LL for your O3 but they should not be used in the garand. There is a chance they will chamber but I wouldn't bet on it.

If you take cases fired out of your Garand and try to load them with the LL most likely they will not function in your O3. Not so much because its an autoloader though that does play a part with it but more because it is simply a different chamber cut in a different gun. To get a good understanding a study of how your two rifles are on headspace and case growth after firing would need to be looked at. I have recently neck sized only brass that was fired out of a tight headspaced 1919 which is an auto loader and fired them through my savage 30-06 which does not close on a field headspace gauge. Its not something that you need be overly worried about if your not that into it but it does help to understand what safe practices are in relationship to reloading and what will produce reliable reloads.

In practice however I would FL size when able and only use the LL or other neck sizing options (like with the Lyman 310 dies) when taking brass fired from a bolt action or single shots where lock up is a all or none proposition.

I am going to throw out another statement and question at the same time. I am totally new to reloading. I had purchased a Lee Loader in 45-70 Government for my Trapdoor. It works wonderfully to load up my black powder cartridges for this old single shot. I saw that Lee had one for the 30-06, since I own a 1903 and M1 Garrand, I wondered if it would work as well as it did with my 45-70.

Full length sizing and neck sizing was two new terms for me in relation to what type firearm I was using them in. I've saved all my brass from my 03 and Garrand. What I have is a bucket of brass in my gun room all mixed together. Some I can tell what was extracted from my Garrand but most I cannot.

I went ahead and purchased a Lee Breech Single Stage Press and a set of carbide dies for the 30/06 Springfield. I have a full length sizing die and a neck sizing die as well. I would imagine it would be wise to go ahead and full length size all the brass and then make sure I keep them separate from now on before I reload them again? All my cartridges I've purchased through the CMP, 99% of it was Greek loaded, so this will be the first reload on these cases.

So back to the original thread, the Lee Classic Loader works great for my 45-70 that I only use in one firearm. Maybe not so great for my M1 Garrand lol.

I hope I haven't lost you guys in all my jibber jabber.

Thanks

[mdi]

For Garand loading I would suggest full length sizing (Full length sizing resizes the entire case back to original size. This is needed to insure good feeding/chambering in a semi-auto. Neck sizing only sizes the neck portion of a case and leaves the body the same size as the chamber it was fired in, or very close. Problematic for a semi-auto as a "fat" round could jam in the chamber and render the gun useless). Lee Loaders for rifle cartridges, cases, only neck size, which may or may not work for semi-auto use...

I would keep my bolt gun brass and my Garand brass separate, mainly because I count reloadings and F/L size my Garand brass but much of the time now, I'm full length sizing my bolt gun brass too...

[EDG]

You are no much of a hand loader if you cannot tell worn out brass from once fired.
Think about 1000 rounds of 30-06 USGI brass with crimped in primers.
The Lee tool is about worthless if your brass started out like that.

You hope it's once fired brass.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

Years later, I finally bought myself a Lee Loader. Picked up an older 357 set off of flea bay. They weren't kidding about considerable force to resize! I've got some new dents in the top of my workbench I'll try a little lube. Made a little scoop out of a 9mm case that throws 5 grains of Promo. I'm using an orange dead blow hammer from HF, but think I need the one with the hard plastic head. My Lee turret press cranks 357s out, but I still wanted one for some reason. Might give it to the teenage neighbor whose been talking about reloading for some time...

[mdi]

A Lee Loader normally needs some lube when sizing straight walled cases, or at least all of mine do. Sizing portion on the die is plain steel, not carbide so a bit of lube will make sizing easier. Some hold the die in their hand when sizing, but I use a lead ingot as an anvil. Much quieter and the lead does not soften the blow enough to matter. With an anvil a dead blow hammer works well. When hammering in a difficult to size case (44 Magnum) I often felt I was beating up the case head/rim, so I switched to a dead blow or softer face hammer/mallet.

I'm not a Lee Loader expert, I just really like them (but I also like my turret press and my Co-Ax). If you are looking for more info on Lee Loaders there are some really knowledgeable fellers here; https://www.lee-loader.com/index.php

[W.R.Buchanan]

I use a Sinclair Arbor Press or my Drill Press to run a Lee Loader. Lee Loaders are what is known as "Hand Dies" and that type of tool has been around since the beginning of Reloading. They were never meant to be used with a hammer, they were meant to be used with a small arbor press. Wilson Dies are more of the same but nicer and more expensive, and you should use the arbor press with them. A Drill Press works just like an Arbor Press and it won't hurt the drill press at all. I use my drill press in my shop to push in the roll pins that hold my Hand Presses together. Doesn't hurt it in the slightest. I didn't figure out using the Drill Press until later.

Lee just substituted the plastic mallet for the arbor press because the vast majority of people who want to reload don't have an arbor press. The plastic mallet worked fine for me for 30+ years until I fell into a little arbor press for $50. I use it for alot of things on the reloading bench.

For the life of me I really don't see why other companies who make reloading equipment haven't come out with Hand die sets like the Lee Tools. Lee has gotten more people into reloading their own ammo than any other outfit and I would extend that statement out to "all other outfits combined."

I always recommend people start with a Lee Loader so they can learn the process and not spend a ton of money doing it. if they like it they can buy more stuff. If they don't they can always sell the Lee Loader for what they've got into it.

Probably should just keep the hammer.

Randy