.38 wadcutter alloy

[ShooterAZ]

I have read that a softer alloy works better for this type of bullet and velocities. I ordered in some pure lead and some lino to experiment with. I'd like to try a 3-1 lino/lead mix to start for the .38 wadcutters. Would this alloy still be suitable in my .45ACP and mid velocity .44 loads, or would a 2-1 ratio be more appropriate for those types of loads?

Thanks...ShooterAZ

[Larry Gibson]

For the wad cutters I'd go with 20 - 80% Lino - lead. You can push that alloy upwards of 1100 fps which should work fine in your applications. The .45 handgun will need a smooth ramp for feeding though. "Harder" is not always "better", especially for what you want.

Larry Gibson

[Shiloh]

I use range scrap and WW 50/50 and they work fine. I'm strictly in the lower velocity range though.
With WW becoming scarce, goona go to range scrap only this spring. If they work, that'll be what I use.

Shiloh

[williamwaco]

For the wad cutters I'd go with 20 - 80% Lino - lead. You can push that alloy upwards of 1100 fps which should work fine in your applications. The .45 handgun will need a smooth ramp for feeding though. "Harder" is not always "better", especially for what you want.

Larry Gibson

Ditto!

[ShooterAZ]

Guys, I had a typo in my initial post. I meant 1 lino to 3 lead, or 1 to 2 for the .45
A 20 lino to 80 lead is 1 to four. Maybe I will try both and see how they work. Thanks for the input, and sorry for the typo.

Shooter

[runfiverun]

1 part lino to three lead will be a close approximation to ww's with a titch of tin.
for target loads 750 fps up through most midrange loads @ 1100 you could do with the 1-4 easily enough.

[ShooterAZ]

I will try the 1-3 first. Is there any issues with mold fill out with the 1-4?

[runfiverun]

nope you got enough tin, no issues.

[ShooterAZ]

Thanks...I am looking forward to casting and experimenting with softer boolits.

[John Boy]

3:1 Alloy
TIN ANTIMONY LEAD
3.00 9.00 88.00
TOTAL PERCENT 100.0
BHN OF MIX 17.75

2:1 Alloy
TIN ANTIMONY LEAD
2.67 8.00 89.33
TOTAL PERCENT 100.0
BHN OF MIX 16.33

Save your Linotype and use the 2:1 alloy. Hardness is not that much different which is greater than WW's

[ShooterAZ]

3:1 Alloy
TIN ANTIMONY LEAD
3.00 9.00 88.00
TOTAL PERCENT 100.0
BHN OF MIX 17.75

2:1 Alloy
TIN ANTIMONY LEAD
2.67 8.00 89.33
TOTAL PERCENT 100.0
BHN OF MIX 16.33

Save your Linotype and use the 2:1 alloy. Hardness is not that much different which is greater than WW's

I'm confused by this post... All I have right now is ingots of Linotype and ingots of pure lead. Can someone please do some "splaining"? Thanks!

[CeeHoo]

An old thread perhaps but thought not to start a new one with the same title.

Speaking of obturation and, on the other hand, potential risk of swaging down during seating, would it make any real difference between range scrap (mostly from jacketed 9x19mm) and air gun pellet lead if using one or the other as base alloy for soft .38 solid base wadcutters for the K-38, running about 820fps? I'm thinking to add just a little bit of tin to improve fill-out but thought to be a cheapskate on this. Would 40-1 be enough or should more tin be added?

As to risk of swaging down, the other day I noticed that this could happen very easily, at least with commercial HBWC. My RCBS expander plug measures .355" and when I pulled out a .358" Hornady 148gr HBWC, seated into a case expanded with this plug, the bullet now measured only .355"! Interestingly though, this kind of arrangement has caused very little leading in K-38 whose throats are in .358" range. I guess obturation of the hollow base corrects the issue. However, I have noticed some bullet tumbling which probably indicates the driving band remains more or less undersized. Accuracy about 2-3" with six shots at 25m.

As a countermeasure, I've ordered a couple of oversized (.356"-.359") expander plugs from a gunsmith so this may not be an issue in the future.

[M.A.D]

An old thread perhaps but thought not to start a new one with the same title.

Speaking of obturation and, on the other hand, potential risk of swaging down during seating, would it make any real difference between range scrap (mostly from jacketed 9x19mm) and air gun pellet lead if using one or the other as base alloy for soft .38 solid base wadcutters for the K-38, running about 820fps? I'm thinking to add just a little bit of tin to improve fill-out but thought to be a cheapskate on this. Would 40-1 be enough or should more tin be added?

As to risk of swaging down, the other day I noticed that this could happen very easily, at least with commercial HBWC. My RCBS expander plug measures .355" and when I pulled out a .358" Hornady 148gr HBWC, seated into a case expanded with this plug, the bullet now measured only .355"! Interestingly though, this kind of arrangement has caused very little leading in K-38 whose throats are in .358" range. I guess obturation of the hollow base corrects the issue. However, I have noticed some bullet tumbling which probably indicates the driving band remains more or less undersized. Accuracy about 2-3" with six shots at 25m.

As a countermeasure, I've ordered a couple of oversized (.356"-.359") expander plugs from a gunsmith so this may not be an issue in the future.

I make my own sizers and expander plugs, and they are a bees dick under ideal bullet size. I size my wadcutters to 358 ad my expander is 3575 . Mind you, All my cylinders have been opened up as well to be on .358

[6bg6ga]

I've shot straight lead and I've shot wheel weight alloy and no leading with either. My opinion here...it depends on proper diameter and speed. In excess of 1000 fps I use a harder alloy.

[Rich/WIS]

Confused by John Boy's post, the numbers seem wrong. If Lino is 84% PB, 12% SB and 4% SN the mix he shows will not give those numbers when mixed with pure lead. By my calculation 3:1 should be 96/4/1 and 2:1 should be 94+/4/1+. Haven't shot 38 in years but do shoot a lot of 45 ACP and have found straight range lead worked fine in both when properly sized and lubed and shot at target load velocities.

[Outpost75]

You can estimate the hardness of your blend easily:

LinoPounds(BHN22)+LeadPounds(BHN5) / TotalPounds = EstBHN

A 50-50 linotype-lead blend at 13.5 BHN is slightly softer than commercial hardball or Lyman No.2 alloy.
(22)+(5) /2 = 13.5

A 1:2 linotype-lead blend at "about 10.5 BHN" approximates 1:20 alloy and is well suited for revolver and black powder cartridge "smokeless" applications. (22)+2(5) /3 = 10.6 BHN

A 1:4 linotype-lead blend at 8.5 BHN approximates the hardness of 1:30 alloy and is best for black powder cartridges, in subsonic, smokeless revolver loads, or with plain based rifle bullets below 1300 fps and is satisfactory up to 1700 fps with gas checks in rifles for hollow-point hunting applications. (22)+4(5) /5 = 8.5 BHN

A 1:5 linotype-lead blend at 8 BHN approximates 1:40 alloy and is the frugal shooters best bang for the buck to make your alloy go far as possible in revolver, cowboy loads, black powder cartridge, and subsonic hollow-point hunting applications. (22)+5(5) / 6 = 8 BHN

[Echo]

Confused by John Boy's post, the numbers seem wrong. If Lino is 84% PB, 12% SB and 4% SN the mix he shows will not give those numbers when mixed with pure lead. By my calculation 3:1 should be 96/4/1 and 2:1 should be 94+/4/1+. Haven't shot 38 in years but do shoot a lot of 45 ACP and have found straight range lead worked fine in both when properly sized and lubed and shot at target load velocities.

John Boy has the right numbers, just in reverse order, or something Three-to-one Lino/Pb will give the numbers he shows, not reverse Pb/lino. Samo for 2 to 1...

[gwpercle]

Elmer Keith suggested 1 part tin to 20 parts lead for all light and normal pressure loads .
That's in chapter 4 " Sixgun Cartridges and Loads " .
I'm no good with numbers so somebody else needs to calculate how much linotype and lead that works out to .
The boolits do not need to be hard to be accurate .
Gary

[greenjoytj]

Rotometals Linotype Alloy 4%-Tin, 12%-Antimony, and 84%-Lead BHN 22
If you added and equal amount of pure lead then the tin and antimony content in the batch of alloy would be cut in half, so you would now have 2% tin, 6% Antimony and 92% lead.
I think you will need to buy some pure Tin.
Lyman 2 alloy 5% tin, 5% Antimony and 90% lead BHN 16.

[bmortell]

when I tried pure lead 38 wadcutters in a snub they were skidding/smearing rifling, idk whats the proper term. I went to 2% antimony and water dropped. for something not meant for expanding on game I don't worry much about tin, if it casts ok then its good enough.