L1A1 Fal Load for Lee C312-155-2R Workup

[Monkymate]

After my success with the FR-8 I read up more on here, The FAL Files and in my books on a load for my L1A1 FAL with iron sights only. Information seems to be pretty scarce. I had several powders to play with with the goal of a 2000-2100 fps lead load that would also cycle the bolt and not lead up the barrel or gas system.

Bullets were cast Wheel Weight Water Dropped from Lee C312-155-2R mold. Hardness is 20 BHN by Lee tester after 1 week curing. All are gas checked with aluminum gas checks and sized to .309 with a Lee sizing die.. Weight with lube check and bullet was 155grains.

Lube was 45/45/10 with 2 light coats.

COAL was brought down to 2.650 so that the bullets would feed. There were marks on the bullet where it engaged the lands at that length. Any longer and it would sometimes hang when loaded from the magazine by pulling the bolt back and letting it fly.

Powders I tried: (all powders were dropped from Lee Dippers) Weight was verified on the scale and a business card used to swipe the tops of the dippers.) A

All of the shots were at 25 yards in 5 round groups for each powder level. Gas system set at 0 (Max gas to the piston)

Alliant 2400 at 17/21/25 grains, Dippers 1.3/1.6/1.9cc's - Best group was 2.2". The action NEVER cycled as expected with a fast burning powder. Just had to try it to see for myself.

IMR 4227 at 20/24 grains, Dippers 1.6/1.9cc's - This had a .55" group (Best group of all the loads I tried). Action NEVER cycled as expected.

H4198 at 25/30 grains, Dippers 1.9/2.2cc's - The best group was 1.7". Action cycled 2 out of 5 rounds very weakly and only with the 30 grain loads.

H4895 at 26/30 grains, Dippers 1.9/2.2cc's - This had the second best group at the 30 grain level. It was .7". Action cycled every shot at 26 grains it was weak and had one jam. At 30 grains it ejected about 8-10 feet and had no problems. This is my starting point for now.

Varget - 30 grains Dipper 2.2cc - Acted like the 4895 30 grain load as expected. Started with a good group and had a flyer (probably me) that opened it from .8 to 1.4".

So I stopped there after 50 bullets and checked the bore and gas system. Bore was clean and the gas system was just starting to maybe get some lead dust/fouling on it. easy to clean off using a green pot scrubber. I leave the gas systems perfectly dry and never lube them. Seem to have less problems that way.

Anybody else done this and worked up a load for a FAL? There are lots of reports of leading the gas system but those have been on DSA, and Metric FAL's which have the gas port drilled 90 degrees to the barrel. The L1A1 is drilled at an angle from the rear of the gun towards the front. This appears to not shave lead into the gas system like the DSA and the Metrics do.

I plan on loading up 100 of the H4895 30 grain loads and shoot them over the Chrono and check the gas system and barrel further.

[rodsvet]

I'm very interested as I have that Lee mold and an FAL. Please keep us posted as to your results. Thank, Rod

[HARRYMPOPE]

my metric FAL shoots well with 30g of 4895 but the gas plug and piston gets so plated with lead i dont shoot cast in it anymore.I'd be curious how yours does after some shooting.i could barely remove the plug after 2-300 rounds.I also used aluminum checks and bullets were water dropped and at 20-22 BHN.With the 155 Lee and the SAECO #315 it would shoot under 2" much of the time at 100 yards with a 6X scope and was reliable.With all loads tried i always get a shot or two high that ruin an otherwise small group.i tried fillers and the load actually shot worse.i shot it in the Cast Bullet Association 2011 Washington state championship and came middle of the pack among military class.For the match i used a non functioning load of 18.5 of H110 so i wouldn't have to chase brass.

George

attached is a 10 shot target from the match with the rotten high shot that plagued me throughout the mach.

[Monkymate]

George,
What type of FAL did you shoot? Was it a Metric or Inch? Barrel original or US replacement?

The reason I ask is because I didn't see enough lead on the gas plug to be that bad after 50 shots and from my experience with 2 SKS's (Yugo and Chinese) I would see leading in the Chinese but not the Yugo and it would show up pretty quick. I think there may be enough differences in the FAL's that maybe some of them can run cast.

I hope that it doesn't lead up because I do not want to have to shoot it with the plug reversed as a single shot. Can't afford to shoot many jacketed rounds.

Greg

[HARRYMPOPE]

metric Imbel upper with Argentine parts i believe.here is the plug and piston after 200 or so rounds.It never jammed though.My Saiga 308s gas system has no problems handing the same cast load probably due to the AKs looser tolerance.It shoots betetr than the FAL by quite bit though.

[Monkymate]

So you had the straight drilled gas port and not the angled one. That might be part of the problem. It may be shaving lead into the system.

[Larry Gibson]

I've put lots of 311299s over 28 gr 4895 with a 1/2 gr dacron filer through a FN/FALs without any leading, with 100% functioning and good accuracy. It was Belgian FN/FAL.

Larry Gibson

[HARRYMPOPE]

The lead coating is powdery also with a few shavings.Goes to show you that some will do it and some wont.Others have had the same problems i have had and others have not.i fired about 1500 rounds in three months out of the thing.Just traded it off today in fact.

[Monkymate]

Mine is a Century early build L1A1 with an Imbel receiver. I can shoot 2 MOA at 100 yards all day with surplus ammo and iron sights. It is one of my never sell guns along with my Ruger Frontier w/Leopold 2.5 LER scope in 308 and my FR-8 in 308.

After I started reloading and then casting my 308 price came down and I sold off all of my 7.62x39 guns (SKS and a Century Mauser conversion) and my stash of 7.62x39 surplus I had. I am now building up a stash of 308 and making very accurate loads with cast along with the "bonded" cast bullets for hunting.

[HARRYMPOPE]

Mine is a Century early build L1A1 with an Imbel receiver. I can shoot 2 MOA at 100 yards all day with surplus ammo and iron sights. It is one of my never sell guns along with my Ruger Frontier w/Leopold 2.5 LER scope in 308 and my FR-8 in 308.

After I started reloading and then casting my 308 price came down and I sold off all of my 7.62x39 guns (SKS and a Century Mauser conversion) and my stash of 7.62x39 surplus I had. I am now building up a stash of 308 and making very accurate loads with cast along with the "bonded" cast bullets for hunting.

The SAECO #315 shot better than the Lee in my FAL. its worth trying if you can get your hands on a few.My FAL also shot 2MOA with ball and sometimes under 1.5" with handloads and good hunting bullets.They are good rifles but i got bored with it so i traded it off.And really my Saiga 308 is a just bit more accurate.

George

[Monkymate]

Well I took out the 100 rounds of the best shooting combo. (4895 30 grains load from above).

Chrono was with me this time. I was off on my top end and it is only going about 1850fps.

After the first 10 shots over the chrono I had the 10 left in that mag and 4 other mags loaded with 20 rounds each lined up on the bench. I put out a reactive target block at 25 yards and danced it around the range trying to keep shooting it even when it is moving.

Accuracy was not a problem. On the 1st mag I had the gas set at 2 and had 2 failures to eject all the way. I pu the gas back down at 0 and no more problems with that and the brass went 8-10 feet.

Went through the 100 rounds fairly quickly and then let it cool to see what the gas system looked like. I was able to pull the plug (mine is always a little hard to remove anyway and it seemed a little tighter.

The plug had one area where there looked like a smear on the face of it and the rest looked like lead dust that came off fairly easy. Used a dry copper chore boy scrubber and it all came off easy.

Piston had some powder on the face of it too and it cleaned up the same way. I then ran a chore boy wrapped brush down the gas system tube and it had some small flakes on it and the cotton pad had some lead dust on it.

I then used the proper size drill bit to clean the gas system hole and it was fairly easy to run through. I had never done this and most of the blockage (slight) was carbon fouling and a little lead mixed in.

All in all I am pleased except the speed. Going to change powders to 4350 which I had good luck with in the FR-8 and see if I can't get up to 2000-2100.

[armoredman]

Thank you, that is exactly the info I was looking for if I get the FAL I have been looking at...

[Max Brand]

Interesting info and thanks for posting your findings. I have been looking for a good starting load for my HK-91 and your 30 grain Varget load looks like a good one if it will cycle the bolt if not I'll start bumping the powder up a bit.

[LowPE]

My pet load for my M1A of 21.5 grains of 2400 driving a saeco 315 will function the bolt fully on my FAL with excellent accuracy.

I also use an rcbs x-die to make reloading as painless as possible.